SEER vs EER

[ItshotinBama]

Can someone explain to me the difference between SEER and EER?

A customer today was more interested in EER, saying SEER didn't really matter. We looked up a couple of dual fuel applications and came up with the following (or close to as best my memory serves me)....

Lennox systems with G60UHV variable speed furnace and ARI matched coils....
3ton systems

XP13 - SEER 13.5 EER 11.5

XP15 - SEER 13.7 EER 11.2

XP 16 - SEER 16.0 EER 11.7

Basically, the question was asked, why buy higher SEER equipment. I'm not technical enough to know the answer. Fortunately one of our sales guys was dealing with him direct so I didn't have to sound stupid. But I'd certainly like to learn a little today.

Anyone want to share some wisdom??

[BigJon3475]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/SEER

[CottyGee]

Can someone explain to me the difference between SEER and EER?

Apparently not. The Wikipedia link only says that EER is related to COP and SEER. About the only thing I saw that actually SAID what EER is was:

"The relationship between SEER and EER is relative depending on where you live because equipment performance is dependent of air temperatures, humidities, and pressures."

I asked a similar question a while back and didn't really get a definitive answer. I was P.O.'d that my SEER 16 heatpumps didn't qualify for the tax credit, which required an EER of 12.5.

So, I don't think anyone anywhere knows! It's just one of those things, I guess...

[amd]

EER is measured in fixed operating conditions - 80F inside, 90F outside. (correct me if I'm wrong)

SEER is an average figure over so called "typical operating conditions". Real operating conditions vary greatly; SEER should only be used to compare different units.

[CottyGee]

According to the State of California...

EER (Energy Efficiency Ratio) - The ratio of cooling capacity of an air conditioning unit in Btus per hour to the total electrical input in watts under specified test conditions.

Heaven only knows what these super-secret "specified test conditions" might be!

[CottyGee]

Answers.com says EER is:

energy efficiency ratio
n.

A measure of the relative efficiency of a heating or cooling appliance, such as an air conditioner, that is equal to the unit's output in BTUs per hour divided by its consumption of energy, measured in watts.

[Ed Janowiak]

According to the State of California...

EER (Energy Efficiency Ratio) - The ratio of cooling capacity of an air conditioning unit in Btus per hour to the total electrical input in watts under specified test conditions.

Heaven only knows what these super-secret "specified test conditions" might be!

95° outdoor temp
80° return temp
50% RH

[BigJon3475]

Boy CG when you get into something and can't seem to find out you get pissed pretty quick. It's just the net.

http://www.energystar.gov/ia/partner...ndices_A_B.pdf
http://www.mbinet.org/Magazine/comfort10_03.aspx

[CottyGee]

Boy CG when you get into something and can't seem to find out you get pissed pretty quick.

Huh? What are you talking about? Who said I was pissed??

[BigJon3475]

Huh? What are you talking about? Who said I was pissed??

I guess looking back I took the PO'ed comment earlier as this was making you ill here also. My bad.

[CottyGee]

I guess looking back I took the PO'ed comment earlier as this was making you ill here also.

Nah, it just sucked that I wasn't gettin' Uncle Sam's tax bene when I was layin' out such a huge chunk o' change.

I still don't "get it" how my systems make the grade on HSPF and on SEER, but fall short on EER. Seems like if it makes HSPF and SEER, it should by default qualify. Crazy! HSPF=9.5, SEER=16, EER=12.5 (instead of the minimum 13.0)

[BigJon3475]

http://www.ari.org/NR/rdonlyres/CE3D...2102402006.pdf


Seems to be an engineering answer at the bottom of this from ARI don't have to much time to get into the whole pdf though will read it later.

[snewman24]

Here's an interesting research paper from Southern California Edison stating that EER & SEER ratings are not very accurate for California, and that for residential,
"savings fall short -75% to 90% of the time "(summary of findings is on next to last page).

http://www.doe2.com/download/DEER/SE...20Overview.pdf