My head is about to explode: Trane vs. Goodman

[Frostee]

I'm going trying to make a decision between two contractors, one of which quoted a 4 ton 15 SEER Goodman heat pump/air handler combo, and another who quoted a 3 ton, 15 SEER Trane combo. The Trane would be the 4TWR5036 (XR15) heat pump with a TAM7AOC36 (Hyperion™ XL Series 7) air handler. The Goodman would be the SSZ140481 with an AVPTC42D14 air handler.

Both contractors are rated very high in this area on yelp.com, but I don't know for sure how reliable that is. They both seem knowledgeable and professional, but I don't have any experience with either. The contractor that quoted the Trane quoted close to $ more for the Trane system and basically the same type of installation, which is a 15 SEER with variable speed motor and zoning (the house is 1,543 sq. ft. and two stories). The quote for the Trane doesn't include the electrical changes that have to be made, basically running another 240v cable down from the box, something the other company includes.

Obviously at first we were not going to go with the Trane proposal being so much more expensive, but I asked the Trane contractor to quote me something cheaper, and he can shave about $2,000 for the original quote if he doesn't include zoning. The rest would remain the same.

So basically as it stands, I have to decide between a Goodman system with zoning or a Trane system without zoning that would cost me about one thousand more once I factor in the electrical installation. I have been reading comments on both brands for hours, including many on this website, and some people seem to think Goodman is the Yugo of the HVAC industry, while others say it's fine and it largely depends on the contractor. But also most discussions on this seem to be rather old, so I wanted to get an idea on where these two brands stand nowadays in terms of quality and durability. Basically both have a ten year warranty, but labor is only one year, so I don't want to get a unit that 5 years from now is going to start breaking every summer and I'll have to be in hell for two or three days, besides paying hundreds in labor to get it fixed.

The other thing is, how important is zoning? On a two story house, would it really save me a lot of money on the power bill?

Thanks

[kangaroogod]

Goodman hands down. You could ask your contractor for a 10yr parts and labor warranty through goodman for an additional cost. Zoning depends on the homes design. It can make the house more comfortable and lower your utilities.

[SBKold]

Despite what contractors would like to sell it is not a good idea to zone such a big single stage unit. It kills the efficiency and longevity.

[Carbent]

100% depends on the installation of the equipment. Did both companys do a load calc. Worries me tthat ur quotes r a whole ton different. R u getting an existing system replaced. If so, what size iis existing system? Does it satisfy? With a 2 story house, zoning is way to go if done correctly. R u getting all neew ductwork?

[RyanHughes]

Despite what contractors would like to sell it is not a good idea to zone such a big single stage unit. It kills the efficiency and longevity.

I'd have to agree. 3 tons sounds a lot closer to properly sized for ~1500 sqft than 4 tons. Especially on a zoned system. A load calc needs to be done to determine sizing if it has not been already.

[BaldLoonie]

I'm with SBK, hard to zone a single stage unit, especially 1500 sq ft and a 4 ton. First of all, that sizing sound ABSOLUTELY NUTS no matter where you are. When 1 zone calls, you are trying to stuff 4 tons of air into a really small space and likely small amount of ductwork. You'll short cycle something fierce on discharge air sensor, assuming the panel has one, or you'll freeze up. When a heat pump compressor dies prematurely, first thought it lack of airflow. Same thing trying to stuff 1600 CFM of air into 750 sq ft.

That sizing REALLY scares me. Goodman isn't the Yugo of HVAC anymore but in a lot of areas, their lack of dealer standards still gets you some of the worst contractors. Even 3 tons for 1500 sq ft seemed high, I didn't catch the 4 ton size at first. If you go with the Goodman I'd absolutely want the Goodcare warranty and make sure that's what it is, not the dealer's own. Goodman is normally less than Trane but not that much less! Lot of seafood smell here.

[Frostee]

100% depends on the installation of the equipment. Did both companys do a load calc. Worries me tthat ur quotes r a whole ton different. R u getting an existing system replaced. If so, what size iis existing system? Does it satisfy? With a 2 story house, zoning is way to go if done correctly. R u getting all neew ductwork?

