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  1. #27
    Join Date
    Jul 2000
    Location
    Northern Wisconsin
    Posts
    2,036
    Motoguy128, I agree that the conversation hasn't established the validity of the bills one way or the other. What was established though is that the customer believes they are "sky high" and that, in my way of looking at things, is always validity enough until facts are presented that prove things one way or the other.

    All of us joining in on this conversation, being the professionals that we are, would have done minimal things if we were at her home to answer her questions. We would have done the heating load calculations, verified that the equipment sizing was correct, checked the controls to verify they were working properly in all respects, checked the equipment and every other part of the system to verify that it was operating and installed and functioning correctly. We would have provided her with the facts we found either verbally or written and then patiently walked her through the understanding process needed to grasp the information so that her perception could be replaced by these facts. Would things change or stay the same is anyone's guess at this point.

    From the beginning her contractor has failed her. There were beginning issues with the install which supposedly were corrected. A second person was brought in to verify that the job was done right, but seems to have done nothing but do a walk through and make claims and suggestions that don't seem to have been backed up with any facts. The contractor has now used that "experts" observations to distance himself from his basic responsibilities as a contractor having taken this customer's money in return for providing a service.

    I call them like I see them. The contractor either doesn't have the knowledge, experience or facts to personally back up his own work and explain to the customer why things are the way they are, or he simply chooses not to. Experience leads me to believe that he can't back up his work for any number of reasons and is hoping that human nature (of the customer) will just make this all go away and he can go onto the next job never learning a thing.

    The facts are the only things that are going to ultimately resolve this issue for the customer one way or the other. Who provides these facts so the customer can finally have peace of mind is now the customer's choice.

    To the homeowner, Minnish, I do hope that you find the answers and that you share your findings with this forum.
    Use the biggest hammer you like, pounding a square peg into a round hole does not equal a proper fit.

  2. #28
    Join Date
    Dec 2002
    Location
    Rochester, MN
    Posts
    5,305
    What is the make/model of t-stat? A higher end t-stat w/ outdoor sensor can lock out the Aux heat.

  3. #29
    I finally have some answers! First we had an insulation guy come out and check the house. It certainly can benefit from added insulation so I imagine we will be doing that shortly. I am also incredibly lucky to live near the wonderful RoBoTeq and he came out and took a look at our system. Again, I was not there for this as I was working (I miss all the good stuff!). From what was relayed to me there are significant installation issues. The greatest of which seems to be that the ducting is far too small, 8" instead of 14", causing major pressure issues. I hope RoBoTeq can explain more fully what he found. I give him full reign to explain everything, if I attemped it would sound like "there is some filter in the return, it's too close to something else so the air isn't moving right." Not exactly technically specific. He has given us a few names that his company recommends. I will be looking into each of them and bringing them out for an estimate so we can finally take care of this.

    I was hoping that our previous contractor would be open to communication from us regarding the issues found so he can learn from this and become a better contractor but only time will tell if he will come around. I doubt we could get him to pay for the new contractor to fix the mistakes he made. This is a very expensive learning experience.

    Again, thank you all. There is no way I can properly express my gratitude for all the wonderful responses and especially for RoBoTeq's kindness and vast experience. A huge weight has been lifted from our shoulders.

  4. #30
    Join Date
    Sep 2002
    Location
    Virginia
    Posts
    3,322
    Quote Originally Posted by Minnish View Post
    I am also incredibly lucky to live near the wonderful RoBoTeq and he came out and took a look at our system. Again, I was not there for this as I was working (I miss all the good stuff )
    Oh no ! Quick , go check your sock drawer , see if all are accounted for , he has this strange fettish , im just sayin
























  5. #31
    Join Date
    Oct 2005
    Location
    Pacific Northwest
    Posts
    2,288
    Quote Originally Posted by Minnish View Post
    We keep the unit set at 68 all the time. The unit is no longer icing over after he discovered he had wired it incorrectly. When it was icing over before it was the entire inside unit and the line running to the house but that seems to be fixed.
    If the indoor coil and/or refrigeration lines were freezing while in the heat mode then that explains a lot!

    Was robo aware of that particular issue when he was there?

  6. #32
    Join Date
    Nov 2000
    Location
    Eastern PA
    Posts
    68,974
    Without going into too much detail at this time, I very much suspect low indoor airflow causing the heat pump to shut down on high head to be at least a main issue with this system. There are obvious ducting issues that are certain to be causing low air volume that I was able to see. Because of the circumstances, I did no invasive testing. The ducting issues definitely need to be addressed before anything else can be done, so there was no need for me to go any further.
    Government is a disease...
    ...masquerading as its own cure…
    Ecclesiastes 10:2 NIV


  7. #33
    Join Date
    Jul 2007
    Location
    Delaware
    Posts
    3,824
    What was wired incorrectly?
    Always here

  8. #34
    Join Date
    Nov 2000
    Location
    Eastern PA
    Posts
    68,974
    Quote Originally Posted by energy star View Post
    What was wired incorrectly?
    The wiring was correct by the time I looked at it. I do still wonder if the thermostat codes for the wiring and functions have been set properly though. Once again, I have to be careful about doing anything more than observing. Since I saw enough that most likely is causing issues, there was no need for me to look any deeper.
    Government is a disease...
    ...masquerading as its own cure…
    Ecclesiastes 10:2 NIV


  9. #35
    Join Date
    Oct 2006
    Location
    The Beach
    Posts
    747
    Hope you fine the problem soon.
    Last edited by lentz; 01-18-2013 at 01:46 PM.
    Blue Fox

  10. #36
    Join Date
    Oct 2006
    Location
    The Beach
    Posts
    747
    Adding more insulation will be a great help also.
    Blue Fox

  11. #37
    Join Date
    Nov 2000
    Location
    Eastern PA
    Posts
    68,974
    Quote Originally Posted by lentz View Post
    Adding more insulation will be a great help also.
    I didn't really see a lot of issue with the insulation. This is a cape cod styled house that has about 6" of bat insulation in the ceiling spaces. The house is also all brick, as mine is. Even if there is no insulation in the walls, as there is none in mine, there is just not that much heat transfer through the walls.
    Government is a disease...
    ...masquerading as its own cure…
    Ecclesiastes 10:2 NIV


  12. #38
    Join Date
    Jan 2009
    Location
    Keokuk, IA
    Posts
    5,520
    Structural brick often has 4 courses with a gap between the pairs. I think that gives you an r value of about 5. The interior course becomes interior thermal mass and peak temps have less effect so so the heat pump runs less in the coldest temps... and better wont need heat strips as much.

    Throw plaster or drywall on framing, and without any insuation you have another maybe r3.


    Sent from my SGPT12 using Tapatalk 2

  13. #39
    Join Date
    Jul 2007
    Location
    Delaware
    Posts
    3,824
    What thermostat does he have. I still say that heat pack is coming on way more than need be. Maybe the heat pack is not staged and is entirely too large.
    Always here

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