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  1. #1

    New heat pump installed - we are freezing!

    We just got a new heat pump installed yesterday, November 14 in Columbia, South Carolina area. Tonight is the test night. 45F (+6C) outside and the heat pump went on and it's been on for an hour without stopping even if I set temp to 68F and it got like 64F in the house. The thermostat shows temp 66F but in other rooms temps plummeted to 57F. Our noses are already running. The heat pump blows very cold air which does not feel warm at all. The heat pump "HEAT" mode is on, everything set up correctly on the thermostat. As soon as I turned the "heat" pump off it felt much better having that "freeze pump" stop blowing cold air into the house. I put three electric radiators on and we are "ok", but I'm "mad" that the brand new expensive heat pump blows cold air into the house. The installers said they inspected the ductwork under the house in the crawlspace, but I see that the access to the crawlspace was never opened... Was patient enough to wait to see if any heat comes up, but nothing, just cold air... brrrr... I'm still freezing just thinking of being foolish removing that old propane heat furnace (which was very very expensive to run, the cost of propane is pain costing $600 to $1500 a month or so) and the old 16 year old CARRIER a/c with this new xxxx worth of GOODMAN heat pump which seemed to be like a dream machine at 14 SEER and paid big bucks extra for the R410A refrigerant unit and a VARIABLE SPEED BLOWER MOTOR AIR HANDLER! Condensing unit Model # SSZ140481AB. Furnace ar handler: Model # AEPF426016BA. 15 KW coil. Isn't that a good equipment? Although I noticed how much more nouce it makes in comparison with the propane (gas) furnace. Propane sure felt like real heat, but we needed to get rid of it as it was becoming way too expensive. But why is this heat pump blowing no heat, just cold air? I mean I'm familiar with "cold air" coming out of heat pumps which eventually heat the house, but this one's air is way too cold and it actually cooled down, at least it felt like we are cooling down instead of heating up. The aur coming out feels like 50F or so. Please advise, we are freezing. Called the installer's service "emergency" number, but no one is there, I guess at 2 AM is a bad idea to have trouble with heat pump. Will have to wait until the morning, at least another 4-5 hours, which is fine with me. The H/P is off. The radiators are on. What was the xxxx paid for?
    Last edited by Senior Tech; 11-16-2007 at 07:54 AM. Reason: removed pricing

  2. #2
    Join Date
    Feb 2003
    Location
    Huntsville,AL
    Posts
    4,125
    contractor, contractor, contractor --

    it is hard for us to see from here --

    was a load calculation run to determine the size of the unit?
    harvest rainwater,make SHADE,R75/50/30= roof/wall/floor, use HVAC mastic,caulk all wall seams!

  3. #3
    Join Date
    Nov 2004
    Location
    SW FL
    Posts
    5,987

    Angry Root cause for little/no heating is _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ ?

    Quote Originally Posted by enigma View Post
    We just got a new heat pump installed yesterday, November 14 in Columbia, South Carolina area.

    Tonight is the test night. 45F (+6C) outside and the heat pump went on and it's been on for an hour without stopping even if I set temp to 68F and it got like 64F in the house.

    The thermostat shows temp 66F but in other rooms temps plummeted to 57F. Our noses are already running. The heat pump blows very cold air which does not feel warm at all. The heat pump "HEAT" mode is on, everything set up correctly on the thermostat.

    The installers said they inspected the ductwork under the house in the crawlspace, but I see that the access to the crawlspace was never opened...

    Was patient enough to wait to see if any heat comes up, but nothing, just cold air... brrrr... I'm still freezing just thinking of being foolish removing that old propane heat furnace (which was very very expensive to run, the cost of propane is pain costing $600 to $1500 a month or so) and the old 16 year old CARRIER a/c with this new xxxx worth of GOODMAN heat pump which seemed to be like a dream machine at 14 SEER and paid big bucks extra for the R410A refrigerant unit and a VARIABLE SPEED BLOWER MOTOR AIR HANDLER! Condensing unit Model # SSZ140481AB. Furnace ar handler: Model # AEPF426016BA. 15 KW coil.
    If the access to the crawlspace was never opened, you did not need to pay them. Is the ductwork actually connected?

    Is your house > 6,000 Square feet?

    Is it > 80 years old?

    In other words, the new heat pump is NOT the problem.
    Last edited by Senior Tech; 11-16-2007 at 07:56 AM.
    Designer Dan
    It's Not Rocket Science, But It is SCIENCE with "Some Art". ___ ___ K EEP I T S IMPLE & S INCERE

    Define the Building Envelope and Perform a Detailed Load Calc: It's ALL About Windows and Make-up Air Requirements. Know Your Equipment Capabilities

  4. #4
    Join Date
    Nov 2007
    Location
    Durham,N.C.
    Posts
    117
    do you have a 2heat 1 cool t-stat?where is the air handler if your crawl was never opened.sounds like he needs to check his wiring.I just install the same split sysytem and there is lots of different wiring diagrams on those air handlers

  5. #5
    Join Date
    Dec 2002
    Location
    Rochester, MN
    Posts
    5,304
    Something is not right. it should not be blowing cold air.. Electric heat back up should of came on and help....

    You know for the fact if the duct are wrapped in insulation in the crawl space?

  6. #6
    Join Date
    Oct 2005
    Location
    MN
    Posts
    133
    With propane costs like that your using one hell of a lot of therms. From the model numbers it looks like you have a 4 Ton HP. I don't see how 4 tons will put out anywhere near the therms of heat that you were using with Propane.

    Did they do a manual J to size the equipment?

