ReplyNo, just HC, no FCOriginally Posted by jdwendling
God Speed, Jim. We'll miss you - 2-26-23
So its already subject to phase down.
Professional Member
No, just HC, no FC
Professional Member
As of July 9, 2014 they are still selling Frost 22a at Rural King
Other sellers on ebay of a brand called Frostycool 22a says:
Attention United States Customers:
Do Not order 22a products if the intended use is in a Central Residential or Central Commercial Air Conditioning System. Allowable uses can be determined by reviewing the regulations below or visiting the E.P.A website. In the United States the E.P.A. (Environmental Protection Agency) regulations state that it is illegal to use any hydrocarbon refrigerant and/or FrostyCool 22a refrigerant in a Central Residential or Central Commercial Air Conditioning System. FrostyCool 22a will be discontinued and not available for Sale in the United States as of July 31, 2014.
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They were bold enough to advertise directly to consumer as a handy DIY problem solver product with the expectation that they do not possess expertise.
While I'm no legal expert, I think there's a case for property damage claim when the manufacturer and vendor knew or should have known it will cause damage, but did not disclose it. Those fuel line magnet thing is a waste of money, ineffective but mostly harmless and easy to undo. Using hydrocarbon based consumer refrigerant product can make a system that worked ok but possibly low on charge into a code violation that is no longer fit for use until the violation is corrected.
If adding Frost 22a cause the system to become a violation of IMC 1104.3.2 and no longer legal to operate, I'd think that the cost of professional assistance needed to reverse the violation to make it legal is a valid damage claim.
Maybe you can add it, but since venting exemption on HC does not extend to non SNAP approved substitutes, the proper removal of 22a requires professional service.
Unlike someone who goes against common good judgment and do things like adding Blue Rhino ito his A/C, this type of product mislead the consumer about the hazards and enticed them into doing something illegal.
when some fool adds barbecue propane into his A/C system, nobody trickled him into it and its common knowledge that danger extremely flammable fuel gas burns. "natural environmentally friendly 2nd generation hydrocarbon high efficiency refrigerant" is not common sense knowledge of extreme flammability.
If auto parts store blasted an ad for horsepower boost kit consisting of a metal pipe, a saw zall jig, clamps and an instruction manual detailing how to chop the round thing with some ceramic sponge thing in it and replace it with the pipe in the kit, I'd say there's a good chance the parts shop/kit manufacturer is liable for the repair cost to bring that vehicle legal again. it's not hard to prove doing exactly as said in instructions caused the damage.
IMC is nationally recognized and adopted by most states. It is not some unusual ordinance used by very few towns.
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Since I have a freon detector and combustible gas leak detector Im ready to work on these units
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The only units legally using flammable refrigerants are certain SMALL domestic and commercial refrigeration units that came from the factory as such. Otherwise, if you happen to discover any equipment NOT designed for these flammable refrigerants, but discover that someone put some in it, I advise not touching it. NO HVAC units are LEGAL with that stuff in them.
Certification training can be gotten from RSES and manufacturers of the LEGAL HC-based refrigeration units.
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Ask the manufacturer first before relying on them. Legitimate drop-ins such as 438A and 422B have about 3% hydrocarbon for oil return aid and they might set off a false alarm.
Rural King Frost 22a hasn't specifically been named on FBI program but the fact that it is available in walk-in store is a tremendous concern.
http://www.fbi.gov/stats-services/vi...e-refrigerants
I read another tech's post on a different forum that he picked up a landlord client who said their rentals used unconventional special refrigerant called "Environment something 22A" 30 freaking unit apartment building with highly flammable hydrocarbon explosive refrigerant charged units! Who wants anything to do with that?
This is an ultimate what if situation. What would happen if a building is on fire and there's 30 three pound sealed jugs of propane sitting on the roof?
The problem is that there's no guidance in place to deal with this type of dangerous situation. What would do you do when you find cracked heat exchangers? I think same procedures apply.
You don't have the right tools and training to work in potentially explosive environment. If you work on it and something happens, it's on you. If you do nothing and something happens, it could be on you for not acting according to professional duty.
With that much dangerous stuff and people's life are at stake, this is perhaps the one situation when you walk and call code enforcement/AHJ to report possible Life health and safety violation, IMC 1104.3.2 rental units with A3 flammable refrigerant. Declined to service after told by landlord that he has 30 rental units having AC systems filled with highly flammable product called ES-22a (or Frost 22a or Duracool Coolant Express Redtek or whatever...) and labeled Liquefied Petroleum Gas UN 1075
I'm sure they'll figure out a way to deal with it. ATF, bomb squad, whatever, but by not touching it and reporting it, you passed the problem onto the AHJ to deal with.
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