x-13 evap motor - Page 2
Page 2 of 3 FirstFirst 123 LastLast
Results 14 to 26 of 32

Thread: x-13 evap motor

  1. #14
    Join Date
    Dec 2008
    Location
    Ontario Canada
    Posts
    534
    Quote Originally Posted by Barrettservices View Post
    I bought that tester from the dealer toolbox and never use it. If im getting power to the motor and its not spinning thats all i need to know so i just replace the motor, no need to spend time on further diagnosis.
    To clarify for others who will be testing. These motors are supplied with line voltage power all the time. They only energies to the selected "speed" when the correct low voltage tap is energized. Condemning an ECM motor only because it is getting 120V and not spinning could lead to a mis-diagnosis.

  2. #15
    Join Date
    Oct 2012
    Location
    Sacramento,ca
    Posts
    196
    I am new here and i guess i should have gave more info. I only condemn when the tap is getting low voltage power and the motor has 120v. Not just 120v alone. Sorry for my vagueness. Thanks for clearing that up. I was just suggesting not spending alot of valuable time figuring out what part of the head might actually be broken. Even though it may be a cheap quick solder piece to fix it, to me that opens up your company for liability. I would rather replace with a complete factory built motor so if it ever caught fire or something they cant come back and say you modified the motor or something. Just my 2C.

  3. #16
    Join Date
    Jun 2011
    Location
    Houston area
    Posts
    1,493
    Also worth noting for those unaware, VS ECM motors are DC and not AC. There is a circuit similar to a diode bridge or wheatstone bridge that rectifies the incoming AC to DC. And also, troubleshooting the "control heads" is very simple.
    The picture in my avatar is of the Houston Ship Channel and was taken from my backyard. I like to sit outside and slap mosquitos while watching countless supertankers, barges and cargo ships of every shape and size carry all sorts of deadly toxins to and fro. It's really beautiful at times.....just don't eat the three eyed fish....

    `. .` .>(((>

    `... `. .` .>(((>

    .` .>(((>

    LMAOSHMSFOAIDMT

  4. #17
    Join Date
    Dec 2008
    Location
    Ontario Canada
    Posts
    534
    Quote Originally Posted by Barrettservices View Post
    I am new here and i guess i should have gave more info. I only condemn when the tap is getting low voltage power and the motor has 120v. Not just 120v alone. Sorry for my vagueness. Thanks for clearing that up. I was just suggesting not spending alot of valuable time figuring out what part of the head might actually be broken. Even though it may be a cheap quick solder piece to fix it, to me that opens up your company for liability. I would rather replace with a complete factory built motor so if it ever caught fire or something they cant come back and say you modified the motor or something. Just my 2C.
    I figured you knew what you meant. Just clarifying for others. Thanks

  5. #18
    Join Date
    Jul 2009
    Location
    South Carolina
    Posts
    3,034
    Quote Originally Posted by Cooked View Post
    Also worth noting for those unaware, VS ECM motors are DC and not AC. There is a circuit similar to a diode bridge or wheatstone bridge that rectifies the incoming AC to DC. And also, troubleshooting the "control heads" is very simple.
    If troubleshooting a VS ECM motor is simple then I'd sure like to know how to do it. If you know of an easy way besides using a special tester designed to diagnose them please reply with " I'll explain in the Pro Residential forum". I'll start a thread on "Diagnosing VS motors". I'm not trying to put you on the spot but I would like to learn how to better diagnose a VS motor on the job & I'm sure a lot of other pros would too. When I condemn a VS motor (usually the module) I always feel I'm guessing out of process of elimination. So far I've been lucky & haven't been wrong yet but it can be an expensive mistake.
    Gary
    -----------
    http://www.oceanhvac.com
    An engineer designs what he would never work on.
    A technician works on what he would never design.

  6. #19
    Join Date
    Aug 2004
    Location
    North Richland Hills, Texas
    Posts
    14,914
    Quote Originally Posted by garyed View Post
    If troubleshooting a VS ECM motor is simple then I'd sure like to know how to do it. If you know of an easy way besides using a special tester designed to diagnose them please reply with " I'll explain in the Pro Residential forum". I'll start a thread on "Diagnosing VS motors". I'm not trying to put you on the spot but I would like to learn how to better diagnose a VS motor on the job & I'm sure a lot of other pros would too. When I condemn a VS motor (usually the module) I always feel I'm guessing out of process of elimination. So far I've been lucky & haven't been wrong yet but it can be an expensive mistake.
    The special testers are nice for when you are troubleshooting odd behavior, or want/need to verify that the controls are sending the correct signals to the motor module, but for 99.9% of VS motor troubleshooting scenarios, all you need is a go/no go tester, and a couple of simple tests with a multimeter.

