The second amendment

[ga-hvac-tech]

Heard this story on a talking head radio show (conservative talk radio):

Guy calls in and says he worked most of his life as private security for the tourist industry in Florida; part of his job is to carry a firearm in public (open carry).
He said folks from other countries would demean him as a 'cowboy' for carrying a firearm. He got to where he would engage them in conversation... something like this:
"Why do you (silly) Americans think you need guns?
"To protect us from oppressive and tyrannical governments"
"Those do not exist"
"Really?"
"Yes, really, they do not exist"
So no government has ever been a danger to a citizen?"
"No, of course not"
Then the guard would pull out his neck-chain and show the tourist a star of David, and say:
"Hmmm, I can give you 6M reasons to protect yourself from oppressive and tyrannical governments"
He said usually folks would roll their eyes and walk off.

The evidence is clear... what amazes me is folks just do not want to hear.

So I will repeat my stance on this: Folks who do not live in America may or may not understand what we call freedom... IMO they do not have the right to 'intellectualize' our thinking and our values.

[jmac00]

Here are the numbers for the top reasons for death in the U.S. in 2009;

Number of deaths for leading causes of death

• Heart disease: 599,413
• Cancer: 567,628
• Chronic lower respiratory diseases: 137,353
• Stroke (cerebrovascular diseases): 128,842
• Accidents (unintentional injuries): 118,021
• Alzheimer's disease: 79,003
• Diabetes: 68,705
• Influenza and Pneumonia: 53,692
• Nephritis, nephrotic syndrome, and nephrosis: 48,935
• Intentional self-harm (suicide): 36,909

Note that deaths by gunshot didn't make this list. That's because there were a bit over 31,000 deaths attributed to guns with nearly 60% of those being suicides and most of the homocides being killings between gang members.

So, suicides and gang members are gonna kill themselves and one another whether there are guns or not, they will find a way. That leaves about 8,000 gun related deaths due to bad guys committing crimes and accidental deaths due to irresponsible gun owners.

With gun deaths so far down the list of ways that Americans die before we get old, just what is the real agenda for those who want to disarm us?

you forgot one statistic, that for some reason NO ONE wants to address..........death by doctors/medical malpractice.

EVERY YEAR doctors KILL 255,000 people in America ALONE.

[Brian GC]

Heard this story on a talking head radio show (conservative talk radio):

Guy calls in and says he worked most of his life as private security for the tourist industry in Florida; part of his job is to carry a firearm in public (open carry).
He said folks from other countries would demean him as a 'cowboy' for carrying a firearm. He got to where he would engage them in conversation... something like this:
"Why do you (silly) Americans think you need guns?
"To protect us from oppressive and tyrannical governments"
"Those do not exist"
"Really?"
"Yes, really, they do not exist"
So no government has ever been a danger to a citizen?"
"No, of course not"
Then the guard would pull out his neck-chain and show the tourist a star of David, and say:
"Hmmm, I can give you 6M reasons to protect yourself from oppressive and tyrannical governments"
He said usually folks would roll their eyes and walk off.

The evidence is clear... what amazes me is folks just do not want to hear.

So I will repeat my stance on this: Folks who do not live in America may or may not understand what we call freedom... IMO they do not have the right to 'intellectualize' our thinking and our values.

I would roll my eyes and walk off too.

A handgun against the German Army of its time? That is not an example of "intellectualized" thinking. More like daydreaming.

[jmac00]

I agree, the problem with raw data , it can be applied to suit an argument.

I prime example, I can give is that the city which I lived in (teens and 20s) was the most violent city in the UK, Most Murders, Attempted Murders and Rapes. by quite high %, but what raw data did not say, is that most of these crimes were confined to families. It was a rough working class city (textiles) and yes there was plenty of biffo (at times i was involved, typically on every Friday and Saturday Night), but I can say I never feared for my life and do not know any that carried a gun, knives and razors were quite common.

overall population is an issue to:

Population of New Zealand.....4.4 million

Population of England ..........54 million

Population of the U.S..........310 million

Brazil has a population of 190.8 million. Brazil has mandatory licensing, registration, and maximum personal ownership quotas. It now bans any new sales to private citizens. Their homicide rate is almost three (3) times higher than the U.S.
Homicide trends in the United States, U.S. data: Bureau of Justice Statistics, September, 2004. Brazil data: Nations Educational, Scientific and Cultural Organization, 2005.

[garyed]

you forgot one statistic, that for some reason NO ONE wants to address..........death by doctors/medical malpractice.
EVERY YEAR doctors KILL 255,000 people in America ALONE.

That's because the insurance companies want us to believe it's the lawyers trying to make the doctors pay for their frivolous mistakes who are the real problem. And they've done a great job. I know this is for another thread but I couldn't help myself.

[ga-hvac-tech]

I would roll my eyes and walk off too.

A handgun against the German Army of its time? That is not an example of "intellectualized" thinking. More like daydreaming.

Brian, you do not know your history.

