Old Manitowoc ice machine refrigerant.

[Jpares89]

First let me start by saying I'm a long time reader first time poster and have always valued the useful information over the last few years. This is the first fourm I've come across that has real information instead of hacks telling me just mix refrigerants, "fuc* da rules".

Anyway.. I got a complete 1994 Manitowoc 600lb ice machine (water cooled) for free. The machine has been sitting in a shut down restaurant for 10 years. Brought it home, wired and plumbed it, ran it, and saw the bottom line on the evaporator frosting up but the evaporator seemed to stay pretty warm and failed to produce ice. So I checked the pressures and my suction was -15"HG while my head pressure was 55~60PSI during the freeze cycle. The service manual calls for 19-6PSI suction and 125-130PSI head with the ambient air temp of 70o F. With that being said it has just about no refrigerant left in it. It was originally charged with 32oz of R12. So I think I'm going to evacuate the system and recharge it. Now for my question.. Can I use R290 (propane) as an R12 alternative being that it carries the mineral oil from the compressor? BEFORE you all nail me to the cross and crucify me for mentioning propane I personally feel it is a terrible idea to use it in automotive or any other kind of Air conditioning. It is widely used in Europe and various other parts of the world. Now I have seen people use it in refrigerators and heard of possible ignition problems with evaporator or condenser fan motors and the defrost timer too. But this is a water cooled unit that is going to sit in my pool house screen porch and maybe be used 10 times a year. I would LOVE to just use R414B (Hot Shot) and be done with it but I cant justify buying a 25lb keg for $250 and using only like $30 of it. Any thoughts, insights, help and insults would be great. Thanks. By the way I've been researching this topic for about 3 weeks now and get mixed schools on this. Some people swear by it others not so much. I just would use it in any air conditioner especially automotive systems.

[Jpares89]

Forgot to mention it's a TXV system not a capillary tube.

[Mike19]

At one time you could buy hot shot in the small cans to use in a car. I don't know if any of the auto parts stores sell them where you are.

[grkmano]

They sell the small cans online search for them.


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[Tommy knocker]

If you are seriously considering propane, I do not suggest that by the way, finding and repairing leaks FIRST is highly recommended. I'd do hot shot if I didn't have a little 12 stashed away. Finding and fixing the leaks will most likely require a trace charge and ELD. 22 will work fine for that.

[coolerguy]

Why not just use some 134a? If its just a beater, and used occasionally it should run for awhile like that even though the oil miscibility is non exsistant. I wouldn't advise propane. Think of this you get a very small leak, the propane accumulates in that box, then bam, the contactor pulls in.. not a good scenario

[2sac]

Where is Feng when you need him?

[Tommy knocker]

Where is Feng when you need him?

Still on bed rest. That was a very long train he fell under.

[Jpares89]

Another thing that popped up was this stuff called ES12.

[Jpares89]

Thank you all for your responses! I did consider putting R134A in it but it will eventually lead to compressor failure and the machine is almost mint so if I plan to sell it I would like it to last. I think I'm just going to go with hot shot. The more research I do the more I question using propane as a refrigerant. The only people who seem to tell me its a great idea are back yard half-assers who don't have access to the correct materials. Just because it works or because other people do it does not mean it's a good idea. Also I read that your average BBQ grill propane has a high moisture content. If that's true it will just create more problems.

[KB Cool]

ebay has all the r-12 you need!

[itsiceman]

Yep thats what it was and "Failure to install new TXV will result in compressor failure"

http://www.manitowocice.com/docs/upl...ns/8009663.pdf

[Jpares89]

Yep thats what it was and "Failure to install new TXV will result in compressor failure"

http://www.manitowocice.com/docs/upl...ns/8009663.pdf

Yep, Have every book. And I just remembered that one. Options options options.... Way too many damn refrigerants out there...

[Jpares89]

ebay has all the r-12 you need!

You are correct with that!

[itsiceman]

If it's mint and you want to do it right I'm almost positive R-401A was the recommended juice from the factory.

[coolerguy]

Wasnt that HP80 in a small green can ? or was it HP81 ? I think HP 81 was 404a.....

[CFESAmasterEGSR]

R409a is another R12 replacement.

[grkmano]

I have a can of that expensive:banghead:

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[2sac]

HP 80 was in the small green can

[MicahWes]

15 inch vacuum on evap? Doesn't anyone think that he has a TXV problem first and foremost? It probably has a full charge.