    Basically, just verify the line voltage supply, if present, use something like the cheap tech mate switch to see if the motor runs.
    If it has line voltage, and does not run when the control signal is applied with the tech mate, pull the module off and ohm out the motor windings.
    If you don't get anything to ground on either of the 3 motor leads, and the resistance is the same lead to lead on all 3, and the motor bearings are good, replace the module only.
    If any of the 3 resistance measurements lead to lead are different than the other 2 readings, but there is no reading to ground, or the motor bearings are bad, replace just the motor.
    If you get a reading to ground on any of the 3 leads, replace both the motor and module.

    You can even make a simple go/no go tester out of a spare 16 pin control harness, and a 9v battery.
    If more government is the answer, then it's a really stupid question.

  7. #20
    Join Date
    Apr 2010
    Location
    NC Sandhills
    Posts
    384
    I know, I figured with all of the module failures that the suppliers would have figured out it would save every one (except motor manufacturer but motors are out sourced) time and money. I have never seen a ecm motor where it wasnt the module and most the failures have been a few years old. I havent replaced many lately so hopefully the got the problem at least contained.

  8. #21
    Join Date
    Jul 2009
    Location
    South Carolina
    Posts
    3,034
    Quote Originally Posted by mark beiser View Post
    ................
    Basically, just verify the line voltage supply, if present, use something like the cheap tech mate switch to see if the motor runs.
    If it has line voltage, and does not run when the control signal is applied with the tech mate, pull the module off and ohm out the motor windings.......................
    You can even make a simple go/no go tester out of a spare 16 pin control harness, and a 9v battery.
    I'm going to start a thread in the pro/res section.
    Gary
    -----------
    http://www.oceanhvac.com
    An engineer designs what he would never work on.
    A technician works on what he would never design.

  9. #22
    Join Date
    Jun 2011
    Location
    Houston area
    Posts
    1,493
    Quote Originally Posted by mark beiser View Post
    The special testers are nice for when you are troubleshooting odd behavior, or want/need to verify that the controls are sending the correct signals to the motor module, but for 99.9% of VS motor troubleshooting scenarios, all you need is a go/no go tester, and a couple of simple tests with a multimeter.

    Basically, just verify the line voltage supply, if present, use something like the cheap tech mate switch to see if the motor runs.
    If it has line voltage, and does not run when the control signal is applied with the tech mate, pull the module off and ohm out the motor windings.
    If you don't get anything to ground on either of the 3 motor leads, and the resistance is the same lead to lead on all 3, and the motor bearings are good, replace the module only.
    If any of the 3 resistance measurements lead to lead are different than the other 2 readings, but there is no reading to ground, or the motor bearings are bad, replace just the motor.
    If you get a reading to ground on any of the 3 leads, replace both the motor and module.

    You can even make a simple go/no go tester out of a spare 16 pin control harness, and a 9v battery.
    Thank you Mark. You took the time to concisely spell it out when I didn't have time to.

    And Gary, I think a dedicated thread on ECM's is fantastic idea. I may be able to offer some insights into these mysterious black holes. I was once a product engineer for Carrier involved in one of the very first ECM deployments in a commercial airside product.
    The picture in my avatar is of the Houston Ship Channel and was taken from my backyard. I like to sit outside and slap mosquitos while watching countless supertankers, barges and cargo ships of every shape and size carry all sorts of deadly toxins to and fro. It's really beautiful at times.....just don't eat the three eyed fish....

    `. .` .>(((>

    `... `. .` .>(((>

    .` .>(((>

    LMAOSHMSFOAIDMT

  10. #23
    Join Date
    Jul 2009
    Location
    South Carolina
    Posts
    3,034
    Quote Originally Posted by Cooked View Post
    Thank you Mark. You took the time to concisely spell it out when I didn't have time to.

    And Gary, I think a dedicated thread on ECM's is fantastic idea. I may be able to offer some insights into these mysterious black holes. I was once a product engineer for Carrier involved in one of the very first ECM deployments in a commercial airside product.
    The thread is titled "Testing a VS Motor?" in the pro residential forum.
    Gary
    -----------
    http://www.oceanhvac.com
    An engineer designs what he would never work on.
    A technician works on what he would never design.

  11. #24
    Join Date
    Jul 2006
    Location
    Virginia
    Posts
    4,604
    on the x13 motor if you have high voltage andlow voltage to the motor and it aint running its bad
    We really need change now

  12. #25
    Join Date
    Jun 2001
    Location
    Moore, Oklahoma, United States
    Posts
    4,132
    How many failures ahve you seen where the motor windings have failed vs. just the drive module?

  13. #26
    Join Date
    Dec 2008
    Location
    Ontario Canada
    Posts
    534
    Quote Originally Posted by 54regcab View Post
    How many failures ahve you seen where the motor windings have failed vs. just the drive module?
    Never had a bad winding, bad bearing once, always the module in my experience. half the time it's the OL, the other half is the capacitor, occasionally it's neither, but still a bad module

Page 2 of 3 FirstFirst 123 LastLast

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •  
Comfortech Show Promo Image

Related Forums

Plumbing Talks | Contractor Magazine
Forums | Electrical Construction & Maintenance (EC&M) Magazine
Comfortech365 Virtual Event