Trane xl14i bad fan motor on condenser unit?

[chandleraz_guy]

Had tech onsite for a strange harmonic/noise issue. Bad bearing type sound but also very similar to when my king valve wouldn't fully open and needed to be replaced day1.

Tech hopefully has isolated problem to fan motor which hopefully will get installed tomorrow. I say hopefully as tech's readings/numbers don't indicate any obvious defect and it's sad as unit is just under a year old.

HOW COMMON IS THIS WITH TRANE? Sure glad I got the 10 yr labor warranty along with the parts piece.

Longer version is I have 2 xl14i's w/r22 which sit next to one another--both just under 1 yr old. (near my computer office so I end up hearing them run)

Both have be running pretty well but all of a sudden unit #1 makes high pitch harmonic noises during times of little to no load for only 1st 5 minutes. ( morning & evening hours ) Unit #2 makes no such noises.

Problem unit does not make any unusual noises during the heat of the day and noise goes away often after about 5 minutes but longer now that its been 75F in the a.m. vs 90F.

[lbf]

But it sounds (no pun intended) like your tech is on top of it. All motors can sometimes make strange sounds when their bearings start to go. I can remember a lady that swore she had a bird making a noise in her's. Let him change it out and see if that fixes it.

[chandleraz_guy]

Yeah I've had bearing issues/noises from bad pool motors & w/automobiles.

Just surprised it lasted an entire summer running tons but then it's only 11 months old.

But it sounds (no pun intended) like your tech is on top of it. All motors can sometimes make strange sounds when their bearings start to go. I can remember a lady that swore she had a bird making a noise in her's. Let him change it out and see if that fixes it.

[cmajerus]

that right there is why I stress to customers that they should get the 10 yr p&l you just paid for the warranty in service savings.

[second opinion]

it is in the refrigerant circuit not the fan. Does it happen consistently in the a/m? Did tech run the fan without compressor to isolate the sound? Generally bearings in a motor will increase noise with run time, not go away especially as the ambient increases.Refrigerant pressures can cause the symptoms that you are seeing and as they begin to stabilize the sound will clear. Just a thought.

[chandleraz_guy]

Interesting thought Second Opinion... Tech did isolate sound by running just compressor without fan.... But not fan without compressor?

Fan is supposed to be replaced in the a.m. so we'll see how it sounds this weekend as temps are supposed to be a cold 90F.

Tech claimed pressures were good with disch press=220, suct=76, superheat=8, sub-cool=13, and ambient=89f.

it is in the refrigerant circuit not the fan. Does it happen consistently in the a/m? Did tech run the fan without compressor to isolate the sound? Generally bearings in a motor will increase noise with run time, not go away especially as the ambient increases.Refrigerant pressures can cause the symptoms that you are seeing and as they begin to stabilize the sound will clear. Just a thought.

[chandleraz_guy]

replacement of fan motor appears to have corrected harmonics problem.

unfortunately, tech damaged fan blades which are now on order.

suspect he must of really messed em up as another tech told me it's normally an easy fix to correct "bent" fan blades?

fan blades were fine yesterday which tech confirmed as he did the work both days but did not explain what happened today?

[jimj]

replacement of fan motor appears to have corrected harmonics problem.

unfortunately, tech damaged fan blades which are now on order.

suspect he must of really messed em up as another tech told me it's normally an easy fix to correct "bent" fan blades?

fan blades were fine yesterday which tech confirmed as he did the work both days but did not explain what happened today?

If you have a swept wing blade that mite be a good thing. There have been harmonic problems in some cases with those blades.

[chandleraz_guy]

Second Opinion--I think you are onto something as high pitched noise is back after outside temp cooled. <I had been a little warmer>

Fan motor replacement did not correct problem.

Tech said all pressures looked good but split on unit is 2 degrees warmer than my other xl14i of some tonage and configuration?

Any ideas?

it is in the refrigerant circuit not the fan. Does it happen consistently in the a/m? Did tech run the fan without compressor to isolate the sound? Generally bearings in a motor will increase noise with run time, not go away especially as the ambient increases.Refrigerant pressures can cause the symptoms that you are seeing and as they begin to stabilize the sound will clear. Just a thought.

[chandleraz_guy]

Another tech was onsite today and appears to have isolated harmonics to copper tubing on the side/center above the king valve. (from what I saw)

Says he might try wrapping it with something?

Also said something about a bur (sp?) possibly getting loose which is causing the noise in the cooper pipe?

They are going to tackle issue later in the week but I wanted see if this made any sense or is this just another HACK but sound did go away when he pressed on the hot copper pipe...

