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  1. #14
    Join Date
    Mar 2007
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    NW AR
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    2,478
    Quote Originally Posted by bootlen View Post
    Ask God to teach you and then read Scripture for yourself. If what they preach does not jive, find out why. If the answer does not jive, find another church. Let Scripture interpret Scripture.
    Good advice. My problem is that I cant seem to put the Hustler down long enough to read anything else.

  2. #15
    Join Date
    May 2002
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    9,564
    Quote Originally Posted by jrbenny View Post
    Would that be the manuscripts that omitted John 8:1-11 because it taught grace? Many in the early church wanted to abandon the concept of grace. They took a very hard stance against sin and the sinful nature of man. Rather than preach grace, they preached a strict living.
    No. The earlier manuscripts don't contain that information because John never wrote it. The later manuscripts have that content because someone added it some 400 years later than the original. I suppose you have to distinguish between what years constituted "early" and justify how it would appear "later".

    Do you think John sat back in his chair in the first century contemplating the concept of grace? I'd say that wasn't why he wrote the book. The book is really called "According to John" and John didn't write that.

    I'll give you this much: John 21:25 Jesus did many other things as well. If every one of them were written down, I suppose that even the whole world would not have room for the books that would be written.

    Therefore, it's possible that Jesus did what was written down later. However, since it's origin isn't in the early manuscripts you have to take any authenticity with the appropriate amount of doubt.

  3. #16
    Join Date
    Jan 2007
    Location
    Charm City--the city that bleeds
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    2,790
    With regard to
    too many churches preaching at people, preaching something different
    I would say that Romans 12:3 deals with this in a manner that may be elusive to some. Each preacher is led by some spirit, or by the Holy Spirit to preach on a particular idea. Not all ideas are Godly. We are admonished to test the spirits, to see if they are of God.

    But perhaps for many folks, it just doesn't hit home like a rifle shot. It just seems like a shotgun blast, kinda random and painful to some arbitrarily.

    Don't get me wrong. There are so many false prophets and worldly wisdoms that are passed off as being the "true gospel" that it would be nearly impossible to chronicle them all.

    But as for those which are enthusiastic, or inspired, you might say, then it must be recognized that each idea will not resonate with every person every week. We're just not always receptive or ready every time Pastor So-and-So opens his mouth.
    Kinda like the parable of the good seed. Many of the types of soils have a direct impact on the outcome.

    But back to Romans 12:3--...God has given a measure of faith to each. Now let us not think more highly of ourselves than we ought!
    It's great to be alive and pumping oxygen!

  4. #17
    Join Date
    May 2002
    Posts
    9,564
    "....We're just not always receptive or ready every time Pastor So-and-So opens his mouth. Kinda like the parable of the good seed. Many of the types of soils have a direct impact on the outcome. "

    Can you explain that a bit more?

  5. #18
    Join Date
    Jan 2007
    Location
    Charm City--the city that bleeds
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    Quote Originally Posted by sysint View Post
    "....We're just not always receptive or ready every time Pastor So-and-So opens his mouth. Kinda like the parable of the good seed. Many of the types of soils have a direct impact on the outcome. "

    Can you explain that a bit more?
    Was really responding to this by air311 --
    That's exactly why a lot of people don't get it. There's to many churches preaching at people, all preaching something different. If they were all preaching the word of god, wouldn't they all have the same message? And who wants to be told they're going to hell by someone who will be leading the way.
    IMO it comes close to a form of hyper-Calvinism that eliminates anyone saying anything, in this case, about sin, because God is going to do what He is going to do, and it has nothing to do with the will of those involved, only God's will. Now just to make a point about the apparent logic in his quote, can we say anything to people without being judgmental?

    So on the flip side of what I take to be air311's approximate point, I think we can make judgments without being judgmental in that we can preach against a sin and rely on God for the results in the hearts of men and women hearing it.

    That much said, on any given day when a gathering of folks hear a message, which could be about any given sin, many of those present may not have the heart which receives the Word in such a way as to produce eternal fruit. Some hearts may be of the stony soil, or others of a heart with the cares of the world choking out the Word (weeds), etc. I just meant to say that perhaps during the ebb and flow of life and months and bills and heartaches and so on that a message won't permeate our hearts unless we hear it more than once, or even more than a few times over the course of time.
    Maybe that is why air311, and some others from whom we hear time to time think that there are "so many messages"--there are a variety of places of the heart in which we show up to church, so to speak.
    It's great to be alive and pumping oxygen!

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