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  1. #40
    Join Date
    Mar 2003
    Location
    PA/DE area
    Posts
    1,535
    If something happens if there is a fire,condensate leak who would cover it? We can't since we didn't supply it and your homeowner might not be too happy.I going to Outback and ask them "How much to cook my steak?"I brought it and I am looking to save some $$$ I just want a PRO to cook it.
    It's NOT the BRAND,it's the company that installs it!!!!!

  2. #41
    Join Date
    Aug 2004
    Location
    Minnesota
    Posts
    349
    When it comes to warranty, the one with the most discretion is the dealer. You may have trouble getting a dealer to warranty a furnace that has not been installed by a legitimate professional.
    White Bear Township, Minnesota
    www.summitheating.com

  3. #42
    Join Date
    Jun 2000
    Location
    WYO
    Posts
    2,019
    I wonder if you can buy a house online and have some guys on the side install it?
    never say never

  4. #43
    Join Date
    Feb 2004
    Posts
    451
    Quote Originally Posted by jrongo View Post
    Did any of you read my 2nd post in this thread before you commented on the original? Clearly, many did not. Also, I asked if the idea was reasonable or to risky. Clearly, the voiding of the warranty turns out to be enough to kill off the whole concept. I figured 100 an hour was a fair labor rate if I were going to pay someone to put in a system for me (and we would touch base about what he would need to do the install before hand, common sense, planning...) As for the guy who called me cheap...please, that kind of talk is simply silly, you do not know a thing about me other than what I have typed on some website. Do you feel better that you typed with a sharp nails. I have a quote for you: "before you criticize someone, walk a mile in their shoes...that way you are a mile from them and have their shoes"
    And as for getting only hacks to come my way that is somehow my fault, my goodness...
    I am choosing who update / change my system based 100% on the information I have read on this very site. So you might want to reconsider why I have been getting 2nd rate installers coming my way. A 2nd thank you to those who convinced me is a reasonable manner that the internet idea was not worth the risk.
    First off NO PRICING! Maybe you should take the time to read the forum rules. No one cares what your going to pay side-job Willie for your e-hack system.

    But I'm sure you got the information off this site on how to find a contractor.

    I can't imagine why hacks keep coming to my house....I told them I bought the unit from ebay.
    Before you criticize someone, walk a mile in their shoes...that way you are a mile from them and have their shoes

  5. #44
    Join Date
    Jan 2008
    Posts
    56
    Quote Originally Posted by neophytes serendipity View Post
    You sir, are part of the problem.

    Smart contractors will not reveal any sizing info until there is a deposit.

    Smart contractors can make a reasonable educated guess regarding equipment sizing to provide those "many quotes" you will be getting in the coming months. Truthfully, there isn't much of a price difference +/- 1/2 ton of cooling or +/- 20k btu's.... unless the size change alters linesets, flues, etc.
    And yet smart consumers won't contract with someone who can't size the system and commit on paper.

  6. #45
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    Location
    18951
    Posts
    1,593
    Quote Originally Posted by the_beast View Post
    note I'm not here to start a flame tread but last week we install a bosh tank less water heater and guess ? it was bought on ebay.

    this is how we end up knowing since the unit was not firring on demmand...


    call technical support prove we where not home owner hack...


    after a long time period we got true the tech.

    i was ready and made all my test. pressure and all....then it came to this portion of the quiz where was the unit purchased ? customer not here at this moment cant answer....


    at the end of the conversation the tech. says to me and my dad return the unit it make take more then a week... this is without knowing where the unit was bout from we add the invoice but could read the name since it was and writhing...

    later...
    over the phone with the customer.



    you need to call the Bosch co. and tell the claim number such


    and the next day the customer call us no luck it was purchased on ebay not true a dealer and it hand up to be more costly to him and hi could ave this customer post I'm 99.9% sure i will....


    i will never warranty performance on appliance i dint sale and it dose happen

    so its your call... even direct buy or are dealer ave appliance not right but at least if we supplied we take the rap for it... just to let you no go cheaper is all about do you feel lucky or are you........
    I hope you were getting paid by the hour, and that you charged them for all the talking on the phone to the company and also to the customer.

  7. #46
    Join Date
    Jun 2005
    Location
    Near Chicago, IL
    Posts
    3,317
    Quote Originally Posted by gator8 View Post
    And yet smart consumers won't contract with someone who can't size the system and commit on paper.
    True, but providing a professional presentation could overcome a lot of that.

    There are a more opportunities for a homeowner to use the information to install his own properly sized equipment, or for the low bid guy to skim some info, resulting in a lost job for the contractor that tried to do it right.

    Load calculations can be provided when a deposit is given, or as a separate item that may/may not be credited towards the job.

    There is a difference between a 3 line item "bid/estimate" and a comprehensive proposal.