[bmathews]

It sounds like the dude is on top of it. Ease up and give him a chance. Nothing is perfect all the time brand new. Take into consideration the amount of units anybody makes. There is bound to be problems off and on. See if the guys who put it in will take care of it. If everything were perfect in this industry, all the time, then there wouldn't be this website.

[chandleraz_guy]

Local Trane office Super Tech ordered new copper discharge line going into the 4 way valve on my xl14i after isolating noise to it. New line was slightly larger and from the factory but nothing obvious was found inside old line.

A burr/bead was suspect as causing the noise which would go away when gauges were connected and was only present during periods of no-load.

All freon was removed and replace with new stuff as was drier. My Tech did not use nitro while making any of the welds but did pressure test with it and then did pull a deep vacuum.

Problem seems to be gone and hopefully won't come back? Wonder what was really cause it and what the defect really was?

[orlandotech]

I had a similar problem once.

I was sent out to change a compressor on a fairly new goodman CU. My boss diagnosed the problem to the compresor making noise but it was running good. This unit is installed at his mother-in-laws house so it was kinda high on the priority list to get it solved. Anyway I guess he thought the valves were bad or it was fixing to go out. He tried putting vibration isolators under the unit to quiet it up before suspecting the compressor but of course it didn't work. I was a little suspect of the pump being bad when I got the call but I went to goodman and got a new pump anyway in case I was wrong. I went up to the unit with only a 5/16 nut driver and looked it over a bit. Listened to it and it really didn't sound like a pump going bad, just metal to metal rattling kinda. So I started pushing on the unit in different spots and found I could control the noise. Come to find out it was the discharge tube that was rubbing on the lower panel that is underneath the control box. When I removed the panel and restarted the unit the noise magically disappeared. I looked for witness marks on the panel, found the tube and adjusted it. Quick and simple. My boss was a little surprised at what the problem really was and maybe made him feel bad or embarrassed since it was a family members unit. Ohh well. I really wasn't in the mood to change a pump that day anyhow. Good thing it was easy.

[mark beiser]

Tech claimed pressures were good with disch press=220, suct=76, superheat=8, sub-cool=13, and ambient=89f.

The system may be overcharged, depending on the length and lift of the refrigerant lines.

[chandleraz_guy]

I'm just a HO but my noise was somehow coming from inside the discharge line going into the 4 way valve... If you connected your guage or held the line with alot of hand pressure it would pretty much go away.

Problem would also disappear once a load was present as it was only noisy during cooler ambient temps.

Unit just turned 1 yr old so I'm hopeful for a better 9 yrs of warranty.

I had a similar problem once.

I was sent out to change a compressor on a fairly new goodman CU. My boss diagnosed the problem to the compresor making noise but it was running good. This unit is installed at his mother-in-laws house so it was kinda high on the priority list to get it solved. Anyway I guess he thought the valves were bad or it was fixing to go out. He tried putting vibration isolators under the unit to quiet it up before suspecting the compressor but of course it didn't work. I was a little suspect of the pump being bad when I got the call but I went to goodman and got a new pump anyway in case I was wrong. I went up to the unit with only a 5/16 nut driver and looked it over a bit. Listened to it and it really didn't sound like a pump going bad, just metal to metal rattling kinda. So I started pushing on the unit in different spots and found I could control the noise. Come to find out it was the discharge tube that was rubbing on the lower panel that is underneath the control box. When I removed the panel and restarted the unit the noise magically disappeared. I looked for witness marks on the panel, found the tube and adjusted it. Quick and simple. My boss was a little surprised at what the problem really was and maybe made him feel bad or embarrassed since it was a family members unit. Ohh well. I really wasn't in the mood to change a pump that day anyhow. Good thing it was easy.

[orlandotech]

I've had a check valve rattle on a few Trane heatpumps when they were running during a startup. Maybe the noise is from the check valve. It will kinda sound like something lightly bouncing around in the tubes of the outdoor unit.

[kwhit]

Hey Orlandotech, I just installed a trane heat pump at my house and I think I have the same rattle comming fom a check valve. Did you do anything to fix it or did you just leave it?

[orlandotech]

Hey Orlandotech, I just installed a trane heat pump at my house and I think I have the same rattle comming fom a check valve. Did you do anything to fix it or did you just leave it?

Nope. I told the office about it so they could pass the info along to our rep at Trane. We will only mess with that repair if the customer complains about it, which has only happened once that i know of and that one was really noisy. Most of the time the HO's don't even notice or they think it's normal. I think Trane has a repair kit of some sort for that or a newer check valve and would be covered under warranty.

[kwhit]

Thanks, I just did some research and found that trane has a magnet kit, and if that doesn't work they will send a new spring loaded check valve