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  1. #1

    Heat pump gave up the ghost need help in purchase decision

    Hi All-
    Our heat pump quit working last week... It's 20 years old, so I knew it was coming.
    Our heating situation is this:
    Live in Pac NW in a colder area outside of Seattle.
    2100 sq foot rambler built in the late 80's
    Propane aux heat, furnace 80 percent efficient, also from the 80's, this is installed in a hall closet, kind of loud in the bedrooms when it fires up, it is currently turned off so we don't use the propane ( $$$)
    Woodstove in main living area we use it alot- in fact we haven't missed our heat pump too much- we like it cool in the bedrooms anyway- oh and that is one area of problem- the Master bedroom gets too hot and stuffy when the furnace is on. But the woodstove will be a hassle in spring and Autumn when we only need heat for the mornings and evenings, and sometimes we don't want to go to the trouble of building a fire.

    I have gotten a lot of quotes- from $ to $$, replacing the outside unit only with a "dry" Goodman to top of the line 2 stage vs system including new 80 percent furnace. Also have gotten quotes from 2 1/2 ton to 3 ton system. Our system is a Coleman Dex xii evcon, with a Payne indoor furnace. I can't read the model number so I don't know the tonnage- it seemed to be okay sized when it was working properly, but I would like the propane back up to come on very infrequently if possible. No one has done a calculation as far as I know.

    I'm having a hard time figuring out what the best choice is. We plan to continue living here for a long time ( at least 10 more years)

    I kind of like the ductless heat pumps for the individual zones ( similar to what we're doing with the woodstove now) but we already have ducts , and they are unattractive and from what I've heard, expensive.
    As far as brands , I've read bad reviews about lennox , and Carrier seems to complicated,
    but that's about all I have read.
    I would appreciate any advice!
    Thanks
    Last edited by beenthere; 03-01-2013 at 05:24 PM. Reason: price range

  2. #2
    Oh I forgot to add that the propane furnace is next to the propane water heater and share a vent, so that could be a consideration when replacing the furnace. ( the water heater also needs to be replaced ;(

  3. #3
    FWIW Hubby thinks that with the redundancy of heating appliances, maybe we should just get the dry unit and replace the furnace when it goes.
    This would be a mismatch with the coil, from what I understand, so not as efficient as it could be, but def cheaper. For an extra bit of change we could get the Goodman with a properly matched coil.

  4. #4
    Join Date
    Jan 2004
    Location
    Lancaster PA
    Posts
    67,929
    Get a matching system as far as the heat pump goes. 13 or 14 SEER. Replace furnace when it dies down the road.



    PS: Prices are not allowed, not even price ranges.
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  5. #5
    Join Date
    May 2008
    Location
    Missouri
    Posts
    3,505
    If your using the heat pump, it's always best to get a matched coil with new heat pump. Otherwise you may be buying nothing but troubles and a very short life for the outside heat pump unit. An older 20 yr. old A coil will not nearly match up with a new 13 SEER heat pump, and this mis-match could easily doom the new heat pump in very short order! As to brand, just get whatever brand from a good dealer who'll stand behind what he (or she) installs. I'd imagine a good dealer will also warn you about this mis-match. For goodness sake, don't purchase a unit over the internet and have some jack-leg buddy hook it up. You'd probably get more heat by simply burning the money itself in your woodstove. Regardless of brand, get the matched indoor A coil with the heat pump and if you're going that route, it's usually cheaper to simply go with a 410a freon unit and you'll have the new cheaper freon that way!

  6. #6
    Sorry about posting prices. I didn't realize that ranges weren't allowed.
    Thanks for the help! And yes the furnave guy said the mis-matched coil would have disadvantages. I appreciated that he gave me lots of options.
    thanks again!

  7. #7
    Just noticed the bid for the new outside unit 13 SEER and coil includes something called a Super Boost- what is this?
    thanks

  8. #8
    Join Date
    Nov 2004
    Location
    SW FL
    Posts
    6,274
    3-ton Bryant Preferred Heat Pump 9.5+ HSPF or equal

    R-24 Ceiling
    R-13 Walls
    U- 0.5 Windows
    Infiltration < 0.4 Air Changes per Hour
    Heat Loss should be < 29,000 BTU/hr at 20'F.

    Annual operating cost < $630

    No furnace needed in Pacific NW

    9 KW total ( three 3 kW) electric strips
    Designer Dan
    It's Not Rocket Science, But It is SCIENCE with "Some Art". ___ ___ K EEP I T S IMPLE & S INCERE

    Define the Building Envelope and Perform a Detailed Load Calc: It's ALL About Windows and Make-up Air Requirements. Know Your Equipment Capabilities

  9. #9
    well the$ 630 sounds nice- I would be a little concerned about the ( albeit rare) times when we get a cold spell of 15 degrees or so?
    thanks!

  10. #10
    Join Date
    Jul 2006
    Location
    Virginia
    Posts
    4,633
    you could replace the heat pump and evaporator coil now and the furnace later. with the current pricing on r22 i would not even consider a dry unit.
    We really need change now

  11. #11
    Join Date
    Nov 2004
    Location
    SW FL
    Posts
    6,274

    Typical Heat Pump Performance

    Quote Originally Posted by crowinghen View Post
    well the$ 630 sounds nice- I would be a little concerned about the ( albeit rare) times when we get a cold spell of 15 degrees or so?
    thanks!
    About 2 days out of 3 years one may have to -wear a sweater- in the late evening or early morning when it's < 18'F outside creating ~68'F inside.
    Of course, there may be some people who set the thermostat to 67'F late evening or early morning which would be satisfied.

    Below 28'F, one 3 kW strip would be needed.
    ___ " .. 22'F, two 3 kw strips " ...." .... "
    __.... " .. 18'F, three 3 kw strips ... " .... "

    based on the thermal envelope described in post # 8 above.
    Ceiling R -24 + Walls R-13 or more
    Window Area of 250 sq feet at U value of 0.5 or less.

    Must assure < 0.4 ACH By Testing and achieve this level with caulking / sealing.
    http://www.energyconservatory.com/ap...ting-buildings
    Attached Images Attached Images
    Last edited by dan sw fl; 03-02-2013 at 04:47 AM. Reason: add link
    Designer Dan
    It's Not Rocket Science, But It is SCIENCE with "Some Art". ___ ___ K EEP I T S IMPLE & S INCERE

    Define the Building Envelope and Perform a Detailed Load Calc: It's ALL About Windows and Make-up Air Requirements. Know Your Equipment Capabilities

  12. #12
    Join Date
    Jan 2004
    Location
    Lancaster PA
    Posts
    67,929
    Quote Originally Posted by crowinghen View Post
    Just noticed the bid for the new outside unit 13 SEER and coil includes something called a Super Boost- what is this?
    thanks
    Its a device to help the compressor start.
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