Sorry, I have no idea what a load calc is, but I don't remember either mentioning it. What this is replacing is a 20 something year old A/C unit and a propane heating system. They won't replace the duct work, they both said it was in fairly decent condition, it just needs some sealing in a few places.

[BaldLoonie]

Where are you?

Sent from my HTC VLE_U using Tapatalk 2

[Frostee]

I'm with SBK, hard to zone a single stage unit, especially 1500 sq ft and a 4 ton. First of all, that sizing sound ABSOLUTELY NUTS no matter where you are.

Well, the reason for zoning would be that we have a big difference in temperature between downstairs and upstairs. And if it's too much for the size of this house it might be because I told both that the current system isn't cold enough during the worst days of summer when it gets 95 and up. Those days the thermostat shows 78 or 80 even if it's set to 69. So I told them I need a system that will keep the house cool in the worst days of summer. I don't care much about winter, I'm fine if it doesn't go over 64.

[Frostee]

Where are you?

Raleigh, NC

[Carbent]

Sorry, I have no idea what a load calc is, but I don't remember either mentioning it. What this is replacing is a 20 something year old A/C unit and a propane heating system. They won't replace the duct work, they both said it was in fairly decent condition, it just needs some sealing in a few places.

1st off, I spoke before I did all my homework, sorry. Didn,t catch the single stage. Zoning prob isnt the best way to go. Do you know what ur existing system size is, tonnage/btu? was it comfortable. Really need to get a manual j and manual d done to decide size of system and ductwork. Only way to do it correctly, otherwise next 20 yrs could bring lots of headaches.

[SBKold]

I hear this a lot. And is why doing a calc to see where you stand is so important. Don't assume that your old unit is too small. It is probably not working well due to multiple issues. A thorough inspection may reveal ways to improve the airflow upstairs without zoning. If not zoning could be an option - but a two stage unit is almost a must.

[Frostee]

I hear this a lot. And is why doing a calc to see where you stand is so important. Don't assume that your old unit is too small. It is probably not working well due to multiple issues. A thorough inspection may reveal ways to improve the airflow upstairs without zoning. If not zoning could be an option - but a two stage unit is almost a must.

So what would a load calc be like? Do they need to bring some equipment and run some tests?

[Southern Mech]

They measure your house, windows, insulation, compass orientation punch it into a computer and it calculates the thermal loads.

It would be beneficial to have a energy audit done and show you how much and where your house leaks are, then you can zero it in even closer.

[beshvac]

Is the "goodman" company licensed to do that electrical work?

[tigerdunes]

Everyone has an opinion. I personally think Trane makes a better quality heat pump than Goodman. Plus Trane has electronically demand defrost, Goodman does not. EDD eliminates/reduces unnecessary and nuisance defrost calls which can be expensive and contribute to wear and tear on the condenser.

IMO

[Frostee]

Is the "goodman" company licensed to do that electrical work?

Not themselves, but they work with an electrician who is. Even better, the electrician's fee is included in the quote, while the other one is not.

[Frostee]

Everyone has an opinion. I personally think Trane makes a better quality heat pump than Goodman. Plus Trane has electronically demand defrost, Goodman does not. EDD eliminates/reduces unnecessary and nuisance defrost calls which can be expensive and contribute to wear and tear on the condenser.

That's something important. I asked the first company (the one that quoted the Goodman) to quote me the Trane units and see if their difference is so high as it is between contractors.

[BaldLoonie]

Just can't imagine that 1500 sq ft in Raleigh needs 4 ton or has a 4 ton duct system.

[beshvac]

Not themselves, but they work with an electrician who is. Even better, the electrician's fee is included in the quote, while the other one is not.

Get the Trane and call their supposed electrician

Sorry for my cynicisym, but I hate losing jobs because my company uses a licensed electrician pulling the required permits, when some Bubba goes to Homedepot and buys wire.