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  1. #131
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    Quote Originally Posted by thermophysics View Post
    One has to be honest.

    Its quite obvious, even necessarily true, that if there is a god, such as Allah, then the Koran is without any doubt a book of pure Blasphemy - the Koran necessarily is, logically, the archetypical form of idolatry.

    And we all know where idolatry leads us.
    You believe in neither Jesus or Mohammed either one. Why would anyone care what you think on this particular subject?
    "You boys are really making this thing harder than it has to be". Me

    "I say we just nuke them from space, that is the only way to be sure". Winch from ALIENS, forgot her name.

    Service calls submitted after 3PM will be posted the next business day.

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  2. #132
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tool-Slinger View Post
    You believe in neither Jesus or Mohammed either one. Why would anyone care what you think on this particular subject?
    Galileo came to not believe the sun orbits the earth.

    Why would anyone believe what he thought about the Ptolomaic system?

    Michaelson and Morley came to not believe in the luminiferous aether.

    Why would anyone care for what they thought about the aether?

    Einstein came to not belief in Newtonian mechanics.

    Why would anyone believe what he thought about such?

  3. #133
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    Quote Originally Posted by thermophysics View Post
    Galileo came to not believe the sun orbits the earth.

    Why would anyone believe what he thought about the Ptolomaic system?

    Michaelson and Morley came to not believe in the luminiferous aether.

    Why would anyone care for what they thought about the aether?

    Einstein came to not belief in Newtonian mechanics.

    Why would anyone believe what he thought about such?
    Excellent reply. Touche, carry on sir.
    "You boys are really making this thing harder than it has to be". Me

    "I say we just nuke them from space, that is the only way to be sure". Winch from ALIENS, forgot her name.

    Service calls submitted after 3PM will be posted the next business day.

    I give free estimates [Wild Ass Guesses] over the phone.

    My front door is locked. For your personal protection.

  4. #134
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tool-Slinger View Post
    Excellent reply. Touche, carry on sir.
    If it is then it isn't as obviously so as you make it out to be

    The Copernican system eventually became seen as superior to the Ptolomaic.

    The M & M experiment showed the lumiferous aether hypothesis was in fact superfluous and could not account for one experimental anomaly - otherwise everything worked the same whether it was assumed to exist or not exist.

    Einstein's relativity theory explained Mercury's Perihelion and predicted more accurately the bending of light by the hypothesized curvature of space time.

    Jesus, on the other hand is someone who most likely did exist. So he is not like the Aether that probably does not exist.

    Jesus, however, never said anything that was not already hotly debated by Hellenic ethicists. Since Socrates at least - Hellenic philosophy had been obsessed with debating ethics.

    People like Jesus are put to death to this day monthly in Muslim countries. Imagine an atheist in Jesus time who tried to tell everyone that our morals are actually found in our own hearts and not in some book.

    I think it is a testament to the greatness reached by the Greeks that despite 99% of their books being burned by the Christians and the Muslims they single handedly inspired Christianity and Islam through a Jesus who popularised their ethics and a Mohamed who learned from Aristotle's books much that Aristotle had taught Alexander the Great.

    And yet, despite 99% of the ancient Greek books being burned - that which survives today allows us to find evidence that both religions are equally false.

    The ancient Greeks were perhaps the only gods that ever met with this planet.

  5. #135
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    Quote Originally Posted by thermophysics View Post
    There are no miracles in the Koran.

    And stop quoting the Koran.

    Only the Fly now is all powerful, verily I tell you. Here is written proof of this miracle.


    [IMG]http://3.bp.********.com/-q2eZ86LplBQ/ThAph9rFl8I/AAAAAAAAAJo/poiZyFi8F-c/s1600/spiderman1.jpg[/IMG]
    okay dude, thats just funny
    I only drink a little, but when I do
    I turn into another person and THAT person drinks a lot

  6. #136
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hugh B View Post
    I already know God exists. I just don't believe that that God is your Allah. I believe the real God is the God of the New Testament, the God-man, Jesus Christ who claimed to be God!
    "If" there is "a" God, then what man interprets it to be, does not change what God is! Therefore "God Is" regardless of what you believe.

