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  1. #1
    Join Date
    Feb 2011
    Posts
    42

    Johnson FEC's going offline with fault light and stop executing their program???

    I have some FECs that are at version 6.1 and they keep faulting out, going offline, and wont execute their programming. The network is in good shape and I only have this issue with the FECs. There are VAV controllers on the same network and they do not do this. This would leave me to believe its a problem with the controllers themselves. I've seen this problem with power outages and the controllers getting "stuck" but you upgrade them to 6.1 and it seems to fix the issue. Does anyone have any insight to this problem??

    Thanks

  2. #2
    Join Date
    May 2011
    Location
    North Carolina
    Posts
    314
    What capacity are you at with the program size? I have had this happen with controllers that were at or pushing max recommended capacity. If you are much over 85% capacity then that is most likely it. I had the same issue with a PCG that I was at 90%. Went to a PCA and the problem was solved. If you power cycle does it come back online for a period of time?

  3. #3
    Join Date
    Feb 2011
    Posts
    42
    The controllers are @ 65% so there should be no issue there. If I cycle the power the controllers will come back online for a while or a day. I have found that this is a issue Johnson fixed with a patch a couple months ago so I'm going to try that and see what happens. I guess if controllers lost power they wouldn't always boot back up and fail. Its just strange because the fan will run and appear to controlled but the CHW valve will not. It just closes. If it failed on a reboot I would think it would execute any programming.

  4. #4
    Join Date
    May 2011
    Location
    North Carolina
    Posts
    314
    Quote Originally Posted by dhoyt View Post
    The controllers are @ 65% so there should be no issue there. If I cycle the power the controllers will come back online for a while or a day. I have found that this is a issue Johnson fixed with a patch a couple months ago so I'm going to try that and see what happens. I guess if controllers lost power they wouldn't always boot back up and fail. Its just strange because the fan will run and appear to controlled but the CHW valve will not. It just closes. If it failed on a reboot I would think it would execute any programming.
    That's the same symptoms I had. I was like half the program was running but other parts were not. A brief power glitch will sometimes cause the controller not to reboot at all or not properly. I would put a monitor on the incoming power of that controller and see if you can see any hiccups. Now that you mention it I do recall on the FX side a message about power interruptions and the controllers not rebooting properly.

  5. #5
    Join Date
    Feb 2011
    Posts
    42
    There a most definitely power hiccups and just plain outages all the time I don't even have to monitor it. The power here is not reliable. These are older controllers also. We basically came in and threw IOMs on them, ran new network to a new NAE and downloaded them with a new program. There are other FECs that we never touched that don't have this problem. I did hear that there is a patch for CCT 10 that takes care of this rebooting issue.. I downloaded the controllers yesterday, just have to wait and see if it works...

  6. #6
    Join Date
    Apr 2014
    Posts
    18
    There is a known issue with a certain date range where short power interruptions of less than 225 ms will cause the controller to lock up. The work around is to replace the controller or install a time delay on relay on the incoming power to hold the power off during a glitch to longer than 225 ms.
    You said these are old controllers and the problem just started when you added IOM's, so it isn't a perfect fit. Does it seem to be points on the IOM that are not controlling properly? Does the main code match on all off the IOM's and controllers?

  7. #7
    Join Date
    Feb 2011
    Posts
    42
    I went last week and got all of the controllers up to the latest version (10) including all the boot and the main codes for the FECs and the IOMs. Before that they didn't match.... I got an email this morning saying that some on the units did it again. I checked the event viewer on that NAE and it showed those two controllers going on and offline with in a couple secs about a hundred times... Im thinking maybe that 225 ms power interruption could be happening. Certainly seems possible from the looks of that. I found this on Johnsons Technical Portal about what looks to be the same issue...

    ((Problem:
    My CCT application downloads and initially controls, but eventually the controller locks up and the fault light is on solid. I cannot communicate with the device to download.
    Error Message:
    Alert message; Please select a different device, or a different connection point to access this device.
    Cause:
    The VFD on one of the analog outputs is introducing a problem.
    Solution:
    Use a signal isolator between the FEC and VFD.
    Job/Troubleshooting Details:
    The program works in simulation mode but eventually lock up the controller, the fault light is on solid, and you cannot communicate with the controller to download.



    In many drives, the control signal we provide to the VSD is connected to the drives' power supply ground at either the input or common terminals. If a ground is found, we need to isolate the signal. This is done by either changing the input card on the VFD to an isolated version or add an analog isolator card to break the ground loop.))

    I dont know if this could be an issue also but Im hoping not... I need to look into it a little more I guess....

  8. #8
    Join Date
    Nov 2006
    Location
    Desert Southwest
    Posts
    691
    You might want to get on and try it.
    If you can't fix it with JB Weld, Duct Tape, and Ty Wire it has to be replaced.
    No good deed goes unpunished.
    If you want to take off friday to go fishing then make sure you train your helper right.

  9. #9
    Join Date
    Jan 2012
    Location
    Atlanta, GA
    Posts
    13
    If its a power issue you might install a UPS which also adds some surge protection.

  10. #10
    Join Date
    Feb 2011
    Posts
    42
    All the controllers have surge protectors on them already.

  11. #11
    Join Date
    Jan 2012
    Location
    Atlanta, GA
    Posts
    13
    Quote Originally Posted by dhoyt View Post
    All the controllers have surge protectors on them already.
    I should of been more specific; a good Uninterruptable Power Supply may clean up power glitch issues.

  12. #12
    Join Date
    Jan 2012
    Location
    Atlanta, GA
    Posts
    13
    I have also corrected VFD noise issues on the FC bus with an Uninterruptable Power Supply.

  13. #13
    Join Date
    Jul 2008
    Posts
    1,475
    Quote Originally Posted by dhoyt View Post
    I have some FECs that are at version 6.1 and they keep faulting out, going offline, and wont execute their programming.

    ...normal behaviour for FEC isnt it?
    1 + 1 = 3 ( *** for very large values of 1)

    ...everybody wants a box of chocolates and long stemmed rose

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