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  1. #1
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    Location
    Maryland
    Posts
    6

    Quadrafire Castile Insert Problem ??????

    Hi Folks,

    Have been a lurker here for some time and have received a great deal of good info over the years. I now have a problem that I have not seen listed here in the past, at least I can’t find anything in the forum that relates to this problem.

    I have a Quadrafire Castile Insert, had it about 6 years and has been working flawlessly since new. It now will start normally via the thermostat and run normally for hours and then I find the call light on and no fire or unburned pellets in the firebox. If I hit the reset button, it will light and run normally and the same thing will happen, which may take an hour or more. Initially I thought it was not restarting during the day or night until yesterday when I was in the room while it was running. It seemed to be doing fine and then just stopped feeding pellets, and eventually the fire would go out. The auger made no noise oike it was jammed or anything. While this happened everything else seemed to work fine, both fans were running and flame was dancing correctly which told me I didn’t have a flue blockage like I have had in the past.

    I tried to use the reset button when I realized what was happening, but apparently it won’t work until the fire pot temp reduced and the red light went out, then the reset button worked fine and it relit without a problem. During this time the call light was always on as the thermostat was calling for heat. Snap discs seem to check OK and vacuum hose is clear, in the beginning of the season I did a major cleaning , removed auger, both fans etc and everything seemed fine and it has worked flawlessly until about a week or so when this started. I didn’t check the snap disc when this happened, which I will do next time but the way it starts and runs so good at first leads me to believe they are OK. Plus I will have to be present in order to check it, because once it cools for 10 minutes or so it will relight with the reset switch.

    I read a lot about the control box’s going bad but I don’t want to start throwing parts at it, especially expensive ones. I still have the original grey colored box, I understand the new ones are clear. It seems to me that something is getting hot and / or shorting out for a period of time. Any suggestions would be greatly appreciated, we are starting to get into single digits and I need it now.

    Sorry to ramble on just wanted to offer as much information as possible.

    Thanks in advance,
    Butch

  2. #2
    Join Date
    Aug 2004
    Location
    S.E. Pa
    Posts
    6,180
    Butch, there are several things it could be and of course, we cannot diagnose it over the internet and site rules prohibit DIY advice. Having said that, my first recommendation is to get a technician in there to go through it. I would suggest he check out snap disc #2. Anything that reduces the ability of the stove to strip heat away can trip it. Choked vent system, weak combustion blower, heat exchanger coated with fly ash, etc.

    As long as your control board is working, I'd leave it alone.

    Honestly, I service one or two pellet stoves a day right now and so far this season 100% needed to be thoroughly cleaned even thought about 75% of the homeowners assured me they had just cleaned it "really good". Their eyes bug out as I open things up that are packed full of ash and I hear, "oh, I never knew that was back there" or "do you think that has anything to do with my my stove isn't working?" Naaaaah.

    Read your manual about cleaning and make darn sure everything is really clean. All pellet service has to start with a clean stove. To do it right, you'll need to accumulate an assortment of funky brushes,
    hth

  3. #3
    Join Date
    May 2005
    Location
    Madison, WI
    Posts
    1,078
    "17. Snap Disc #2 (Fuel Delivery Interrupt) 250°F
    Snap disc #2 is located on the back side of the feed drop
    tube. There is 1 orange wire and 1 black wire connected to
    it. This snap disc will turn off the feed system, which will turn
    off the appliance if an overfire condition should occur or if the
    convection blower should fail to operate. If this occurs the
    snap disc with automatically reset itself."

    Could be that tripping. Otherwise if its not that I would have to guess the control box.

  4. #4
    Join Date
    Dec 2006
    Location
    NJ
    Posts
    78
    I would not rule out the T/C.

  5. #5
    Join Date
    May 2005
    Location
    Madison, WI
    Posts
    1,078
    Quote Originally Posted by blueflame View Post
    I would not rule out the T/C.
    he said the control box still had the red light on, which means the TC is still sensing 500 degrees or w/e the red light temp is. I suppose it possible it cut out for few seconds though.

  6. #6
    Join Date
    Aug 2004
    Location
    S.E. Pa
    Posts
    6,180

    Smile clarification

    He said the red call light was still on and that the thermostat was still calling for heat----he didn't say the red LED on the control box was lit. Butch, you need to clarify this.

    When the thermocouple senses 200F, the green LED lights telling the igniter you have 3.5 more minutes to get this fire going. Once the TC reaches 600F, it figures the fire is self sustaining so it tells the igniter to shut off and its on its own feeding and firing. As long as its burning, the red LED should stay lit. If it goes out, it could be a bad LED or it could be the unit has shut itself down.

    Butch, when this happens, make sure your thermostat is still calling for heat. If you are a tech, you'll know how to do this. If you're just a homeowner, tell the tech to do this. The visible appearance of the flames is NOT a reliable indicator of vent patency or the need to clean it. Have the unit cleaned from top to bottom, every nook and cranny.

    When the unit shuts down, have someone handy with a meter check snap disc#2 to see if it tripped. Again, a tech will know how.

    HTH

  7. #7
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    Location
    Maryland
    Posts
    6
    Hearthman and everyone,

    Thanks for the reply's, I will try to clarify and answer your questions.

    Yesterday during the day while no one was home it seemed to work fine, thermostat was set on about 62, no one was home. When I got home I pushed it up to 70, stove ignited and worked fine, after an hour or so at steady running, the auger would just stop dropping pelletts and fire would eventually go out. As soon as I realised the auger was not working I checked Snapdisk # 2 (which is the resetable one) and it was not tripped, had continuity.