  7. #137
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    Quote Originally Posted by thermophysics View Post
    No he did not - we clearly evolved from life forms predating even our solar system.



    Er, evidently he needs to start time travelling - either that or the Koran is a book he does not even know about. Either he can time travel and therefore could have avoided all the erroneous scientific facts in the Koran or he can't time travel and got all his scientific facts from the Greeks.

    The only miracle about the Koran is that you think it was inspired by a god.




    Read the Koran - it is all the evidence you need to support the hypothesis that he has been left behind the times.
    this is the answer about allah and time
    What is the meaning of the hadeeth “Do not inveigh against time (waqt) for Allaah is time waqt)”?
    ar - en - fr - zh - id
    Share |
    Is the saying "Do not curse time for Allah is time" authentic from the Rasool's sayings ? If so, how do you interpret this ? I am confused about this issue.

    Praise be to Allaah.

    The word used in the hadeeth is not waqt (= time), but dahr (= time, vicissitudes of time) [this element of confusion may stem from translation of the question into Arabic]. This hadeeth was narrated by Muslim (5827) from Abu Hurayrah.

    Other versions of the hadeeth are:

    “Do not inveigh against time (al-dahr), for Allaah is time”

    “Let not any one of you say, ‘Woe to time,’ for Allaah is time”

    “Allaah says, ‘The sons of Adam offend Me and say, Woe to time, but they should not say Woe to time. I am time, I alternate the night and the day, and if I willed, I could seize them both.’”

    With regard to the meaning of the hadeeth, al-Nawawi said:

    They said: this is a metaphor, because the Arabs used to inveigh against time when disasters such as death, old age, loss of money, etc., happened. They would say, ‘Woe to time’ and other phrases cursing or inveighing against time. So the Prophet (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) said: ‘Do not inveigh against time for Allaah is time’, i.e., do not inveigh against the One Who brings about those disasters, for that will be directed towards Allaah, for He is the One Who causes them to happen. Time (al-dahr) means al-zamaan (time) which cannot do anything in and of itself, for it is just one of the things that have been created by Allaah.

    The meaning of the phrase “for Allaah is time” means that He is the One Who causes those events and accidents to happen, and He is the Creator of all that happens. And Allaah knows best.

    (Sharh Muslim, 15/3)

    It should be noted that “time” (al-dahr) is not one of the Names of Allaah; it is attributed to Allaah in the sense that He created it and is controlling it, i.e., He is the Creator of time. Some phrases in the same hadeeth also indicate this, as when He says, “It is in My Hand, I alternate the night and the day.” The One Who alternates and the thing which is alternated cannot be one and the same; there is the One Who alternates – i.e., Allaah – and the thing which is alternated – i.e., time, which Allaah controls as and when He wills.

    See: Fataawa al-‘Aqeedah by Shaykh Ibn ‘Uthaymeen, 1/163

    Al-Haafiz Ibn Katheer said, in his Tafseer of the aayah (interpretation of the meaning):

    “And they say: “There is nothing but our life of this world, we die and we live and nothing destroys us except Ad‑Dahr (time)” [al-Jaathiyah 45:24]

    Al-Shaafa'i, Abu ‘Ubaydah and others said, in their commentary on the hadeeth of the Prophet (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him), “Do not inveigh against time for Allaah is time” – During the Jaahiliyyah, if some difficulty, trial or disaster befell them, the Arabs would say ‘Woe to time’, attributing those events to time and inveighing against it. But the One Who brought those events to pass is Allaah, so it was as if they were inveighing against Allaah, may He be glorified, because in fact He was the One Who caused those things to happen. So it was forbidden to inveigh against time in this manner, because Allaah is Time, i.e., He is the One lWho is controlling it, but the Arabs were attributing those events to Time.

    This is the best of the comments made in the Tafseer of this hadeeth, and this is what is meant. And Allaah knows best.

    (Tafseer Ibn Katheer, 4/152)

    Shaykh Ibn ‘Uthaymeen (may Allaah preserve him) was asked about the ruling on inveighing against time. He replied:

    Inveighing against time may be divided into three categories:

    1. Where the intention is to convey information without blaming or condemning. This is permissible, such as when a person remarks, “We are suffering from the heat (or the cold) today” and the like, because deeds are judged according to their intentions, and in this case a person is merely describing what is happening without expressing discontent.

