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  1. #1

    wireless thermostat

    Hi,
    I am very newbee in this area. Trying to acquire some knowledge. For a wireless thermostat, for both residential and commercial, which technology is the best way to go. There are number of them like, Zigbee , Wi-Fi , Z-Wave, Millennial Net, Ember, Eka Systems, Dust, MiWi, EnOcean, Wibree, ZenNet....
    Which one?

    Thanks in advance.

  2. #2
    Join Date
    Feb 2005
    Posts
    345
    Playing the devil's advocate here, but why use any of them?

    Wireless technology has it's place and that can be defined as an application where the final cost of wireless is less than the final cost of a hard-wired installation. With the (still) high initial capital costs for the wireless equipment, the (typically) additional engineering time to source/decide on product, the (typically) additional tech time required to commission the unit, the mandatory battery maintenance program that MUST become a fact of life for the customer, wireless technology is rarely a responsible financial choice. Further, failure of the sensors/system is inevitable due to battery failure and as a result, discomfort or worse will result.

    All of this needs to be factored into the equation.

    Before you look at wireless technology look hard at the problem you're trying to solve with it and see if wireless is the best choice instead of finding a solution and then going looking for a problem to stick it to.

    Nikko

  3. #3
    Join Date
    Nov 2007
    Location
    Philadelphia, PA
    Posts
    32
    I like that thought pattern, Nikko. I am fairly new in the field and a young guy. I can easy get caught up in the thought pattern the newest and flashest (wireless) has to be the best; until someone mentions all that. Good stuff, but thanks for raining on my parade.

  4. #4

    Hmm

    hum.. For a wireless thermostat, for both residential and commercial, ... If $$$$$ is no object get the whole system.
    may wanta look into:
    http://www.tcsbasys.com/index.html

  5. #5
    Join Date
    Sep 2005
    Location
    Texas
    Posts
    2,793
    I wouldn't use one unless I had no other choice and theres been a few times I had to bite the bullet...Totaline makes a fair one

  6. #6
    Join Date
    Dec 2006
    Location
    What? Who? Where?
    Posts
    1,693
    I had a Distech sales team in the office a couple of years back and they had a wireless zone sensor (I don't think it had outputs i.e. not a thermostat).

    It used a photovoltaic cell to charge the battery when the lights were on or if in a naturally lit room the sun would charge it. Great concept.

    Never heard or seen anything about it since, nut then again I don't follow controls and control products like I used to.

    kontrol out
    "Open is as open does." - Forrest Gump
    "Can't we all just get a Lon?" - Garry Jack
    "BACnet: integration or interrogation?" - The Janitor
    "Open protocols? You can't handle open protocols!" - Nathan R. Jessup
    “What’s that? Aaa… open protocols? Don’t talk about…. open protocols? Are you kidding me? Open protocols? I just hope we can hardwire an interface!” - Jim Mora http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=U7fjDS0jKiE

  7. #7
    Join Date
    May 2002
    Posts
    9,564
    Distech re-badges Thermokon.

    I've used Thermokon with mixed results. You really need the battery anyway as you won't be able to update temps as quickly as you want without it. (it's still too slow)

    The benefit of using it with Distech would be IF Distech uses a single receiver per device. Otherwise, you have to BIND temps into a receiver from each sensor. That's a big pain.

    Honestly, I think it is more expensive than what it would be worth IF you need their receiver. 1 to 1 (if Distech does this) would possibly run this into a saleable cost.

  8. #8
    Join Date
    Jul 2007
    Location
    Mount Airy, MD
    Posts
    7,281
    Kelly Controls !!!

  9. #9
    Join Date
    May 2002
    Posts
    9,564
    Quote Originally Posted by Chris_Worthingt View Post
    Kelly Controls !!!
    WHY?

  10. #10
    Join Date
    Aug 2006
    Location
    Melbourne, Australia
    Posts
    23

    Post Wireless With Limits

    Distech controls has wireless sensors and switchs, which connect back to a reciever built into the controller (not on all models, its an extra and only in fixed profile controllers, at least for now).

    Depending on the controller you can connect multiple wireless devices to one controller, the temp sensors don't require a battery, they use the light (I think it was 200 or 300 lux+).

    Seems to me there are still issues with wireless, you pay more (is the cable and labour really that much?), range, and depending where you are you might not be able to use a particular brand. In Australia the governing body requires you to have a licence for the Frequency Distech uses.

  11. #11
    Kelle? Frontier system? Yeh works, BUT expensive, ever heard of Spinwave? Very affordable. Google Spinwave wireless, don't recall web address. Distech has decent pricing, but have not tried them yet.
    Intelli-Building = Less Stress, commissioned with diligence!

  12. #12
    Join Date
    Dec 2007
    Location
    sevierville TN.
    Posts
    177
    Quote Originally Posted by nikko View Post
    Playing the devil's advocate here, but why use any of them?

    Before you look at wireless technology look hard at the problem you're trying to solve with it and see if wireless is the best choice instead of finding a solution and then going looking for a problem to stick it to.

    Nikko
    Best piece of wisdom I'v read in days

  13. #13
    Quote Originally Posted by sodd81927 View Post
    Best piece of wisdom I'v read in days
    I am in total agreement, I have used wireless, on several specified jobs, (Delta speced, but lost job). You MUST perform a site survey, and plan around the results. Also you MUST set your timed transmissions, based on time or COV, to be reasonable.

    I know the manufacturers claim 5-8 years, but we just plan on an annual change out and be proactive, and get a maintenance contract to boot.

    I have some projects that are 8-9 years old, and have only had to replace a couple of sensors (less than 1.5% failure). Funny thing happened one day, we had a out of range alarm, knocked on a condo owners door, and upon inquiring about the issue, they said "oh this thing" with the sensor in their hand! So much for Velcro mounting.

    I always use the wireless in my applications as a "Building load feedback" and ALWAYS program to anticipate failure, and to kick sensor out of the average, and process an alarm. The projects I did would have been cost prohibitive otherwise.

    I have learned the hard knock way to really set back and think about the cost/labor to a hardwired solution.
    Intelli-Building = Less Stress, commissioned with diligence!

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