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  1. #1
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    Mar 2013
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    New Heat Pump suggested

    Hi
    I am new here. I have recently built a home in the country, in eastern Canada , and I plan on putting a heatpump in . The main floor is 1200sq feet and a finished space. 2 bedrooms 10x12 and a bathroom.8x8 The rest of the area is an open space living dining and kitchen combined about 900 sq feet. The kitchen has a 8 ft ceiling while the living and dining area about 500sq ft is open to a vaulted ceiling about 22 ft high. Up stairs is a 500 sq ft finished loft that is open to below and also has a vaulted ceiling 14 ft high.

    The front faces south east and is a wall of 10 windows (3' x 6') each, 6 on front downstairs and 4 on front upstairs as well as 3 on side downstairs. They are low e argon and on a sunny winters day I don't use any heat. The walls have R 20 the ceiling R 39.

    The basement is unfinished and is well insulated 2" foamboard and R11 fiberglass.

    I was recomended a 3 ton FT4BF Westinghouse HP and B6VMAX Air handeler with 15k aux heat.

    There was no load caculation done. The most I pay now a month in the winter is 300 /month for electric baseboard heat and a propane fireplace.

    Is this a good combination? is it oversized?

    Thanks

    Jimmy

  2. #2
    Join Date
    Aug 2010
    Location
    West Monroe, LA
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    Quote Originally Posted by JimmyP View Post
    Hi
    I am new here. I have recently built a home in the country, in eastern Canada , and I plan on putting a heatpump in . The main floor is 1200sq feet and a finished space. 2 bedrooms 10x12 and a bathroom.8x8 The rest of the area is an open space living dining and kitchen combined about 900 sq feet. The kitchen has a 8 ft ceiling while the living and dining area about 500sq ft is open to a vaulted ceiling about 22 ft high. Up stairs is a 500 sq ft finished loft that is open to below and also has a vaulted ceiling 14 ft high.

    The front faces south east and is a wall of 10 windows (3' x 6') each, 6 on front downstairs and 4 on front upstairs as well as 3 on side downstairs. They are low e argon and on a sunny winters day I don't use any heat. The walls have R 20 the ceiling R 39.

    The basement is unfinished and is well insulated 2" foamboard and R11 fiberglass.

    I was recomended a 3 ton FT4BF Westinghouse HP and B6VMAX Air handeler with 15k aux heat.

    There was no load caculation done. The most I pay now a month in the winter is 300 /month for electric baseboard heat and a propane fireplace.

    Is this a good combination? is it oversized?

    Thanks

    Jimmy
    Without a load cal. Performed can't say that it is oversized, proper sized or undersized. So a load cal. Needs to be preformed. I would ask the contractor how he or she arrived at that size system without a load cal?

    You might here lines like we have been doing this for 20 plus years and know what size system your home requires due to experience, square foot per ton, etc.... Please don't fall into that trap!!! Why do a load cal? Because its what is needed and ensures proper sizing.

    As far as energy saving goes without knowing for sure what size is really needed it is hard to say. Plus need to know electric rates. Is it going to be one system for the entire home? Please post back. Also what is your main goal with possiably installing the new system? Energy saving, better comfort etc..?

  3. #3
    Join Date
    Mar 2013
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    Hi

    Thanks for your reply duckman. I thought you had to do a load caculation first.
    The rate here is 11.17 cents/ KWh. It will be increasing as they are building a new hydro dam and the prices will rise.

    I am thinking of the cost savings and when I retire in a few years I won't have to pay as much. I am keeping the propane fireplace as it is a 3 sided penunsula built in and on cold nights we could use that as aux heat instead of having heat strips in the AH. Is this possible or will I need them anyway. Our winters are not that cold with an average of -5 C and we have 4888 HDD's. yes I was thinking of one system.

    Jimmy

  4. #4
    Join Date
    Jan 2004
    Location
    PA
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    Get the electric aux anyways. Helps to prevent cold air during defrost cycles.
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    How many times must one fix something before it is fixed?

  5. #5
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    Mar 2013
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    Aux Heat

    Quote Originally Posted by beenthere View Post
    Get the electric aux anyways. Helps to prevent cold air during defrost cycles.
    Thanks beenthere.

    I wonder will a 9kw 3 stage heat work if it it just for defrost cycle and an emergency.

    The manual says that will use a 35 Amp breaker. I am hoping to do this with only a 120 Amp service. 35 for the AH and heat strip and 30 for the HP.

    Jimmy

  6. #6
    Join Date
    Nov 2004
    Location
    SW FL
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    Quote Originally Posted by JimmyP View Post
    Thanks beenthere.

    I wonder will a 9kw 3 stage heat work if it it just for defrost cycle and an emergency.

