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  1. #27
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    Quote Originally Posted by barbar View Post
    And that is how I read it. We can play on words, but basically amendments is simply another word for change.
    I wasn't trying to play on words.

    I was stating that there IS a means to change or amend our constitution.

    It is difficult to do by design so as to not allow people to make major decisions in haste.

  2. #28
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    Quote Originally Posted by k-fridge View Post
    Yes, but it is difficult change by design. The founders intentionally made it hard to meddle with the constitution. Perhaps though, not hard enough. Some of the amendments have not been good; some even quite problematic and possibly to blame for many of the problems the US faces today.
    Yes change is difficult, and I do see we are always in a social experiment, with ever changing goal posts and future unknown variables.We will never get it right, but should that stop us from trying, with what we know and have at hand.

    I do not know if the US has the problems that you think it has, I have traveled the world many times (as free traveler), and have to say generally speaking how damn lucky we are in the West.

    I do not know, how much of the change in the US is actually to do with the US, the world is catching up, which is bring down The US and the western world. Are our exceptions to high. Do we look at the past through rose coulored glasses.

  3. #29
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    Quote Originally Posted by jpsmith1cm View Post
    I wasn't trying to play on words.

    I was stating that there IS a means to change or amend our constitution.

    It is difficult to do by design so as to not allow people to make major decisions in haste.
    I know your are not playing with words, I am not a wordsmith, i like to see words that are simply written and leave no room for confusion of the meaning.

    And i agree with your statement

  4. #30
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    Quote Originally Posted by barbar View Post
    I know your are not playing with words, I am not a wordsmith, i like to see words that are simply written and leave no room for confusion of the meaning.

    And i agree with your statement
    I've learned that words have meaning and have found myself that taking an extra moment to construct the EXACT meaning that I wish to communicate with printed word is preferable to being ambiguous or being misunderstood.

    While I don't consider myself a "wordsmith" I'm maybe a "word craftsman" or a "word artisan"

    I also try to read words and understand them in their context and the context in which they were written. These can be very important in properly understanding the true meaning of the words.

  5. #31
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    Quote Originally Posted by jpsmith1cm View Post
    I've learned that words have meaning and have found myself that taking an extra moment to construct the EXACT meaning that I wish to communicate with printed word is preferable to being ambiguous or being misunderstood.

    While I don't consider myself a "wordsmith" I'm maybe a "word craftsman" or a "word artisan"

    I also try to read words and understand them in their context and the context in which they were written. These can be very important in properly understanding the true meaning of the words.
    Wise words.

    For the written word, I class myself as a "word dunce" as my teachers would say, "plenty of room for improvement"

  6. #32
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    Thank you, Sir.

    You communicate very well, don't put yourself down.

    I'm often amazed at the difference in communications skills of Americans vs the rest of the world.

    American education is really sad when stood next to the rest of the English speaking world (and much of the non-English speaking world as well)

    We're getting a bit off topic, though....


  7. #33
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    Quote Originally Posted by jpsmith1cm View Post
    http://www.law.cornell.edu/uscode/text/10/311

    This is actually codified.

    The National Guard is the "Organized" milita.

    The armed citizenry is the "unorganized" militia.
    Hey wordsmith..... where did you get armed citizenry from when referrring to the unorganized militia....

    I believe the unorganized militia is nothing more than the draft eligible citizenry of the USA. Only time they are going to be called up for service is when they are drafted and sent off to boot camp kicking and screaming.
    One things for _______ sure, ________ rock didnt land on ______ sorry ___. That ___ __ _ _____ wasnt nowhere near _______ a _______ years ago. __ aint even a ______, __ is half _______ and half ________.

  8. #34
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    Quote Originally Posted by k-fridge View Post
    mi·li·tia (m-lsh)n.1. An army composed of ordinary citizens rather than professional soldiers.


    http://www.thefreedictionary.com/militia
    Quote Originally Posted by corny View Post
    Hey wordsmith..... where did you get armed citizenry from when referrring to the unorganized militia....

    I believe the unorganized militia is nothing more than the draft eligible citizenry of the USA. Only time they are going to be called up for service is when they are drafted and sent off to boot camp kicking and screaming.
    Well, it isn't that difficult to see.

    Read the definition that k-fridge posted and the link that I posted.
    The militia of the United States consists of all able-bodied males at least 17 years of age and, except as provided in section 313 of title 32, under 45 years of age who are, or who have made a declaration of intention to become, citizens of the United States and of female citizens of the United States who are members of the National Guard.

    As we will describe below, the “militia”
    in colonial America consisted of a subset of “the people”—
    those who were male, able bodied, and within a
    certain age range.
    This quote is taken again from DC vs Heller.

    As I suggested before, the opinion of the SCOTUS is excellent reading should you care to take the time to do so. I must admit that I learned much reading it.

    The Second Amendment was, IMO, put in place to ensure that those 'able bodied citizens' would remain armed.

  9. #35
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    Quote Originally Posted by corny View Post
    Hey wordsmith..... where did you get armed citizenry from when referrring to the unorganized militia....

    I believe the unorganized militia is nothing more than the draft eligible citizenry of the USA. Only time they are going to be called up for service is when they are drafted and sent off to boot camp kicking and screaming.
    What you're expressing is a declaration of opinion. Your low opinion of the citizenry of this country, to be specific.

