Why do you feel the need to own a gun? - Page 51
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  1. #651
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hugh B View Post
    So, when you run out of reasonable arguments you turn from attacking your opponents position to directly attacking your opponent. Going personal is pretty much what progressives do as soon as they are losing the argument. The liberal media is great at attacking the gun control groups but never actually counter the arguments.

    I now know you are one of the progressives.
    I gave you reasonable arguments.

    What I ran out of was patience in listening to your weak absurd points.

  2. #652
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    Quote Originally Posted by mcjo tech View Post
    The Loughner and Lanza killings were not gun accidents.

    They were premeditated murders.
    Loughner would have killed more if not stopped by an armed person and Lanza commited his killing in an area where it was not legal for responsible citizens or those who worked there to carry guns in order to defend themselves and put a stop to the slaughter.

    Yes, some nuts will get through any system, but as long as guns exist, responsible citizens should be able to own them to protect themselves against those who are willing to use guns to harm others. Criminals and nutcases willing to harm others almost always choose soft targets that are known to be defenseless.
    Government is a disease...
    ...masquerading as its own cure…
    Ecclesiastes 10:2 NIV


  3. #653
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    Quote Originally Posted by jpsmith1cm View Post
    To be callous, those two incidents also amount to 32 deaths or 0.0000102% of the American population.

    A statistical anomaly.

    If we take ALL of the mass shootings in 2012, we have a death toll of 88 people or a 0.0000282% of the population.


    Looking at it another way, there are approximately 55 million households with guns and, in 2012, 16 people committed one of these atrocities.

    0.0000290% of gun owners commit these crimes.



    But, because of that .0000290% of gun owners, we're going to make hundreds of guns illegal to manufacture or purchase.

    Pure idiocy.
    Tell this to the 20 parents of those innocent sweethearts that died that day in Newtown.

  4. #654
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    Quote Originally Posted by RoBoTeq View Post
    It is your elitist thought process and desire to control others that is making you incapable of rational thought here.

    This cannot be a matter of ever having less guns because we cannot just make guns non-existant. This is a matter of having less guns in the hands of those who should be able to legally defend themselves and others against those who are willing to use guns to harm us. Less guns only means less guns for the good guys.

    Yes, it is a terrible situation when a deranged person is able to get their hands on guns and do the amount of damage that was done at that school recently. But that disaster could have been prevented by the owner of those guns being more responsible. Had the killer's mother not also been killed, she should have been held accountable for her son's actions because she knew her son was mentally unstable and she knew he should never have had access to her guns. We still should not be using that type of an incident to condone making even more Americans more vulnerable to those who are willing to do us harm.
    You sparked a thought. Is there laws saying the mother should keep the guns away from her kid? Maybe the people asking for tougher laws do not know the ones on the books. I know the ones we have on keeping our guns safe, I have no idea what you guys have.
    Never argue with a fool, onlookers may not be able to tell the difference. —Mark Twain

  5. #655
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    Quote Originally Posted by RoBoTeq View Post
    Loughner would have killed more if not stopped by an armed person and Lanza commited his killing in an area where it was not legal for responsible citizens or those who worked there to carry guns in order to defend themselves and put a stop to the slaughter.

    Yes, some nuts will get through any system, but as long as guns exist, responsible citizens should be able to own them to protect themselves against those who are willing to use guns to harm others. Criminals and nutcases willing to harm others almost always choose soft targets that are known to be defenseless.

    Someone will always get thru the system that is no reason to do nothing to get some of them.

    Get your story correct

    Loughner was stopped by a couple of people who tackled him when he stopped to reload his weapon.

  6. #656
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    Quote Originally Posted by mcjo tech View Post
    Tell this to the 20 parents of those innocent sweethearts that died that day in Newtown.
    'Even if we spend a million dollars, if it saves one life it is worth it.' is a common liberal refrain. But at what point does it not make economic sense, how much is a life worth? We can have the safest cars and highways around and not one person would get killed in an automotive accident. But how much of a country's resources would you have to pour into it? Safety costs money, the question is where are those dollars and energy better spent to benefit society?
    Never argue with a fool, onlookers may not be able to tell the difference. —Mark Twain

  7. #657
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    Quote Originally Posted by mcjo tech View Post
    Tell this to the 20 parents of those innocent sweethearts that died that day in Newtown.

