also bad coupling
Originally Posted by ed turner
I honestly believe the noise you now have is NOT related to what service has been performed. You may have some other problem, but it can be remedied for sure.
I would definately check the coupling, and even replace if it's original. I do that on all boilers over 10 yrs old. I don't wait for things to break, especially a $XXX part that's plastic.
The chamber issue is a not an issue for operation but could contribute to the noise you hear. In that particular boiler, all that chamber does is very slightly improve efficiency and soften the burner flame noise. The boiler will function fine without it, but it definately cannot impinge the fire whatsoever.
Vibration is typically the burner motor or pump not being fastened tightly or the bearings getting worn in the motor. The new motors are incredibly smooth and being capacitor start, make the flame all that much cleaner too.
Last edited by HeyBob; 02-26-2008 at 06:48 AM.
Reason: Removed Pricing!
The Way It Sounds It May Be The Motor
Is It A Old Style Motor. If It Is The Bearings Are
Making The Ra Ra Ra Noise. Change Motor And Change
Burner Coupling. Also Clear Oil Line Filter And Strainer.
Also Carlins Are Little Touchy. Need To Set Up Burner
And Make Sure Its Not Over Fired And Angle Of Nozzle
Is A 70 Or 60 Degree. If It Is A B May Need A . Each Situation
Needs Different Ways To Fix Problems
Thanks for all the replies, I really appreciate it. I have been reading a lot in the last few days on here and the web to try to learn all I can to be a smarter customer. I think as a homeowner I should know more about something that is both a large investment and so vital.
I need your help one more time in deciding if I have a clear indicator here that I need another tune up call, either from them or a dedicated HVAC guy at additional cost. I don't know if this is a cause of the noise/vibrations or a separate problem:
I found this spec sheet concerning my Burner model (Carlin 100CRD):
The last tech that came installed a .85 60deg SS nozzle. So when I look at the chart, it suggests what the retention ring Z axis setting should be (the "A" value). I am attaching a picture of my burner from the side. If I am interpreting the data correct, and considering what looks like a recent change to that settings based on the "clean" section next to the locking screw, is this enough to indicate I am out of adjustment and require a tune-up?
Please understand I'm not asking for DIY, I respect the rules. I just don't want to waste another service visit if I'm not on to something. One thing I don't know for sure is which type of tube I have, is that something I can determine?
Last edited by HeyBob; 02-26-2008 at 06:50 AM.
Reason: Removed Link to another site
I have to say, being new here (just a few minutes ago) I installed my own HB Smith 20 years ago with a friend that knew what he was doing. Well when I bought the unit the guy that sold it to me told me with an HB Smith "NEVER, NEVER" use one of those cleaning pellets in the fire box as it would destroy the target at the rear of the fire box. I just have to wonder if one of the cleaning guys put one of those in to clean the unit at one time or another. The other thing I did a few years back was to take that Carlin burner out and through it away, and installed a Becket (the Carlin had died). The only time I had noise/vibration upstairs with the HB Smith was just before the Carlin died, and I was spending more time baby sitting the burner until finally one cold Saturday morning about 5:00 am it quit, and would not start.
I agree with some of the previous posts that because you have paid for a service, I would call the company and demand a different technician to fix your furnace......
Its a little futher open then suggested, but the air adjustments aren't set up to spec either.
You would need a combustion kit to set your burner up right. And thats something the last guy didn't use.
You can call and request your current company come out and set it up right. Or call another company.
One thing to keep in mind on the Carlin burner, that is the hardest burner to get into sync, and if you get it close with no cigar, and say well I will move this just a bit to get it better. You may have to start all over again to get it back to where you had it the first time. I was never more surprised then when I installed the Becket, and fired it off the first time. The setup was so simple I could not believe, and always runs over 85%. I use a .75 60deg nozzle even though it says I can run a .85. I have a small house, and that size works well for me........
I couldn't disagree more. The Carlin is the most universal burner there is, and their latest model for residental applications (EZ Elite) is the very best oil burner you can possibly get. Better than anything Europe has to offer too. I am not kidding, nor exaggerating, just telling it like I see it in the servicing business for over 20 yrs now. Beckett has actually copied the Carlin design in adapting their AFG burner with a removable retention head.
Originally Posted by gwdave1997
Dave, the 60 degree nozzle is not spec for the Beckett, I'm surprised it ignites acceptably or burns efficiently. The air pattern on a Beckett (AF or AFG) is designed for a 80 degree spray, and the ignition settings are looking for that angle nozzle as well. Maybe you meant to say 80 degree spray.
Originally Posted by gwdave1997
To MST3K, the photo you posted is a very keen observation of the retention adjustment and will make the flame different than it was previously. In fact, it will make the flame ingest more air around the flame and change the burn pattern. The retention setting with the Carlin is adjustable (as you've seen) but really shouldn't vary much from the manufacturers recommended setting. For your firing rate nozzle (.85), the setting should be moved back to where it was AND a complete combustion test completed.
If you do have the oil guys come back, ask them to check fuel pressure. It needs to be a steady 100 psi or for improved flame quality, have them boost the fuel pressure to 140 psi. The fuel pressure increase will require the boiler to handle 1.05 gph.
I am in agreement with many of you that the ra-ra-ra noise is probably coming from the motor. That was there before and it happened slowly so I didn't realize it was getting worse. I went to take a recording of it and realized it is very loud and I hear it all throughout the house. I think I noticed the vibration more because it seemed to intensify right after the transformer was put in, and then paid more attention to the sound (which did seem to change too).
Bottom line, it's got to get checked out and adjusted. Thanks again for your help.
I know this thread is old but I thought I'd update it with the final results. When I search for my model burner this thread comes up as a result all the time so I figure I should let people know in case they have similar problems:
* More noticeable "rumbling" after tech installed Transformer -
This was of course not due to the new transformer but something else he did. He mentioned verifying that the pump pressure was good. Take a look at my picture above, it may not be so clear there but to get a gauge on that port, he had to move the oil line forward - the Z axis - to make room! Thats' why it was out of position. Moving that back to where it belongs helped with the rumbling.
* Ra-ra noise, mechanical harshness
I noticed this at the same time but probably only because I was paying more attention after the rumbling was noticeable. This was helped two ways:
1. New coupling. The old one was pretty gone, it was rubber with metal end pieces that screwed to the shafts with allen screws. Must have been a pain to put on! But, easy to just pull off since the rubber was so oil-soaked, one end just came off! It was flexing or slipping, thus giving the uneven ra-ra noise. Replacing it made a more constant "Raa".
2. Oil the motor. It had an oil port that looks like it wasn't used in quite a while. Noticed while the motor was off that it actually squeaked as it was moved by hand! 10 drops of motor oil - as instructions called for on the label - helped a lot.
So you guys were right on with some of your suggestions. When all was done, it ran like it used to, so I'm happy
Unfortunately none of this work was done by my original oil company techs, they missed it, in some cases caused it. I don't mean to bust on anyone in the trade at all. I was in service myself, I trained as an Auto tech (only spend a few months working on cars professionally before I changed "gears"). And I know these oil guys don't have all day to sit there listening to the burner running.
Hope these solutions help someone out.
If you found all this, and corrected all this yourself.
Write a ltter to the company that did the service to your boiler. Telling them what you found and did to correct the problems. Don't make it a harsh nasty letter.
The owner, or service manager will let the techs know about it.
This will go along way to help both other customers, and those techs.
Techs can't learn, if they don't know what they missed.