Page 3 of 4 FirstFirst 1234 LastLast
Results 27 to 39 of 45
  1. #27
    Join Date
    Sep 2006
    Location
    Chicago
    Posts
    474
    Quote Originally Posted by itsiceman View Post
    If no torque wrench pressurize to max test pressure and tighten till it stops leaking ;-)
    Thats what I do. I gernerally dont make flares. On pressure controls, ultracap and things I make them tight and if they leak I tighten until they stop leaking. What else are you going to do. I've gone way past 1/2 turn after hand tight. Most pre made flares are double flared.

  2. #28
    Join Date
    Sep 2005
    Location
    Atlanta GA area
    Posts
    21,171
    In my area... pre-made linesets for mini-s tend to have bad flares... Both LG and Fujitsu recommend to cut them off and re-make them to proper (410) specs.

    Just for fun, did a comparison between a supplied flare and a proper 410 flare: The one I made was slightly wider, and the angle was a little different.

    Using an offset flaring tool is a good idea also.
    GA-HVAC-Tech

    Quality work at a fair price with excellent customer service!

    Romans Ch's 5-6-7-8

    2 Chronicles 7:14

  3. #29
    Join Date
    Aug 2009
    Location
    Maine
    Posts
    3,330
    My findings mirrored yours, I haven't looked at Dakin line sets though bet they cost more.

    Quote Originally Posted by ga-hvac-tech View Post
    In my area... pre-made linesets for mini-s tend to have bad flares... Both LG and Fujitsu recommend to cut them off and re-make them to proper (410) specs.

    Just for fun, did a comparison between a supplied flare and a proper 410 flare: The one I made was slightly wider, and the angle was a little different.

    Using an offset flaring tool is a good idea also.

  4. #30
    Join Date
    Sep 2008
    Location
    Western PA
    Posts
    25,671
    Quote Originally Posted by summerhelp View Post
    I guess feel is a lost art I use torque wrench as needed on critical rotating equipment.I say no developed feel use torquewrench
    Too many other factors can affect the "feel" method.

    Quote Originally Posted by mark beiser View Post
    A torque wrench with a high enough scale to torque your car's head bolts wouldn't be very useful for torquing flare nuts anyway.
    Just an excuse to buy MORE TOOLS...


  5. #31
    Join Date
    Sep 2010
    Location
    miami,fl.
    Posts
    623
    I see johnstone has a set forsale I don't do many minisplilts but if I purchase this set can I use then for regular flare nuts or maybe the regular ones on r22 are smaller not as bulky if that's the case then the wrench would slip off the r22 or other flare nuts???? whats your input someone with one of these sets are they only used for 410 flarenuts?? have you used thenm on other style flare nuts

  6. #32
    Join Date
    Jun 2004
    Location
    Eugene, Oregon
    Posts
    1,018
    I don't think there is such a thing as a R410A flare nut. They all take the same size wrenches unless they're metric. I think what GA-HVAC-TECH was referring to is that the flares and the flare nuts on the line sets with flares are of poor quality. They should be removed and you should use a quality flare nut and make your flare using the recommended tools and methods as specified by the R410A mini-splits manufactures. Meaning you should use a gauge for your flares and torque to manufacture specifications.
    The torque wrenches should work on all flare nuts.
    "The bitterness of poor quality remains long after the sweetness of low price is forgotten". --Benjamin Franklin
    "Don't argue with an idiot, they will drag you down to their level and beat you with experience". --Mark Twain
    http://www.campbellmechanical.com

  7. #33
    Join Date
    Sep 2008
    Location
    Western PA
    Posts
    25,671
    Flare nut torque isn't going to be refrigerant specific.

    It's size specific.

    If you get an adjustable wrench and all the needed sizes, you can tighten any flare nut with that setup.

  8. #34
    Join Date
    Sep 2005
    Location
    Atlanta GA area
    Posts
    21,171
    Quote Originally Posted by air1 View Post
    I don't think there is such a thing as a R410A flare nut. They all take the same size wrenches unless they're metric. I think what GA-HVAC-TECH was referring to is that the flares and the flare nuts on the line sets with flares are of poor quality. They should be removed and you should use a quality flare nut and make your flare using the recommended tools and methods as specified by the R410A mini-splits manufactures. Meaning you should use a gauge for your flares and torque to manufacture specifications.
    The torque wrenches should work on all flare nuts.
    As I understand it:

    An 'R-410 flare' is made a little different... to fit a flare fitting and under a flare nut that are also a little different.

    The part which is flared (call it the cone) is a small amount wider... thus more contact space to hold in more pressure.

    You and I do agree on cutting off the flare and flare nut from pre-made linesets... then make a new flare and use the flare nut that came with the mini.
    GA-HVAC-Tech

    Quality work at a fair price with excellent customer service!

    Romans Ch's 5-6-7-8

    2 Chronicles 7:14

  9. #35
    Join Date
    Apr 2012
    Location
    winnipeg
    Posts
    1,330
    Quote Originally Posted by ga-hvac-tech View Post
    As I understand it:

    An 'R-410 flare' is made a little different... to fit a flare fitting and under a flare nut that are also a little different.

    The part which is flared (call it the cone) is a small amount wider... thus more contact space to hold in more pressure.

