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  1. #1

    Goodman vs Rheem/Ruud r22 heat pump

    Hello experts, newbie here, my Lennox 1989 heat pump just died on me, needs compressor and reversing valve.

    I have opted, based on the recommendation of 2 differents techs to change out the heat pump only.

    I have 2 choices: Goodman GSH130301 or Rheem/Ruud 13PJA30A01

    They are both 2.5 ton, my furnace is in the attic and its still running strong, apart from needing a sequencer.

    Price is the same, which do I choose?

    Many thanks

  2. #2
    Join Date
    May 2000
    Location
    Indianapolis, IN, USA
    Posts
    34,475
    Neither, you likely will have trouble mismatching the 13 SEER outdoor unit with the 23 year old indoor coil. Do it right and get a new SYSTEM with matching indoor coil. You may be able to keep the blower or furnace.

  3. #3
    Join Date
    Jan 2004
    Location
    Lancaster PA
    Posts
    68,603
    Don't matter. Not the best solution, unless you like throwing good money after bad.
    Contractor locator map

    How-to-apply-for-Professional

    How many times must one fix something before it is fixed?

  4. #4
    Join Date
    May 2006
    Location
    Austin, Texas
    Posts
    299
    Ask 2 different techs because those 2 are not helping you

  5. #5
    Thank you all for the honest answers.

    Here is some more information.

    I have a 3 ton Lennox circa 1989 heat pump and furnace EC10 for the main floor: these are working OK for now....

    The 2.5 ton heat pump, also Lennox provides heat (furnace lennox CBS19 (up to -35 degrees celcius in Montreal) and cools up to 40 degrees celcius in the summer. The furnace, provides enough heat with 12kw which right now needs a new sequencer(not an expensive repair). The 2.5 ton is adequate according to calculations.
    The R22 lineset goes up into the attic from outside through the brick wall. The consuits are well insulated and the fan runs all the time.

    What system would you install if these 2 techs are not helping me ?

    Do I need a new lineset ? or can the current one be flushed and R401 can be used ?

    What is the issue with just using a R22 heat pump seer 12 with my seer 10 equipment ?

    I have received 2 quotes for complete systems 1000 dollars apart with a new lineset on the outside wall entering into home in the attic

    RUUD UNPL 031 heat pump 2.5 tons and rhsl 36 3 ton furnace
    Trance XR13 2.5 tons and 3 ton Tam 4030

    Thanks for the advice !


    Quote Originally Posted by rglasgow View Post
    Ask 2 different techs because those 2 are not helping you

  6. #6
    Join Date
    May 2000
    Location
    Indianapolis, IN, USA
    Posts
    34,475
    The indoor coil is a critical part of a heat pump SYSTEM. Today's high SEER units, even a "dry" 13 SEER, will want a larger indoor coil than what is there because the system uses more refrigerant than the 10 SEER of 2 decades ago. In heat mode, any system needs less gas so having an undersized condenser inside really compounds the issue. At best you will run high pressures in heat mode causing higher than desired electric bills and excess strain on the compressor. At worst, it will be high enough to trip the internal bypass of the compressor (neither brand uses high pressure switches) and the refrigerant level will have to be adjusted twice a year.

    This is what Rheem says about it: "Failure to properly match the outdoor unit and the indoor coil can result
    in charge imbalance issues, especially in heat pump applications. Charge
    imbalance often results in nuisance calls, reduced system performance,
    and increased operating cost for the user."


    If the right size, the lineset can be left but installing a matching indoor unit will give you the efficiency and lifespan you should get. The UPNL-031 is a fine unit. Match that with a RHLL air handler, a bit more than the RHSL, and you get 14.50 SEER and an excellent 9.50 HSPF which means quite a heating cost savings in your cold climate.

  7. #7
    Thanks for the great advice ! Are you telling me that the same lineset with R22 can be used for R401 ?

    Quote Originally Posted by BaldLoonie View Post
    The indoor coil is a critical part of a heat pump SYSTEM. Today's high SEER units, even a "dry" 13 SEER, will want a larger indoor coil than what is there because the system uses more refrigerant than the 10 SEER of 2 decades ago. In heat mode, any system needs less gas so having an undersized condenser inside really compounds the issue. At best you will run high pressures in heat mode causing higher than desired electric bills and excess strain on the compressor. At worst, it will be high enough to trip the internal bypass of the compressor (neither brand uses high pressure switches) and the refrigerant level will have to be adjusted twice a year.

    This is what Rheem says about it: "Failure to properly match the outdoor unit and the indoor coil can result
    in charge imbalance issues, especially in heat pump applications. Charge
    imbalance often results in nuisance calls, reduced system performance,
    and increased operating cost for the user."


    If the right size, the lineset can be left but installing a matching indoor unit will give you the efficiency and lifespan you should get. The UPNL-031 is a fine unit. Match that with a RHLL air handler, a bit more than the RHSL, and you get 14.50 SEER and an excellent 9.50 HSPF which means quite a heating cost savings in your cold climate.

  8. #8
    Thanks all for the advice.

    Thanks to your comments i am reconsidering my options.

    What Combination would you suggest in the cold climate -35 celcius and 40 celcius heat in summer?

    Goodman vs rheem/ruud vs trane?

    Many thanks in advance

  9. #9
    Another installer is suggesting i upsize the furnace in the attic to 3.0 ton, 2.5 ton heat pump: suggestions?

  10. #10
    So I bit the bullet and will have installed a 2.5 ton rheem heat pump RNPL and an air handler 3 ton rhklh. I am also changing the thermostat to a white- rogers emerson with humidity control.

    I finally found a tech that will keep the lineset and flush it with nitrogen and reuse it

    Thanks for the help

    Quote Originally Posted by Perfchris View Post
    Another installer is suggesting i upsize the furnace in the attic to 3.0 ton, 2.5 ton heat pump: suggestions?

  11. #11
    Join Date
    May 2000
    Location
    Indianapolis, IN, USA
    Posts
    34,475
    If a lineset is properly sized, it can. Some dealers just blow out with nitrogen, others will use a flush chemical. We have reused many if sized right, only had one haunt us. It had a leak!

  12. #12
    Join Date
    May 2006
    Location
    Austin, Texas
    Posts
    299
    If lineset is correct size it could be reused. Get a quote to replace lineset with equipment change that way you know the line is clean. Should not be too difficult if lineset is already on outside of house.

  13. #13
    Join Date
    Oct 2004
    Location
    So Cal
    Posts
    3,577
    Add to your scenario a reduction in production of R22 effective Jan 2013 & a big price increase to go along with it (again).
    There's no way you should even consider a R22 condenser change-out only- and especially on a HP system.
    Find another contractor.

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