    2. Where a person inveighs against time as the cause of events, as if by inveighing against it he means that time is what causes things to alternate between good and bad. This is shirk akbar (major form of shirk) because when a person attributes events to something other than Allaah, this means that he believes that there is another creator alongside Allaah.
    3. Where a person inveighs against time but believes that the One who causes things to happen is Allaah, but he inveighs against time because of the bad things that happened. This is haraam because it is contrary to the sabr (patience) that is required, but it is not kufr because the person does not inveigh directly against Allaah. If he were to inveigh directly against Allaah, he would be a kaafir.
    (Fataawaa al-‘Aqeedah, 1/197)

    Other reprehensible expressions which people utter include cursing the hour or the day on which a certain bad thing happened, and so on. This is a sin because it is cursing and improper speech, and because this is cursing something which does not deserve to be cursed. What has the hour or the day done wrong? Nothing apart from the fact that the events happened then, but they are only created things which have no control over anything and cannot be held to blame. If a person inveighs against time, this reflects on the Creator of time. The Muslim should be above speaking in such a foolish and improper manner. And Allaah is the One Whose help we seek.

    Islam Q&A
    Sheikh Muhammed Salih Al-Munajjid

  8. #138
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    Quote Originally Posted by thermophysics View Post
    Who created god then? Don't tell me you believe something, especially that complex, can just come from nothing?
    Answer:
    1. "If God created everything - then who created God?"



    (Muslims - Remember to use the formula above - i.e.; "Thank you for asking me about my religion..." etc.)

    According to the Quran, Allah tells us that He is the only creator and sustainer of all that exists and that nothing and no one exists alongside Him, nor does He have any partners. He tells us that He is not created, nor is He like His creation in anyway. He calls Himself by a number of names and three of them are:

    A) The First - (Al-Awal)
    B) The Last - (Al Akhir)
    C) The Eternal, who is sought after by His creation, while He has no need from them at all. (As-Samad)

  9. #139
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    Quote Originally Posted by thermophysics View Post
    There are no miracles in the Koran.

    And stop quoting the Koran.

    Only the Fly now is all powerful, verily I tell you. Here is written proof of this miracle.


    [IMG]http://3.bp.********.com/-q2eZ86LplBQ/ThAph9rFl8I/AAAAAAAAAJo/poiZyFi8F-c/s1600/spiderman1.jpg[/IMG]
    hahahah
    you really funny

    instead of answering my question
    you post comics
    hahahahahah

  10. #140
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    Quote Originally Posted by thermophysics View Post
    Who created god then? Don't tell me you believe something, especially that complex, can just come from nothing?
    answer
    Who Created Allah?
    Question: If everything needs a creator, then who created Allah?
    Answer: This is just rhetoric and playing with words. In all practicality this scenario doesn't exist, and here's why:

    Assumption: Every thing is created by "A"

    Question: Who created "A"?
    Answer: "B" created "A"

    Question: Who created "B"?
    Answer: "C" created "B"

    Question: Who created "C"?
    Answer: "D" created "C"

    And so on and so forth.

    You can keep asking this question until we exhaust the chain of creation. Ultimately, we will all have to agree one of 2 things: Either the "creator" is a product of random chance and accident, or some "thing" outside the realm of natural creation exists who is self-existing and doesn't need a creator.

    Furthermore, things like "created" and "born" and "died" are physical things which require time and space. If there is an existence which is self-existing, then that means time doesn't affect Him because He doesn't get old, or get born, or dies. If time doesn't affect Him then that means He is outside the realm of time and space. If He is outside the realm of time and space then He lived before everyone else and will live after everyone else.

    To understand this better, draw a straight line with blue ink on a piece of paper. Let this blue ink represent time. We know time exists so some "thing" has to initiate this line. So now you would draw a bracket in red ink at the begining of the line. As soon as we draw this bracket in red ink outside the line of time, we right away admit that this "thing" is BEFORE time starts. With time begins all other creation, and this "time" seperates the creation from the Ultimate Creator. Since this Ultimate Creator existed before the measurement of time began, for all factual and empirical purposes that makes Him, quite literally, "Eternal and Absolute."