    You and I do agree on cutting off the flare and flare nut from pre-made linesets... then make a new flare and use the flare nut that came with the mini.
    Really...... a good flare will never leak.... 410-22 -507--134a---404- 502.... 00ps did i sat 502
    it was working.... played with it.... now its broke.... whats the going hourly rate for HVAC repair

  10. #36
    Join Date
    Sep 2005
    Location
    Atlanta GA area
    Posts
    21,171
    Quote Originally Posted by carmon View Post
    Really...... a good flare will never leak.... 410-22 -507--134a---404- 502.... 00ps did i sat 502
    Yes, I agree... work done PROPERLY, and by someone WHO TRIES... performs as it should.

    Now tell me how many folks out there wearing the shoes of techs actually do work properly and try every day... Yeah, I know also.

    IMO the industry sometimes creates parts to compensate for the quality of the average worker... not that there are not better folks doing the work... (you and I and most of H-talk).

    I put in, I think, a dozen give or take mini's last year... have not heard a word from any of them concerning leaks. Pays to do the flares properly...
    BTW: I have not bought a flare nut torque wrench yet... may get one if I see one on sale somewhere.
    GA-HVAC-Tech

    Quality work at a fair price with excellent customer service!

    Romans Ch's 5-6-7-8

    2 Chronicles 7:14

  11. #37
    Join Date
    Jun 2004
    Location
    Eugene, Oregon
    Posts
    1,018
    Quote Originally Posted by ga-hvac-tech View Post
    As I understand it:

    An 'R-410 flare' is made a little different... to fit a flare fitting and under a flare nut that are also a little different.

    The part which is flared (call it the cone) is a small amount wider... thus more contact space to hold in more pressure.

    You and I do agree on cutting off the flare and flare nut from pre-made linesets... then make a new flare and use the flare nut that came with the mini.
    All refrigeration flares are 45 degree flares. There is no difference for the R410A flare fittings. Manufactures of R410A systems do have specific procedures and tools they want used because of the higher pressures involved but the flares are not different. They recommend a clutch type flare tool and torque wrenches to prevent flattening of the copper flare. They are really just trying to make sure the flares are done right, not different.
    If I'm wrong then please enlighten me. It wouldn't be the first time I was wrong. Just ask my wife.
    "The bitterness of poor quality remains long after the sweetness of low price is forgotten". --Benjamin Franklin
    "Don't argue with an idiot, they will drag you down to their level and beat you with experience". --Mark Twain
    http://www.campbellmechanical.com

  12. #38
    Join Date
    Sep 2005
    Location
    Atlanta GA area
    Posts
    21,171
    Quote Originally Posted by air1 View Post
    All refrigeration flares are 45 degree flares. There is no difference for the R410A flare fittings. Manufactures of R410A systems do have specific procedures and tools they want used because of the higher pressures involved but the flares are not different. They recommend a clutch type flare tool and torque wrenches to prevent flattening of the copper flare. They are really just trying to make sure the flares are done right, not different.
    If I'm wrong then please enlighten me. It wouldn't be the first time I was wrong. Just ask my wife.
    Maybe we will get your wife to explain this to you... <grin>

    What I understand (from manufacturers reps, never actually did a comparison) is the physical size of the flare is a little larger. Think like this: When one does a flare, they leave a little of the CO tube sticking out of the clamp, this is the part that is 'flared'--that is; bent to the angle. And we know if we hang out too much CO tube... the flare will be too wide and not pull back into the nut.
    Again as I understand it... a proper 410 flare is just a little wider than a conventional flare.

    Next time I install a mini... If there is time... I will get a flare fitting from the big box home store and compare it to the one on the mini... maybe take a close up pic and see if they are the same. Anyone who wants to do this and post the pic is welcome to do so... Would like to know if the reps are blowing smoke or not.
    GA-HVAC-Tech

    Quality work at a fair price with excellent customer service!

    Romans Ch's 5-6-7-8

    2 Chronicles 7:14

  13. #39
    Join Date
    Sep 2010
    Location
    miami,fl.
    Posts
    623
    Quote Originally Posted by ga-hvac-tech View Post
    Maybe we will get your wife to explain this to you... <grin>

    What I understand (from manufacturers reps, never actually did a comparison) is the physical size of the flare is a little larger. Think like this: When one does a flare, they leave a little of the CO tube sticking out of the clamp, this is the part that is 'flared'--that is; bent to the angle. And we know if we hang out too much CO tube... the flare will be too wide and not pull back into the nut.
    Again as I understand it... a proper 410 flare is just a little wider than a conventional flare.

    Next time I install a mini... If there is time... I will get a flare fitting from the big box home store and compare it to the one on the mini... maybe take a close up pic and see if they are the same. Anyone who wants to do this and post the pic is welcome to do so... Would like to know if the reps are blowing smoke or not.
    I guess comparing them will only be the real truth!! But I have the yellow jacket flaring tool that measures the the depth and deburrs the flare all in one and makes a perfect flare every time. Well I was told back when I got it "oh it even makes the 410a flares". Now. I used this thing plenty of times for other things besides 410a systems so that means if the 410a flare cone was wider then my regular nut wouldn't slide over it! I always thought all flares were the same just the nut was actually fatter and more bulky but the actual flare cone would be the same

Page 3 of 4 FirstFirst 1234 LastLast

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •  
Comfortech Show Promo Image

Related Forums

Plumbing Talks | Contractor Magazine
Forums | Electrical Construction & Maintenance (EC&M) Magazine
Comfortech365 Virtual Event