    There is a difference between fact and opinion and many would do well to learn the difference between them.

  10. #36
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    I believe I would do a little more reading there.... get your head out of the heller vs dc case and look how the unorganized militia has been described over the years..... the unorganized militia of the USA has no purpose whatsoever..... nada....nothing ....zilch....... they can however be called up for active military duty whenever the government sees fit.

    The national guard ended the need for any citizen militias..... The unorganized militia is just a body of men waiting to be called to duty, they are not supposed to train....not supposed to equip themselves..... they are to do nothing but exist until they are needed for cannon fodder.

    Do you honestly think that if the shtf in america that the government is going to rely on its armed citizens to do anything ???

    Nope... We have enough armed forces and guard units in this country to stave off any attacks till the unorganized militia can be called up and sent off to boot camp...... which is what their purpose has been since 1903 or 1930.... somewhere in there.

    Im not arguing against a mans right to have a gun...even a military type weapon as I dont believe there should be any restrictions on what a man owns..... but all this 2nd amendment BS.... trying to use that as an excuse for people arming themselves to protect the nation.....is BS...

    Thats just not going to happen anymore..... aint no need for a citizen militia anymore cause we got one called the national guard.

    SHTF.... men are going to be drafted into the service.

    Could you just imagine an unorganized bunch of yahoos out there trying to defend the country...... they would probably be killing their neighbors at a higher rate than any sort of enemy.

    The unorganized militia is the draft pool.... that was its intention when the national guard was formed.
    One things for _______ sure, ________ rock didnt land on ______ sorry ___. That ___ __ _ _____ wasnt nowhere near _______ a _______ years ago. __ aint even a ______, __ is half _______ and half ________.

  11. #37
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    we have a third world country on our southern border. the drug lords there have more power than the mexican army. we have a leadership in washington, that will not only not protect our border, but has supplied weapons to the drug lords. these drug lords are expanding north and into our country. yet the same people who armed these drug lords, and turn their heads and look the other way, want to take my weapons.
    look no further than the state of ill. to see what gun control does to lower violent crime. i have a right to defend both me and my family. i should at least be able to possess arms equal to what the criminals have. when a criminal comes for you. you may be willing to wait the ten to thirty minutes it takes for law enforcement to arrive.
    as a cancer patient i am prescribed some powerful pain pills along with some others that drug heads would love to have. they have no problems doing whatever to get their hands on these type pills. i keep the pills locked up, and while they are not worth killing someone over. i will defend myself and my family with deadly force if needed.
    i wanted to put a picture here

  12. #38
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    Quote Originally Posted by corny View Post
    I believe I would do a little more reading there.... get your head out of the heller vs dc case and look how the unorganized militia has been described over the years..... the unorganized militia of the USA has no purpose whatsoever..... nada....nothing ....zilch....... they can however be called up for active military duty whenever the government sees fit.

    The national guard ended the need for any citizen militias..... The unorganized militia is just a body of men waiting to be called to duty, they are not supposed to train....not supposed to equip themselves..... they are to do nothing but exist until they are needed for cannon fodder.

    Do you honestly think that if the shtf in america that the government is going to rely on its armed citizens to do anything ???

    Nope... We have enough armed forces and guard units in this country to stave off any attacks till the unorganized militia can be called up and sent off to boot camp...... which is what their purpose has been since 1903 or 1930.... somewhere in there.

    Im not arguing against a mans right to have a gun...even a military type weapon as I dont believe there should be any restrictions on what a man owns..... but all this 2nd amendment BS.... trying to use that as an excuse for people arming themselves to protect the nation.....is BS...

    Thats just not going to happen anymore..... aint no need for a citizen militia anymore cause we got one called the national guard.

    SHTF.... men are going to be drafted into the service.

    Could you just imagine an unorganized bunch of yahoos out there trying to defend the country...... they would probably be killing their neighbors at a higher rate than any sort of enemy.

    The unorganized militia is the draft pool.... that was its intention when the national guard was formed.
    If what you say is true, please cite factual, legal reference to prove it, corny.

    Otherwise, I'll stick with legal opinion rendered by educated legal scholars and not some dude on the internet.


  13. #39
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    Quote Originally Posted by jpsmith1cm View Post
    If what you say is true, please cite factual, legal reference to prove it, corny.

    Otherwise, I'll stick with legal opinion rendered by educated legal scholars and not some dude on the internet.

    The terminology is a tad unfamiliar in the year 2012, but back in the day the term 'army' was a very common term referring to regular professional soldiers. 'Militia' is generally just a gaggle of goofs with guns from resource whatever the public can offer up. I am discussing terminology here, not trying to insult the militia. The inept militia, LOL.

    Look at the numbers.
    There are 300,000,000 americans.
    There are 150,000,000 males.
    There are _75.000,000 males able to put up a physical effort to make a militia of sorts.
    There are _25,000,000 males AT LEAST who would be some really mean militia.
    There are ___,500,000 regular army in our combined military forces....

    This is why a militia is so important for the security of our nation. The numbers are staggering, as the British army discovered. The British at the time, bar none, were the best army in the world.
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