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  1. #1
    Join Date
    May 2006
    Location
    east central indiana
    Posts
    1,117

    Hmm What's up with that, Tempstar?

    I've seen this a couple times this winter, kind of wondering if anyone else has also?
    BTW, I didn't condemn this particular furnace, I only uninstalled it



    This is from a 1997 Tempstar mid-efficiency. Though this side is worse, it's actually cracked on both sides of the cell:



    I did kind of an autopsy on this puppy back at the shop. In my free time of course
    With the burner rack gone


    Looking into the center cell

    That spiraly rod (NOx rod?), the end of it is touching the sidewall of the heat exchanger. I think it was guiding the fire and / or transmitting the heat directly onto that area.

  2. #2
    Join Date
    May 2006
    Location
    east central indiana
    Posts
    1,117
    Here's another one I found back in November, I think. 1996 Tempstar mid-efficiency

    Looking into the cell, with that spiral rod removed. Note the crack there towards the front left


    A look at the heat exchanger removed. Looks to possibly be a tad overfired perhaps, on the nearer cell. The crack is in the farther cell, which doesn't look to have been as warm overall


    Again, the rod was touching the sidewall, right where the crack is


    Anyone else seeing this failure on these?



    Here's a bonus pic, no crack on this one, but a popped crimp ring. 1992 Tempstar mid-efficiency

  3. #3
    Join Date
    May 2006
    Location
    east central indiana
    Posts
    1,117
    Gee...I was kinda hoping for just a little bit of feedback...?
    Maybe this is old news to everyone else?

  4. #4
    Join Date
    Jul 2004
    Location
    IN THE CRAWL SPACE
    Posts
    1,536
    Quote Originally Posted by 4l530 View Post
    Gee...I was kinda hoping for just a little bit of feedback...?
    Maybe this is old news to everyone else?

    Na we're out checking them tempstar H.X.s we missed
    Relax, all right? My old man is a television repairman, he's got this ultimate set of tools. I can fix it.

  5. #5
    Join Date
    Aug 2004
    Location
    North Richland Hills, Texas
    Posts
    14,914
    Those stupid NOx reducing inserts have caused problems for just about every brand that uses them. My understanding is that they are required in all furnaces in California.

    Just look at what happened to Consolodated when they added them to their furnaces sold in California without doing enough R&D...

    I have had tech reps from 2 different brands, Nordyne and ICP, tell me straight up to take them out when I see them in a natural gas fired furnace I'm servicing!
    Just don't confuse the turbilators in the outlet of some heat exchangers with anti NOx inserts, the NOx inserts are always in the inlet. The LP conversion for some furnaces also has inserts that look a lot like an anti NOx insert, but it is not, and removing it could spell disaster for the HX.

    Some NOx inserts look like a piece of hardware screen in the inlet of the HX, some look like a spring in an odd vertical mount across the inlet. I'm sure there are other types that I have not seen. They are not required anywhere in Texas that I am aware of yet.
    If more government is the answer, then it's a really stupid question.

  6. #6
    Join Date
    May 2006
    Location
    east central indiana
    Posts
    1,117

    Gentlemen,

    Thank you kindly for the replies,

    I had heard of the $hlt sandwich that was Consolidated, and after seeing a couple of these, I wondered whether ICP had a problem of sorts with the NOx rods also.
    When I went to replace the HX in the second set of photos, the counter guy at the distributor let me know I was free to leave them out of the new one.

    Now I'm wondering whether NOx rods in general could be bad news. Although I understand they are required in California and possibly some other localities.
    Maybe I'll ask about it in the tech forum. I greatly appreciate all the knowledge and insight the fine people on this site make available.


  7. #7
    Join Date
    Aug 2004
    Location
    North Richland Hills, Texas
    Posts
    14,914
    lol, nice pic of a Consolodated furnace. I love when I find one bad and the customer asks if I really have to shut it down.

    Take them up in the attic and show them the burners all warped and melted in half, and the scorch marks up the side of the furnace, they change their tune.

    My favorite is when the furnace is stuffed back close to the roof line and there are visible scorch marks on the underside of the roof. Melted flex duct is kinda cool too.
    If more government is the answer, then it's a really stupid question.

  8. #8
    Join Date
    Jan 2007
    Location
    Norco, California
    Posts
    5
    In California I have replaced several of the recalled furnaces and the manufacturers have been giving the homeowner a new furnace free of charge. They only have to pay for the installation.

  9. #9
    Join Date
    Mar 2005
    Location
    Phoenix, AZ
    Posts
    636
    It depends on the install.

    There are a lot of old homes in Phoenix that used to only have a swamp cooler. It was strapped to the side of the house, up in the air, at ceiling-duct level.

    How do you put in a gas pack?

    On the ground, then an S-transition to connect the venting.

    But too often, the diameter of the ductwork was too small. Not enough air could get through. Know what that does?

    (1) Heat rise is so high on the furnace, it trips the supply air safety.
    (2) Blower keeps running to cool off the HX.
    (3) Before the blower trips off, the safety closes again, causing the burners to light back up.
    (4) The cycle repeats itself all winter long.

    Short, short cycling a HX will crack it fast. In 1-2 years.
    I've diagnosed tons of those in Phoenix in the past.

  10. #10
    Join Date
    Jan 2007
    Posts
    451
    Inner City products....find another distributor....

  11. #11
    Join Date
    Jan 2005
    Location
    35 miles from Tunica (casinos)
    Posts
    151

    Failed heat exchanger

    I have replace two h/x on carrier 48GJ 006-012 in the past month, I think all manufacturers are having problems. There are only so many heat exchanger manufactures out there. May be it's not the assemblers (carrier, Lennox, Trane, etc.) bty these units are only 5 yrs old.

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