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  1. #40
    Join Date
    May 2007
    Location
    Dry as a bone Tucson
    Posts
    4,292
    Quote Originally Posted by bearfromobx View Post
    Most of the two stage furnaces arn't 50/50... I've got no problem with an 80/20 being two stage as long as my design specs are the same as the units'...
    Heatwise that works, but in cooling there are more part load hours than peak, so a 50/100 is almost as good as a true vari speed comp.
    Some Talk, Some Do
    "keeping condensing pressures low and evaporator pressures high"
    "Some customers are more interested in comfort than energy savings"
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  2. #41
    Join Date
    Mar 2013
    Location
    Houston, Texas
    Posts
    1
    I've had the same dilemma before. In the end its there money to spend, just nicely tell them the possible risks and get it done.

  3. #42
    Join Date
    Jul 2008
    Location
    Rochester NY
    Posts
    4,721
    Quote Originally Posted by Barrettservices View Post
    Have a client with a large new home (3560) being built that I bid 6 months ago and listening to the customer requests I sized the systems at 84kbtu total like every other company and got the job. It is now time to do the install and I have since learned the value of right sizing equipment and not using the ol' 500sqft method anymore.

    The issue is that I have now taken a closer look at this home and title 24 (prepared by an independent company) calls for a minimum of 36kbtu. I now want to revise the system down for efficiency and longevity issues to 72kbtu which will only change the condensers down a half ton each, no change on the furnace coil to stick with the same seer/eer ratings and maintain proper airflow.
    I just went to a "Dry Climate Home Performance Contractors Forum" at Lake Comanche. What a great area you live in. I also went to the CEC in Sacramento.

    There are some really sharp folks you may want to connect with who can help when you run into these problems, which sound likely now that you are on the performance path. You might consider getting into Energy Upgrade California.

    Let me know if you want introductions.
    Which makes more sense to you?
    CONSERVATION - turning your thermostat back and being uncomfortable. Maybe saving 5-10%
    ENERGY EFFICIENCY - leaving your thermostat where everyone is comfortable. Saving 30-70%

    DO THE NUMBERS! Step on a HOMESCALE.
    What is comfort? Well, it AIN'T just TEMPERATURE!

    Energy Obese? An audit is the next step - go to BPI.org, or RESNET, and find an auditor near you.

  4. #43
    Join Date
    Oct 2012
    Location
    Sacramento,ca
    Posts
    196
    Quote Originally Posted by tedkidd View Post
    I just went to a "Dry Climate Home Performance Contractors Forum" at Lake Comanche. What a great area you live in. I also went to the CEC in Sacramento.

    There are some really sharp folks you may want to connect with who can help when you run into these problems, which sound likely now that you are on the performance path. You might consider getting into Energy Upgrade California.

    Let me know if you want introductions.
    Thanks for the tip however the only reason i had this issue was because i bid the job before seeing it and won't be doing that again. I have been doing energy saving systems for homeowners for nearly two years now and not had one of them question my sizing because i am doing manual j on the spot.

    Now for my soapbox:

    As for energy upgrade California luckily i stay very busy without having to get involved with any of these programs. It seems to be all the big companies around here that are involved with it and good for them, its just not for me and my company. I know it sounds like a great program on the surface, who wouldn't want $5000 plus in rebates for upgrading their house, more energy efficiency plus its an easy sell for the contractor. The catch is you have to spend $25k plus to get all of the rebates unless your poor they will just pay for it with my tax dollars and utility costs.

    I will not get involved as a matter of principal with that program or any other that directly jacks up the electric rates on the wealthier parts of the cities or residents to fund its rebate program. Taken directly from their site :"Funding comes from the utilities' ratepayers under the auspices of the California Public Utilities Commission in addition to incremental funding from the Department of Energy." There are some wealthier parts of this city that are paying over $600 per month for their electric and using less kwh than i use in my little home.

    I am sick and tired of seeing our rates increase in the name of energy efficiency. Our residents have spent millions on the installation of solar panels and now that the utilities are getting all this free electricity they decide to not only take our tier 2 pricing to 18 cents per kwh but now are proposing a special summer rate between the hours of 1pm and 6pm of .75 cents per kwh, a 300% increase during those hours, INSANE! It seems the more efficient our city gets the more they bill us. But they think as long as they are offering huge rebates no one will notice that they took the money from us already and are just giving it back another way. The best part is the rebates on most systems that are installed around here don't even cover the full permit process so you are not really saving anything and thats why most companies fly under the radar not pulling permits.

    I am all for saving energy but it needs to pencil and robbing the rich or the feds taking us deeper in debt to pay for it has to stop. The average system around here already costs $9,500 installed once you add all the permits, fee's,etc in and i don't care how efficient your system is you'll never get that money back in less than 20 years.

    Sorry for my rant but i wish the gestapo in charge would start looking at things more logically instead of just digging us a deeper hole and robbing the affluent all in the name of efficiency.

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