    When this happens, the Call Light is on, thermosatat calling for heat as well as both the red and green light on the control box.

    As the fire was almost out I tried to use the reset button and nothing happens until the Red LED goes out, then the reset button will work, guess it waits until firepot temp drops before it lets you reset. After reseting the stove it seemed to work great with the exception of a high flame for the
    first couple of minutes, which calmed down and was fine. Allthough I did notice that it continues to drop pelletts even with the high flame at first until it leveled out, which at the most was 3 minutes.

    During the night I set the thermostat at 62 and seemed to work fine throughout the night. Now that I look back it seeme to be when I have the thermostat pushed up, perhaps something is getting hot !!!

    Also if the # 2 snap disk were to trip, how long would it be before it resets ? The reason I ask, when I realised the auger wasn't feeding it took me about 3-4 minutes to get my meter from my truck to check it, even though it had continuity it still wouldn't feed until I was able to reset it, guess I just answered my own question.

    Sat (2/3) I leave for a 7 day Caribbean cruise that have been planning for a year, and with single digits here in MD, it couldn't come at a better time. If I don't answere for a couple days, pease don't think I am ignoring you. I will have to address this when I return.

    Thanks again for all the responce,
    Butch

  8. #8
    Join Date
    May 2005
    Location
    Madison, WI
    Posts
    1,078
    #2 has to be manually reset, there is no auto reset on it.

    I have not heard of the Green and Red light on the module both being lit at the same time, but you do have an older module which I have not worked on before.



    Also FYI right here he in a round about way states that the Red LED on the control box was in fact on when this happened, until it cooled off, then it would go out (like normal).

    I tried to use the reset button when I realized what was happening, but apparently it won’t work until the fire pot temp reduced and the red light went out, then the reset button worked fine and it relit without a problem. During this time the call light was always on as the thermostat was calling for heat.

  9. #9
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    Location
    Maryland
    Posts
    6
    jto10181,

    Thanks, yes I seem to have an older model, I have a service manual for both and evidently the newer models have a light that is either red or green and a blue light. My version only has two individual led lights red and green Plus the call light fro the thermostat) and under normal operation they will both be lit, one if the stove temp over 200 deg and the other for the firepot temp which I believe is 600.

    I thought the # 2 snapdisc had to be manually reset but wasn't sure.

    Looks as though now I can duplicate the problem, but it takes a while. Everything runs fine during the day with the thermosatat @ 65. In the evening when I push it up to 70 and it runs for an hour or more, it will stop dropping pellets and eventually shut down. Seems as though something is overheating and shutting the auger off. I left he side panel off and the auger motor does not seem to be getting hot to the touch and I don't hear anything binding it just looses power to the auger. Again after about 10 - 15 minutes it will reset and run fine.

    I didn't check the # 3 snapdisc on the auger tube though, but I don't know why that would be tripping, something else I will look at when I get back from my trip, along with a full cleaning again.

    Thanks again for all of the help,
    Butch

  10. #10
    Join Date
    May 2005
    Location
    Madison, WI
    Posts
    1,078
    vacuum switch might be bad. If that malfunctions the blowers still go but the auger stops. It might also be tripping the vac switch for a reason.

    Also disc #3 also has to be manually reset

  11. #11
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    Location
    Maryland
    Posts
    6
    Well I am back off vacation and still have the problem (didn't fix itself) with the weather here in Md have been busy, I am in the Com. HVAC buisness just not real familiar with the pellet stoves as of yet but am learning more each day.

    Again it seems as though it will stop feeding pellets only when the t/stat is up about 70 or so, at night and during the day I put it on 65 and it will work flawlessly, thought something was heating up. So yesterday I came home to a fan squealing as though the bearings were dry. It was the combustion blower, I removed it, cleaned and lubed the bearings that best I could and reinstalled it. Its much quieter but not exactly as quite as before. I know believe this motor is getting hot when running for a long period, as when I push it to 70, and slowing down and tripping the Vacuum switch. Does this seem feasable ? I have done a thourough cleaning including brushing the chimney pipe and can see no restrictions at all.

    I have tried to locate a fan locally and the seven dealers I have called says its on back order from Quad. The P/N # is 8123-4400 if anyone has one. At first I thought it was a regular "C" frame motor but the mounting is evidently special for this application.

    Thanks again for all your help,
    Butch

  12. #12
    Join Date
    May 2005
    Location
    Madison, WI
    Posts
    1,078
    The bearings on those fans don't require lubrication. I think they are sealed and not serviceable. Basically if it breaks like that you replace it. I can check tomorrow if our RDC has any. FYI you typoed the part# its 812-4400. None of our other stores i can check stock on has any. You might just have to wait 2-3 weeks for one to come from Quad.

  13. #13
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    Location
    Maryland
    Posts
    6
    jtp10181,

    Thanks for the reply, it was a typo, shouldn't have been in such a hurry, don't know where tat 3 came from. I called at least 15 local dealers with no luck, I finnally located one in NJ so I guess I will order it from them. I knew the bearings were sealed, just thought I would give it a try, like I said it improved somewhat which convinvced me I was in the right area, but its not right, I guess I will replace the fan. After calling around today, this must be a weak link in this model, everyone stocks this motor they were all on backorder.

    Thanks again for your help, I'll let you know how I make out,
    Butch

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