    "Since the dawn of creation there has been both good & evil in the hearts of men and women. We all contain the seeds of kindness or the seeds of violence. The death of my wonderful daughter, Rachel Joy Scott, and the deaths of that heroic teacher, and the other eleven children who died must not be in vain. Their blood cries out for answers.

    "The first recorded act of violence was when Cain slew his brother Abel out in the field. The villain was not the club he used. Neither was it the NCA, the National Club Association. The true killer was Cain, and the reason for the murder could only be found in Cain's heart.

    "In the days that followed the Columbine tragedy, I was amazed at how quickly fingers began to be pointed at groups such as the NRA. I am not a member of the NRA. I am not a hunter. I do not even own a gun. I am not here to represent or defend the NRA - because I don't believe that they are responsible for my daughter's death. Therefore I do not believe that they need to be defended. If I believed they had anything to do with Rachel's murder I would be their strongest opponent.

    "I am here today to declare that Columbine was not just a tragedy-it was a spiritual event that should be forcing us to look at where the real blame lies! Much of the blame lies here in this room. Much of the blame lies behind the pointing fingers of the accusers themselves. "I wrote a poem just four nights ago that expresses my feelings best. This was written way before I knew I would be speaking here today:

    Your laws ignore our deepest needs, Your words are empty air. You've stripped away our heritage, You've outlawed simple prayer. Now gunshots fill our classrooms, And precious children die. You seek for answers everywhere, And ask the question "Why?" You regulate restrictive laws, Through legislative creed. And yet you fail to understand, That God is what we need!
    "Men and women are three-part beings. We all consist of body, soul, and spirit. When we refuse to acknowledge a third part of our make-up, we create a void that allows evil, prejudice, and hatred to rush in and reek havoc. Spiritual presences were present within our educational systems for most of our nation's history. Many of our major colleges began as theological seminaries. This is a historical fact. What has happened to us as a nation? We have refused to honor God, and in so doing, we open the doors to hatred and violence. And when something as terrible as Columbine's tragedy occurs - politicians immediately look for a scapegoat such as the NRA. They immediately seek to pass more restrictive laws that contribute to erode away our personal and private liberties. We do not need more restrictive laws. "Eric and Dylan would not have been stopped by metal detectors. No amount of gun laws can stop someone who spends months planning this type of massacre. The real villain lies within our own hearts. Political posturing and restrictive legislation are not the answers. The young people of our nation hold the key. There is a spiritual awakening taking place that will not be squelched! We do not need more religion. We do not need more gaudy television evangelists spewing out verbal religious garbage. We do not need more million dollar church buildings built while people with basic needs are being ignored. We do need a change of heart and a humble acknowledgment that this nation was founded on the principle of simple trust in God!

    "As my son Craig lay under that table in the school library and saw his two friends murdered before his very eyes-He did not hesitate to pray in school. I defy any law or politician to deny him that right! I challenge every young person in America, and around the world, to realize that on April 20, 1999, at Columbine High School prayer was brought back to our schools. Do not let the many prayers offered by those students be in vain. Dare to move into the new millennium with a sacred disregard for legislation that violates your God-given right to communicate with Him. To those of you who would point your finger at the NRA - I give to you a sincere challenge. Dare to examine your own heart before casting the first stone! My daughter's death will not be in vain! The young people of this country will not allow that to happen!"
    Darrell Scott. The father of one of the kids killed at Columbine.

    While some react emotionally to these things, some keep their heads.

    Emotional reactions are, generally, poor decisions.

    I have two young children. I think that they finished kindergarten about 3 days ago (it seems that way, anyway)

    Sometimes, I don't sleep worrying about them as they sleep just a few yards away in their rooms. Sometimes, I check on them. If someone hurt them, that person couldn't hide anywhere on the face of this planet.