  8. #47
    Join Date
    Feb 2005
    Location
    cincinnati ohio
    Posts
    2,024

    online

    This guy is doin what alot of homeowners are doing ! And he will get it installed one way or another ! If they couldnt get it installed they wouldnt be internet sales ! I have seen this in my area and he can save alot of money ! Last one I saw the guy saved a $ 1000 dollars . If everyone is against it why not post the companys names here and put some pressure on the manufactures selling to them ? Otherwise your just tooting your own horn with useless opinions !
    My avatar is a picture of a Goodman Silencer .....These were commonly used in Goodman country ....Photos by hvac tech ( PaysonHVAC )

  9. #48
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    Location
    18951
    Posts
    1,593
    I'd really like to hear from anyone who bought their own equipment (from anyplace, but especially online), and hired someone they didn't already know to do the install. Would they do it again?

  10. #49
    Join Date
    Jan 2004
    Location
    PA
    Posts
    68,789
    That would not be a good poll.

    Not a broad enough comparison.
    Contractor locator map

    How-to-apply-for-Professional

    How many times must one fix something before it is fixed?

  11. #50
    Join Date
    Jun 2007
    Location
    The Twilight Zone
    Posts
    2,964
    Quote Originally Posted by everythingair View Post
    If you buy a steak and pay someone else to cook it for you and that steak is not cooked to your satisfaction; who is going to wind up eating it?
    I would still eat the steak.

  12. #51
    Join Date
    Jun 2007
    Location
    The Twilight Zone
    Posts
    2,964
    Quote Originally Posted by bobb25 View Post
    I'd really like to hear from anyone who bought their own equipment (from anyplace, but especially online), and hired someone they didn't already know to do the install. Would they do it again?
    I did this, Bob.

    I bought a 3-ton Goodman GSH14 heat pump from a contracting company that sells direct to the public. Not an internet site. I drove to his warehouse and picked up the system. The contractor provides the 10 year parts warranty. He is an A-1 rated supplier on Goodman's website.

    I was able to speck out exactly what I wanted. I went with the 14 because of the Copeland scroll compressor. I got a 14 SEER/12 EER/9 HSPF (excellent performance numbers), a full 3 tons of cooling and heating btus, 3-speed fan in the air handler (you can keep that v-s motor), TXV, 15 kw strips, by-pass humidifier, and condenser mounting pad.

    My wife works for a property management company so I paid their pro to install the system as a regular job, not a side job. This company provided a 1 year labor warranty.

    I saved almost the current year number in dollars compared to a Trane 14i quote. The system works great and "yes", I would indeed do it again.

    Take care.

  13. #52
    Join Date
    Mar 2006
    Location
    Delaware
    Posts
    448
    This is an unbiased response, to the best of my ability:

    Whenever I've priced equipment online, including shipping, it's ALWAYS been significantly more expensive than procuring it locally (provided you do your homework, have a license, etc.) So, the cost advantage just isn't there.

    Then there's support. Who's going to take care of this, should something go amiss? It may not be likely, but it does happen, and if you don't have someone willing to cover it, that also eliminates any cost advantage. Not to mention, how careful is someone willing to be when they barely can make any money on it?

    If you REALLY want to get what you want, get an itemized quote. I've done this and it helped weed out the guys who wanted to screw me. I do realize these installs require skilled labor, and am willing to pat fair market rate for it, as I will for equipment. Now, I have installed equipment myself (got a license), but often simply don't have the time! So, be respectful of the trade, and remember, you get what you pay for, including the effort to screen contractors!!

    In the big picture, you need to ask yourself, what are you saving?

    Quote Originally Posted by jrongo View Post
    I know what kind of reaction I am going to get but I will ask the question anyway…

    I have done the math a few times and if I buy a heat pump, coil and TXV online from a bulk supplier and have it delivered to my home and then pay a HVAC professional a 1 day “labor” fee to hook it all up and test it, I save money.

    The math is in my area is tough to argue against. I would put the math on the post but I know the no price policy.

    Is buying from an online supplier similar to jumping from a plane with only the pull shoot? They seem to claim the same manufacture warranties, can they make that claim?
    EBay has some rather wonderful prices as do others.

    As for a system “match ups” I hope to have a very good idea of what will work, from the many quotes I will be getting over the next 2 months”

    FYI: So far the people I have spoken to are willing to install new equipment “right away” – NO ONE has said, “look if you want to do this right we need to do a manual J calc.” Or “Why do you want to go with a set up like that…? we need to calculate heat load and check out other variables 1st” – you get the basic idea

    I did have one guy say, you won’t get the true seer out of a unit over 15 SEER without a VS blower, but that was the insightful comment I have heard.

    I am not looking to take the food off of anyone’s table but if I can save money and the techs I am speaking to are not going to crunch the real numbers, what’s the point?

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