    The manual says that will use a 35 Amp breaker. I am hoping to do this with only a 120 Amp service. 35 for the AH and heat strip and 30 for the HP.

    Jimmy
    Is the TOTAL FLOOR AREA 1700 square feet?

    How many months of electric use is documented?
    Maximum of $300 does not reveal whether heating cost is 40% or 80% of the total use.

    If you wish to stay with 120 A service, you may have to reduce the heated house size by 30 to 40%.
    I guess you won't be using an electric dryer or hot water tank.
    Designer Dan
    It's Not Rocket Science, But It is SCIENCE with "Some Art". ___ ___ K EEP I T S IMPLE & S INCERE

    Define the Building Envelope and Perform a Detailed Load Calc: It's ALL About Windows and Make-up Air Requirements. Know Your Equipment Capabilities

  7. #7
    Join Date
    Nov 2004
    Location
    SW FL
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    Do you believe your heat loss is < 22,000 BTU/hr at 15'F?
    Designer Dan
    It's Not Rocket Science, But It is SCIENCE with "Some Art". ___ ___ K EEP I T S IMPLE & S INCERE

    Define the Building Envelope and Perform a Detailed Load Calc: It's ALL About Windows and Make-up Air Requirements. Know Your Equipment Capabilities

  8. #8
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    Quote Originally Posted by dan sw fl View Post
    Is the TOTAL FLOOR AREA 1700 square feet?

    How many months of electric use is documented?
    Maximum of $300 does not reveal whether heating cost is 40% or 80% of the total use.

    If you wish to stay with 120 A service, you may have to reduce the heated house size by 30 to 40%.
    I guess you won't be using an electric dryer or hot water tank.
    Dan it is 1200 Sq ft open to above 600 sq ft bedroom in a loft. It is second home in the country and we have used it for over 2 years and plan on retiring there. The heat is on in the winter even if we are not there and without usage and heat on 65 the electric is about 200 I don't have the bills with me.

    Why would you say do without hot water or dryer. A 9 kw/h aux heater shoud give 30MBH if it is on full aux heat. The A/H is only 15 amp so if it isn't on aux heat then should be enough amperage. I also plan on usin Propane when it is really cold. we may only have 10 days a year when it is below 15 and average temp in the winter is 20 or more.

    Thanks

    Jimmy

  9. #9
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    Mar 2013
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    Oh I forgot to add I have 4 ceiling fans that circulate the air down from the high ceiling. I plan on doing a load caculation when I get home with the calculater you can purchase here so I will know more then.

  10. #10
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    SW FL
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    Quote Originally Posted by JimmyP View Post
    Dan it is 1200 Sq ft open to above 600 sq ft bedroom in a loft. It is second home in the country
    and we have used it for over 2 years and plan on retiring there. The heat is on in the winter even if we are not there and without usage

    and heat on 65 the electric is about 200 I don't have the bills with me.
    I believe that
    < ~20,000 BTU/Hr [@ 15'F] for a 900 HDD/ month would be 1,820 kW straight electric/ $200
    Designer Dan
    It's Not Rocket Science, But It is SCIENCE with "Some Art". ___ ___ K EEP I T S IMPLE & S INCERE

    Define the Building Envelope and Perform a Detailed Load Calc: It's ALL About Windows and Make-up Air Requirements. Know Your Equipment Capabilities

  11. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by dan sw fl View Post
    I believe that
    < ~20,000 BTU/Hr [@ 15'F] for a 900 HDD/ month would be 1,820 kW straight electric/ $200
    Dan

    What does that mean? if I am loosing 20000 BTUs/hr? do I need the Aux heat. I was thinking of experimenting with just the 9kw 3 phase and if i can't get buy with that I would have to do an electrical upgrade. Ca I add more to the AH afterwards?

  12. #12
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    Nov 2004
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    SW FL
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    Thumbs up Final Performance and Equipment Selection dependent on formal Heat Loss calc

    A great Northern climate heat pump would be the CARRIER model Greenspeed.
    Attached Images Attached Images
    Designer Dan
    It's Not Rocket Science, But It is SCIENCE with "Some Art". ___ ___ K EEP I T S IMPLE & S INCERE

    Define the Building Envelope and Perform a Detailed Load Calc: It's ALL About Windows and Make-up Air Requirements. Know Your Equipment Capabilities

  13. #13
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    Mar 2013
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    Aux Heat

    Quote Originally Posted by dan sw fl View Post
    A great Northern climate heat pump would be the CARRIER model Greenspeed.

    Thanks Dan. they are impressive numbers.

    Would you still need some heat when it goes to defrost mode or could you get away without, or would a 9kw 3 stage be sufficient. From what I read they are designed to eliminate the need for aux heat, though that option is available.I will know more once a load calc is done.

    Jimmy

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