  8. #658
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    Quote Originally Posted by mcjo tech View Post
    Someone will always get thru the system that is no reason to do nothing to get some of them.

    Get your story correct

    Loughner was stopped by a couple of people who tackled him when he stopped to reload his weapon.
    And that might be a good place to focus thought. While you guys like to have an armed society and there is a case for others with guns taking out the bad guy, it is more difficult doing it when the bad guy has a 30 round mag and you have no chance to let loose on him. Yes I know for a trained person a mag change can take a second or two, but maybe the good guys can take him out in that brief time. If you need more than 10 rounds for defense you are living in the wrong neighborhood.
    Never argue with a fool, onlookers may not be able to tell the difference. —Mark Twain

  9. #659
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    Quote Originally Posted by printer2 View Post
    You sparked a thought. Is there laws saying the mother should keep the guns away from her kid? Maybe the people asking for tougher laws do not know the ones on the books. I know the ones we have on keeping our guns safe, I have no idea what you guys have.

    MAYBE doesn't enter into this question.

    Most of the people screaming for more laws don't have half a clue what the laws regarding firearms are.

    Heck, I've had to explain the difference between a semi-automatic rifle and a machine gun to some of these goofs.

  10. #660
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    This is crazy....some of you can't comprehend that some weapons are more dangerous than others....and why the killing capacity matters at all...really?

    I know guns are objects that do nothing on their own...blame the lunatics it is their fault after all... but what's more dangerous in the hands of said lunatic..a stick, a toaster oven, a swimming pool, or a gun?

    Does that make any sense at all?

    Also this idea that irresponsible gun owners only buy illegally is completely absurd.

  11. #661
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    Yes.... and the oregon mall shooter who some folks still seem to be trotting out there.......couldnt even get the gal he was with to back up his story that he "drew down" on that bad guy.....lol

    Cato Institute..... You do mean Koch Brothers institute....dont you.

    Loughner.....Maniac.....

    This Lanza kid......Maniac.....

    Armed citizens would not have changed the outcome of either of these guys crimes because its been proven that CCW in public do not respond when the call goes out for someone to step up and do something. They flee their own shadows......like some kind of elf or other weird like creature (Gollum) that cowers in fear at the first sign of danger...... Sort of like Barney Fife....... Always walking around with his chest bucked out there and talking how he is going to do this or do that.....but when trouble rears its ugly head.....Barney always slinks and slithers away.....fleeing his own shadow and forcing Andy to once again come in unarmed and unassuming and take the bad guys down.

    Fleeing their own shadows......
    "Maybe I am a welfares queen"

    Cliven Bundy.... Patriot ???

    He actually said that

  12. #662
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    This interview with John Lott is quite rational in explanations of many of the reasons why having too much gun control in the U.S. is not a good thing for Americans overall. http://www.press.uchicago.edu/Misc/Chicago/493636.html

    And for those who keep citing other statistics in other countries, please keep in mind that Americans are used to more overall freedoms (Canadians cannot even have radio stations dedicated to what they prefer to listen to) and the U.S. is much more geographically accessable than countries such as Japan, the UK and Australia.
    Government is a disease...
    ...masquerading as its own cure…
    Ecclesiastes 10:2 NIV


  13. #663
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    Quote Originally Posted by printer2 View Post
    'Even if we spend a million dollars, if it saves one life it is worth it.' is a common liberal refrain. But at what point does it not make economic sense, how much is a life worth? We can have the safest cars and highways around and not one person would get killed in an automotive accident. But how much of a country's resources would you have to pour into it? Safety costs money, the question is where are those dollars and energy better spent to benefit society?
    I understand and this is a valid point.

    But here in the US we already have certifications for concealed carry permits and the ability to issue them.

    Why not just extend this to if a person wants to purchase a semi automatic weapon they need to have a similar permit prior to purchasing one.

    I have yet to have anyone say or explain why they are not in favor of such a regulation other then it is against their rights which is BS because that it simply not the case or their contention that it won't do anything to prevent these killings which is also a bunch of BS.

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