  7. #7
    Join Date
    Jun 2003
    Location
    Florida
    Posts
    9,548
    You have an equipment malfunction, period. Call your contractor back. With 15kw aux heat, and the heatpump, there's no way the air should be cold unless the equipment or duct isn't correct.
    If everything was always done "by the book"....the book would never change.

  8. #8
    Join Date
    May 2007
    Location
    Upstate SC
    Posts
    188
    My experience agrees with smokin68 - It could possibly be a very simply fix by the contractor. When I turned on my brand new HP this season, it too blew out cold air (supply at 48F, return at 69, tstat set to 71). The contractor came out and realized when he looked at the wiring/board in the furnace that they had the system set to call for cooling instead of HP by accident. It was a 2 minute fix. While he was here he did the 6-month preventive maintenance.

  9. #9

    More details

    1. Load calculation run was not done. They said it's unnecessary.
    2. Actually I found out access to the crawlspace from the basement, I hope they did inspect the ductwork from there, that's why probably they never opened the outside access to the (very low) crawlspace.
    3. My house is 2500 sq. ft. as per real estate agent. Could be 2300-2400 or even 2200 but not sure. It is in SC and needed work so it cost low. So I guess no one took an eye on it too much because of low profit margin.
    4. Most of the house is 70 years old, but an addition is 40 years old (all outside brick).
    5. It's a BRAEBURN thermostat with one heat and one cool position and it has emergency heat, fan and off. Non-programmable.
    7. Air handler is new and is standing in the small "storm cellar" basement and ducts were all connected and insulated probably in 1950-60s. Return ducts are not insulated. All ducts made from sheet metal. HVAC dude says squirrels will not bite through sheet metal. Is that true?
    8. He checked the wiring this morgen and he said the guys forgot (!) to do some wiring for the reverse, so when I put the heat on the A/C was blowing .................. tah...
    9. Oh yes, it's a 4 Ton unit H/P.
    10. The heat (after repair) seems to be ok, quite warm. Propane was better somehow, but at almost three bucks per gallon my 500 gallon tank was costing sixteen hundred or so and I empty it in just one month if I heat to 68F/70F but I kept on 55F and still I spent like five-six hundred a month! That's why I decided to go with an H/P (heat pump).
    11. I asked for a Manual J but they refused. They said they installed the A/C and propane 17 years ago in this same house and that the 4 ton unit was faen for this house.
    12. OOC, exactly! :-) it was same case, it was A/C runing instead of heat this nite. He said they are new with these variable speed blowers. Any experiences with them?

    About payment, I can't just refuse people if they ask for money, I paid upon when they said they were done without checking much, I trusted them.
    I got scammed many times, every time learning and trying to be more careful, but this time it should be okay even if I had to ask them to fix some things they did not do like in some "metal box" near furnace there was a big round hole 4 inches wide left and a narrow one as well, it as a return and I felt air blowing through the hole. Even if I asked to close it they did not. I had to remind several times until they closed one hole and then I had to remind to close yet another hole. They closed with a some kind of aluminium foil tape.
    So these troubles are kind of small, I hope no big troubles lie beyond in the future. Next week I have a court going on suing (I hate to do that, but
    it's my second time suing an outright scammer) a plumber who enjoys my large deposit for materials, that job was never done not even begun. The guy will get his career ruined badly, got reported to LLR, BBB, FTC etc. The first case was take money for the rest of the project and run (in NC). I've learned the hard way how to do it. The HVAC guy is too nice to get angry with him though. He fixed the problem right away. I wish they did everything perfectly from the beginning. Still need to insulate and re-insulate the ductwork some day soon. There are still some small problems like the outside unit has damaged paint (in factory i guess) in several places and needs to touch up cause it may get rusted. The ducts don't blow evenly, but I guess that problem is hard to fix. The thermostat was installed on a wall, but the wiring was put inside of the closet instead of inside the wall. Not that it's a big problem, but extra holes in the shelves and the floor were made and it looks kind of ugly. Thanks y'all for your opinions and help.
    Last edited by enigma; 11-16-2007 at 12:47 PM. Reason: Removed pricing. Sorry!

  10. #10
    Join Date
    Oct 2007
    Location
    Richmond, VA
    Posts
    103
    Quote Originally Posted by enigma View Post
    1. Load calculation run was not done. They said it's unnecessary.
    Thats what 5 out of 6 of my contractors said. They all over sized my system.

  11. #11
    Join Date
    May 2007
    Location
    Upstate SC
    Posts
    188
    I know the pros on here might like to see some pics of the issues you're raising (i.e. the holes, lack of duct work insulation, wiring, etc.). From a HO's perspective, it's tough to think in terms of contracts and business acumen, but the fact is a handshake doesn't mean what it used to anymore with a lot of folks (for HOs or pros). Perhaps a more iron-clad contract about what's covered and what isn't would have been helpful for you and the firm you hired if you did not have one that spelled out a lot of these issues. Obviously some things you couldn't possibly think of before the work begins, but at least a good contract is a start. I hope it all works out fine for you and them. Best of luck to you.

  12. #12
    Join Date
    Mar 2007
    Location
    NW AR
    Posts
    2,475
    No, squirrels wont chew through metal.
    Dont expect the same temp air from the vents as you had with propane or youll be disappointed.
    Sounds like you got a pi$$ poor contractor.
    1. No load calc.
    2. They obviously didnt even check the system after installation or they would have quickly found the R.V. problem so it probably doesnt even have the correct charge in it. No telling what else they "forgot".

    Benny do I get banned for this post too?????? Pffft

  13. #13
    Join Date
    Nov 2007
    Location
    Durham,N.C.
    Posts
    117
    I dont think its equip or duct ,I think its the low voltage wiring or t-stattrust me

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