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  1. #1
    Join Date
    Nov 2007
    Location
    Philadelphia, PA
    Posts
    32

    Siemens Insight alarmable points trouble

    Hi guys,

    Hopefully have an easy problem for the Siemens guys. I have 5 points that are Low Temp Detector for UV's. In the point editor they are not select as alarmable points. I would assume that I would never get an alarm from them then, but I received an alarm that I can not clear for the customer.

    I tired a few different solution like making them alarmable and commanding them to the opposite state to take them out of alarm in the alarm status screen, but that does not change the state.

    I guess my real question is can the alarm status screen be wrong, more like it is wrong, and can alarms get "stuck" there without being able to clear them.

    Isn't a big problem or a problem at all, but it was stuck in my head and thought I would reach out for some help.

    Thanks in advanced

  2. #2
    Join Date
    Jun 2005
    Location
    The Gray Northwest
    Posts
    661
    Have you tried deleting the points and then re-adding them? Are they virtual or a DI from a re-set control? Is there a central server the Siemens system resides on?

  3. #3
    Join Date
    Nov 2007
    Location
    Philadelphia, PA
    Posts
    32
    I have not attempted to delete and re-create the points.

    The system does reside on a server.

    I was thinking that they must just be stuck and the server need a reboot, to clear its brain so to say

  4. #4
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    Posts
    34
    Have you verified that the point is actually not in alarm by running a panel point log or doing a "point detail"?

  5. #5
    Join Date
    Nov 2007
    Location
    Philadelphia, PA
    Posts
    32
    gkstriper

    I have verified that the points are not in alarm. The points in alarm are points that are created in the field panel that are exact matchs from the Sub-points of a TEC with app. (I believe) 2284. The part that is getting me is the points in the field panel (not sub-points) say they are in alarm and not the sub-points from the TEC. I have verified that neither are in alarm.

    There were many field panel points, (recreated as the sub-points) that were in alarm, but I got rid of some of them by commanding the sub-point ON, then the alarm would clear and I would acknowledge it and clear the alarm from the status, and then release the override and the alarm would not reappear.

  6. #6
    Join Date
    Jun 2005
    Location
    The Gray Northwest
    Posts
    661
    So it sounds like these are physical points and not virtual. One trick that I've used is to go into the point editor and make the physical point a virtual point, than comand it to an "un-alarmed" state. Once your alarm clears, than you go back and change the virtual back to it's original, physical point, not alarmable. If that doesn't work, than your problem is in your Insight server. The alarm buffer file on the sever needs to be cleared. If you have clients on that server, they too must be active when you remove the alarms from the server.

  7. #7
    Join Date
    Nov 2007
    Location
    Philadelphia, PA
    Posts
    32
    Big Johnson

    I will try changing it to a virtual point and let you know how that goes. I will not be there till after the new year.

    A question for you is how would I go about clearing the alarm buffer on the server.

    Thanks

  8. #8
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    Posts
    34
    I'm pretty sure I know whats going on.

    When a point goes into alarm by crossing over the alarm threshold defined in the point editor, that point must cross back over the threshhold in order for INSIGHT to clear the alarm on the alarm screen.

    If someone goes in to the point editor and raises the threshhold (or lowers it depending on whether it is a low or high alarm) in an attempt to place the point out of the alarm range, the point will actually show as normal but it will not clear on the alarm screen.

    It is an inherent flaw in the INSIGHT application in my opinion and this is how you clear it....

    Click on START, then PROGRAMS, then ACCESSORIES, then COMMAND PROMPT.

    At the DOS prompt type ASYDEBUG 100 and hit enter, this will clear any inactive alarms from the alarm screen.

    This drove me nuts for a year.......Good Luck, let me know how you make out.

  9. #9
    Join Date
    Jun 2006
    Location
    Des Moines
    Posts
    287
    It is a bug in Insight, but an extremely small one.

    You are correct in your diagnosis. Basically, it's this -

    If any point is in alarm (and thus in the alarm screen) and a person EDITS that point definition, that point then MAY get "stuck" in the alarm screen.

    Your solution is also the correct one. You do need to reboot the server after using asydebug to clear the alarm screen. However, it clears all the alarms, even things that are legitimately in the alarm screen.
    Dingman from Iowa~
    "A lie gets halfway around the world before the truth has a chance to get its pants on."
    - Sir Winston Churchill (1874-1965)

    The Dingman's webpage, featuring the Ding_Z

  10. #10
    Join Date
    Nov 2007
    Location
    Philadelphia, PA
    Posts
    32
    Thanks guys,

    That sounds like a good solution to me. I will try it after the holiday when I get back to the sight. I new that it was a glitch in the system. That is why I love this site. The werids problems it seems you guys have run into as well.

    Thanks alot

    I'll let you know how it works

  11. #11
    Join Date
    Sep 2006
    Location
    Rhode Island
    Posts
    244
    I will be filing this one under "Things I Didn't Know About Siemens Controls"

  12. #12
    Join Date
    Nov 2005
    Location
    Sacramento, ca
    Posts
    19
    Try uploading the panel

  13. #13
    Join Date
    Jun 2006
    Location
    Des Moines
    Posts
    287
    LOL, where did this come from? Did you read this thread?
    Dingman from Iowa~
    "A lie gets halfway around the world before the truth has a chance to get its pants on."
    - Sir Winston Churchill (1874-1965)

    The Dingman's webpage, featuring the Ding_Z

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