Germany was in an economic mess (result of loosing WW1). This smooth talking guy came along and promised utopia if folks would just trust him. A few older folks said no... yet the youth and easily impressed followed (like sheep). They VOLUNTARILY gave their guns away.

The pages of ARP are filled with accounts of govts who knew they would never have the power they want until the guns are taken. Even Japan knew better than to invade American soil... because Americans are armed.
Remember discussions of gorilla/insurgent warefare... picking off a few soldiers here and there... then hide and do it again in a few hours or tomorrow... Local militias always win against large armies... that was posted a while back also.

Brian, you really need to review your posts, and think about what you write. You are in the process of removing any doubt as to your intelligence.

[ga-hvac-tech]

Here are the numbers for the top reasons for death in the U.S. in 2009;

Number of deaths for leading causes of death

• Heart disease: 599,413
• Cancer: 567,628
• GA will add in a stat of doctors killing over 250,000/year... as noted from a different post
• Chronic lower respiratory diseases: 137,353
• Stroke (cerebrovascular diseases): 128,842
• Accidents (unintentional injuries): 118,021
• Alzheimer's disease: 79,003
• Diabetes: 68,705
• Influenza and Pneumonia: 53,692
• Nephritis, nephrotic syndrome, and nephrosis: 48,935
• Intentional self-harm (suicide): 36,909

Note that deaths by gunshot didn't make this list. That's because there were a bit over 31,000 deaths attributed to guns with nearly 60% of those being suicides and most of the homocides being killings between gang members.

So, suicides and gang members are gonna kill themselves and one another whether there are guns or not, they will find a way. That leaves about 8,000 gun related deaths due to bad guys committing crimes and accidental deaths due to irresponsible gun owners.

With gun deaths so far down the list of ways that Americans die before we get old, just what is the real agenda for those who want to disarm us?

From reading this list... it seems to me folks choose to believe what they want to. So the criteria becomes what drives folks choices of beliefs...

MeThinks it is not so much what I choose to believe... as it is what is fed to me to believe. There is this curious thing about humans... they travel in herds. They tend to accept others beliefs without too much question. And like cattle or sheep... they will literally walk into slaughter with their eyes open.

[coolwhip]

Whatever the liberal progressive glass teet feeds the idiot masses is what they believe...since most people don't know how to read anymore.
Or you get the college progressive commie union professors cramming our kids brains with left wing garbage.

Most certainly a conspiratorial agenda...with out doubt!

[RoBoTeq]

I would roll my eyes and walk off too.

A handgun against the German Army of its time? That is not an example of "intellectualized" thinking. More like daydreaming.

If given the choice between being slaughtered while unarmed or being to at least take out one or two of my oppressors before being executed, I'll take the latter. You want to be a sheep and just lie down for the slaughter....after the shearing...knock yourself right out. I prefer to have as much opportunity to control my own life right to the end.

[garyed]

I would roll my eyes and walk off too.

A handgun against the German Army of its time? That is not an example of "intellectualized" thinking. More like daydreaming.

I think you're missing the point. One individual can't win a war but he can take out one or a few of the opposition & he can also ban together with others like him to form a militia. It was not just one individual's gun but removing all the individual's guns so there can be no collective resistance was Hitler's plan.

[ga-hvac-tech]

I think you're missing the point. One individual can't win a war but he can take out one or a few of the opposition & he can also ban together with others like him to form a militia. It was not just one individual's gun but removing all the individual's guns so there can be no collective resistance was Hitler's plan.

And the plan of countless dictators and despots over all of history.

History does not change... only the circumstances and the people.

One can make some educated and fairly accurate guesses at the future if they will discipline themselves to study history (and leave their rose colored sunglasses outside their reading room).

[geerair]

Brian, you do not know your history.

Actually it is you that doesn't know history

Germany was in an economic mess (result of loosing WW1). This smooth talking guy came along and promised utopia if folks would just trust him. A few older folks said no... yet the youth and easily impressed followed (like sheep). They VOLUNTARILY gave their guns away.

Restrictions on gun ownership predated Hitler's rise to power.

The 1938 Nazi gun law actually eased gun ownership restrictions.

Except for Jews, private gun ownership was allowed and even encouraged.

The pages of ARP are filled with accounts of govts who knew they would never have the power they want until the guns are taken. Even Japan knew better than to invade American soil... because Americans are armed.

Japan did indeed invade American soil. The Aleutian Islands.

Remember discussions of gorilla/insurgent warefare... picking off a few soldiers here and there... then hide and do it again in a few hours or tomorrow... Local militias always win against large armies... that was posted a while back also.

Laughable. I can recall some just off the top of my head, Spartacus, Russian crushes Hungarian revolt, Germans crush Polish ghetto uprisings. History is packed with other such examples of Governments defeating militias.

Brian, you really need to review your posts, and think about what you write. You are in the process of removing any doubt as to your intelligence.

This from a dude who learned his history from pass-along e-mails.

[geerair]

One can make some educated and fairly accurate guesses at the future if they will discipline themselves to study history (and leave their rose colored sunglasses outside their reading room).

And if they leave their pass-along e-mails outside their reading room.