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  1. #14
    Join Date
    May 2005
    Location
    Lubbock Texas
    Posts
    769
    The last round of testing we did with the DoD showed that up to 50% of the biologics made it through a pleated merv 13 filter. So what does that tell you? Filters are a great start, if you want to see better measurable results its going to take something else to supplement the filter in the system.

  2. #15
    Join Date
    Feb 2008
    Location
    Waffleville
    Posts
    10,339
    you seem to know a heck of alot about his stuff. what do you know about indoor coil cleaners?? i clean my coil often, but cannot stand the smell of that cleaner. i also get complaints from home owners about the fragrance. i mix it much less than the label on the bottle for that reason and still get complaints. does it really remove anything from the coil? my indoor coil is in the crawl space, so lately i have just been dragging the water hose under and spraing it down. no smell afterwards
    If Guns Kill People, Do Pencils Misspell Words?

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=An2a1...eature=related

    Before we work on artificial intelligence why don't we do something about natural stupidity?

  3. #16
    Join Date
    May 2005
    Location
    Lubbock Texas
    Posts
    769
    The best cleaner for indoor coils is HD Calgon. Its the only thing that will cut cigarette smoke and tar build up. Mix as per instructions I think its 5 to one. The odor usualy doesn't last long during a/c season because the condensate will flush it off.

  4. #17
    Join Date
    Feb 2008
    Location
    Waffleville
    Posts
    10,339

    Lightbulb

    that may be part of my trouble. when i find a coil that is very caked up i usually put in heat, during the summer, and dry it out and start with a brush. that really knocks all the heavy crud of well.

    thanks i will pick some up this week and give it a try.
    If Guns Kill People, Do Pencils Misspell Words?

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=An2a1...eature=related

    Before we work on artificial intelligence why don't we do something about natural stupidity?

  5. #18
    Join Date
    May 2005
    Location
    Lubbock Texas
    Posts
    769
    Look at my FAQ on my web site when you get time. There are some good facts there that might answer future concerns on what technologies you want to choose.

  6. #19
    Join Date
    Aug 2004
    Location
    North Richland Hills, Texas
    Posts
    14,914
    Quote Originally Posted by genesis View Post
    beach you residential guys think small. In my business we have to show results in IAQ and document them.
    In your business, the customers have requirements they have to meet and document, so will fork over the dough to meet those requirements.

    In residential, homeowners cry about the cost of a $60 filter they only have to replace once a year, and you would think you were steeling their retirement fund from the way they wail about the cost of a replacement bulb for a good UVGI.

    The same customer that raves about how much lower their utilities are, how much cleaner the air is, and how much they are saving on doctors visits and allergy/asthma meds since we put in the new HVAC system, is pitching a fit over the cost of a once a year replacement filter media 5 minutes later when we bring them the invoice for changing it....
    Last edited by mark beiser; 02-20-2008 at 05:00 AM.
    If more government is the answer, then it's a really stupid question.

  7. #20
    Join Date
    Apr 2004
    Posts
    7,680
    As far as live stuff like virus, bacteria, and mold spores go, I belive you should consider a UV light. If those are your concerns, I would suggest 2 lights, one in the plenum to "wash the coil" in light and one on the inlet side of the filter.

    Viruses will be knocked out just flying by the UVC light. Bacteria could get by, but by catching it and mold spores as they slow down on the filter or coil, they too will be eliminated. I would match that with some low pressure drop filter media like a spaceguard.

    Your annual costs would be changing the bulbs and filters once or a couple times. At some point you will see there is a cost associated with solving these issues, and I guess it comes down to which is more important?

    I have UV lights and a electronic air filter and I'm pretty confident that I've done my best to keep my house protected from any virus, mold or bacteria, but what do I know, Im no scientist.

  8. #21
    Join Date
    Aug 2002
    Location
    Office and warehouse in both Crystal River & New Port Richey ,FL
    Posts
    18,836
    Quote Originally Posted by beachtech View Post
    far as i know the only people that are claiming to kill airborne germs are the UV light crowd. all the air cleaning systems you mention are designed to filter air. so they capture particals in the air and store these particals until cleaned. i really don't see any manufacturer or competent dealer claiming to kill substances in the air. WAY TOO MUCH LIABILITY!! i wouldn't even put my neck out there on that one!! especially here in NC with all the moisture issues.
    Carrier claims ,capture and kill,safer when you change the filter.

  9. #22
    Join Date
    Jul 2006
    Location
    Virginia
    Posts
    4,512
    the trane website says a new study shows that the clean effects kills the flu virus

  10. #23
    Join Date
    Feb 2008
    Location
    Waffleville
    Posts
    10,339
    rotflmao post the link to that site!!!
    If Guns Kill People, Do Pencils Misspell Words?

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=An2a1...eature=related

    Before we work on artificial intelligence why don't we do something about natural stupidity?

  11. #24
    Join Date
    Feb 2008
    Location
    Waffleville
    Posts
    10,339
    Quote Originally Posted by genesis View Post
    Look at my FAQ on my web site when you get time. There are some good facts there that might answer future concerns on what technologies you want to choose.
    this guy knows his stuff
    If Guns Kill People, Do Pencils Misspell Words?

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=An2a1...eature=related

    Before we work on artificial intelligence why don't we do something about natural stupidity?

  12. #25
    Join Date
    Mar 2002
    Location
    Concord, CA
    Posts
    2,633
    Quote Originally Posted by docholiday View Post
    Viruses will be knocked out just flying by the UVC light.
    If someone else was saying it I would not have paid any attention. However, I'm having a hard time believing that you believe that. Viruses can theoretically fly about by themselves. But they mostly fly around on host particles. One-fifth to (optimistically speaking) one-half second of exposure just isn't going to cut it. Sterilize a stationary coil? Sure. But sterilize a moving air stream of viruses? That’s a hard pill to swallow.

    I won't debate you Doc. I'm just asking for what convinced you. I'm as tired of those kinds of debates as anyone.

  13. #26
    Join Date
    May 2005
    Location
    Lubbock Texas
    Posts
    769
    Iracible you are dead on. A virus has to have a host. The only way to get a viable virus airborne is to disperse it in an aerosol form. That is what we call weaponized. The DoD recently did this to Staph and a few other things we can't talk about and ran it through our equipment. A virus just doesn't have much of a life span in the open air. It doesn't take much UVGI to deactivate it because it is so small compared to a mold spore.

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