    Say: He is Allah, the One and Only; Allah, the Eternal, Absolute; He begetteth not, nor is He begotten; And there is none like unto Him.
    Qur'an, 112:1-4
    I tell non-Muslims that Allah created everything in this universe. They ask me who created Allah ? How can Allaah have been there since the beginning?
    How can I answer them ?

    Praise be to Allaah.
    This question which the non Muslims have asked you is inherently false and self-contradictory. If we were to say – for the sake of argument – that someone created Allaah, then they would ask you, Who created the creator of the Creator? Then, who created the creator of the creator of the creator?! And so on, ad infinitum. This is irrational and impossible.

    All of creation goes back to the Creator Who created all things. No one created Him; He created everything other than Himself. This is what makes sense and is logical. This Creator is Allaah, may He be glorified and exalted.

    With regard to what our religion tells us, the Prophet (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) told us about this question, where it comes from, and how to respond to it.

    Abu Hurayrah (may Allaah be pleased with him) said: the Messenger of Allaah (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) said: “People will keep on asking questions until someone will say, ‘Allaah created the universe, but who created Allaah?’ Whoever encounters anything like that, let him say, ‘Amantu Billaah (I believe in Allaah).’”

    The Messenger of Allaah (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) said: “The Shaytaan will come to one of you and say, ‘Who created the heaven? Who created the earth?’ He will say, ‘Allaah’” – then he mentioned something similar (to the previous report), and added, “And His Messengers.” [i.e., amantu Billaah wa Rusulihi = I believe in Allaah and His Messengers]

    The Messenger of Allaah (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) said: “The Shaytaan will come to one of you and say, ‘Who created such and such?’ until he says to him, ‘Who created your Lord?’ When it reaches that stage, let him seek refuge with Allaah [say A’oodhu Billaahi min ash-shaytaan ir-rajeem = I seek refuge with Allaah from the accursed Shaytaan] and stop thinking about it.”

    The Messenger of Allaah (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) said: “The Shaytaan will come to a person and say, ‘Who created such and such…’” and he narrated the whole report. (Imaam Muslim, 134).

    In these ahaadeeth (Prophetic narrations) we see:

    Where this question comes from – from the Shaytaan;

    How to deal with it, which is:

    to stop pursuing these thoughts and these tricks of the Shaytaan

    to say, “I believe in Allaah and His Messengers”

    to seek refuge with Allaah from the Shaytaan.

    It was also reported that one should spit drily three times to one’s left, and recite Qul Huwa Allaahu ahad.

    (See "Problems and Solutions" in the Shaykh’s Books section of this website).

    3. With regard to the prior existence of Allaah, our Prophet (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) has told us about this, for example:

    He (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) said: “O Allaah, You are the First and there is nothing before You; O Allaah, You are the Last and there is nothing after You.” (Narrated by Muslim, 2713)

    He (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) said: “Allaah existed when there was nothing apart from Him.” According to another report: “There was nothing before Him.” (Narrated by al-Bukhaari; the first report 3020; the second report 6982).

    This is in addition to what is stated in the aayaat (verses) of the Qur’aan. The believer believes without a doubt, the non Muslim denies and the munaafiq (hypocrite) doubts. We ask Allaah to grant us sincere and certain faith with no doubts. And Allaah is the Source of strength.

  11. #141
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    Quote Originally Posted by thermophysics View Post
    Jesus was no miracle - he was an ordinary eastern atheist cynic sage - he popularised common ethics of the Hellenic World
    The Miracles of Jesus



  12. #142
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    Quote Originally Posted by thermophysics View Post
    HA HA HA HA HA HA HE HE HE HE HEE HEE HEE HEE HA HA HA HA.

    MY GOD - I CAN'T STOP LAUGHING!!

    Kefah - please - tell Allah about Wikipedia - quickly!

    He's gotta get a clue!!
    allah know everything in universe before it happen
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  13. #143
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    lets face it, only humans "create" a superior beings.

    look at it this way. If Humans did not exists, would there be a god?

    would the animals or vegetation worship a higher deity ???? of course not. Animals couldn't careless of there is a superior being.
    I only drink a little, but when I do
    I turn into another person and THAT person drinks a lot

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