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  1. #1808
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    This Just In

    http://freedomoutpost.com/2013/01/fo...presentatives/


    Representative Rosa L. DeLauro (D-CT) introduced HR 226 in the House of Representatives. What does the bill seek to do? I looks to amend the 1986 Internal Revenue code and allow a credit if taxpayers “surrender” their guns to the government. The Act is said to be cited as the “Support Assault Firearms Elimination and Reduction for our Streets Act.”

    According to the text of the bill, the allowance of the credit is:


    (1) In general.–In the case of an individual who surrenders a specified assault weapon to the United States or a State or local government (or political subdivision thereof) as part of a Federal, State, or local public safety program to reduce the number of privately owned weapons, on the election of the taxpayer there shall be allowed as a credit against the tax imposed by this chapter an amount equal to $2,000.
    (2) Year credit allowed.–The amount of the credit under paragraph (1) shall be allowed \1/2\ for the taxable year during which the assault weapon was so surrendered and \1/2\ in the next taxable year.

    Notice the purpose is not to give a credit of $2000.00, which if that is the case, one could really make a good bit of money as you can get a Bushmaster for well under $1000, but rather it is to “reduce the number of privately owned weapons.”

    The bill states that the weapons must lawfully be possesssed, that it is surrendered in writing, and there can only be one weapon surrendered per tax year. So what weapons does Rep. DeLauro consider to be “assault” weapons? The list is very similar to Senator Diane Feinstein’s list. According to the bill “the term ‘specified assault weapon’ means any of the following:


    (A) The following rifles or copies or duplicates
    thereof:
    “(i) AK, AKM, AKS, AK-47, AK-74, ARM, MAK90, Misr, NHM 90, NHM 91, SA 85, SA 93, VEPR,
    “(ii) AR-10,
    “(iii) AR-15, Bushmaster XM15, Armalite M15, or Olympic Arms PCR,
    “(iv) AR70,
    “(v) Calico Liberty,
    “(vi) Dragunov SVD Sniper Rifle or Dragunov SVU,
    “(vii) Fabrique National FN/FAL, FN/LAR, or FNC,
    “(viii) Hi-Point Carbine,
    “(ix) HK-91, HK-93, HK-94, or HK-PSG-1,
    “(x) Kel-Tec Sub Rifle,
    “(xi) M1 Carbine,
    “(xii) Saiga,
    “(xiii) SAR-8, SAR-4800,
    “(xiv) SKS with detachable magazine,
    “(xv) SLG 95,
    “(xvi) SLR 95 or 96,
    “(xvii) Steyr AUG,
    “(xviii) Sturm, Ruger Mini-14,
    “(xix) Tavor,
    “(xx) Thompson 1927, Thompson M1, or Thompson 1927 Commando, or
    “(xxi) Uzi, Galil and Uzi Sporter, Galil Sporter, or Galil Sniper Rifle (Galatz).
    “(B) The following pistols or copies or duplicates thereof:
    “(i) Calico M-110,
    “(ii) MAC-10, MAC-11, or MPA3,
    “(iii) Olympic Arms OA,
    “(iv) TEC-9, TEC-DC9, TEC-22 Scorpion, or AB-10, or
    “(v) Uzi.
    “(C) The following shotguns or copies or duplicates thereof:
    “(i) Armscor 30 BG,
    “(ii) SPAS 12 or LAW 12,
    “(iii) Striker 12, or
    “(iv) Streetsweeper.
    “(D) A semiautomatic rifle that has an ability to accept a detachable magazine, and that has–
    “(i) a folding or telescoping stock,
    “(ii) a threaded barrel,
    “(iii) a pistol grip,
    “(iv) a forward grip, or
    “(v) a barrel shroud.
    “(E)(i) Except as provided in clause (ii), a semiautomatic rifle that has a fixed magazine with the capacity to accept more than 10 rounds.
    “(ii) Clause (i) shall not apply to an attached tubular device designed to accept, and capable of operating only with, .22 caliber rimfire ammunition.
    “(F) A semiautomatic pistol that has the ability to accept a detachable magazine, and has–
    “(i) a second pistol grip,
    “(ii) a threaded barrel,
    “(iii) a barrel shroud, or
    “(iv) the capacity to accept a detachable magazine at a location outside of the pistol
    grip.
    “(G) A semiautomatic pistol with a fixed magazine that has the capacity to accept more than 10 rounds.
    “(H) A semiautomatic shotgun that has–
    “(i) a folding or telescoping stock,
    “(ii) a pistol grip,
    “(iii) the ability to accept a detachable magazine, or
    “(iv) a fixed magazine capacity of more than 5 rounds.
    “(I) A shotgun with a revolving cylinder.
    “(J) A frame or receiver that is identical to, or based substantially on the frame or receiver of, a firearm described in any of subparagraphs (A) through
    (I) or (L).
    “(K) A conversion kit.
    “(L) A semiautomatic rifle or shotgun originally designed for military or law enforcement use, or a firearm based on the design of such a firearm, that is not particularly suitable for sporting purposes, as determined by the Attorney General. In making the determination, there shall be a rebuttable presumption that a firearm procured for use by the United States military or any Federal law enforcement agency is not particularly suitable for sporting purposes, and a firearm shall not be determined to be particularly suitable for sporting purposes solely because the firearm is suitable for use in a sporting event.
    “(2) Related definitions.–
    “(A) Barrel shroud.–The term `barrel shroud’ means a shroud that is attached to, or partially or completely encircles, the barrel of a firearm so that the shroud protects the user of the firearm from heat generated by the barrel, but does not include a slide that encloses the barrel, and does not include an extension of the stock along the bottom of the barrel which does not encircle or substantially encircle the barrel.
    “(B) Conversion kit.–The term `conversion kit’ means any part or combination of parts designed and intended for use in converting a firearm into a semiautomatic assault weapon, and any combination of parts from which a semiautomatic assault weapon can be assembled if the parts are in the possession or under the control of a person.
    “(C) Detachable magazine.–The term `detachable magazine’ means an ammunition feeding device that can readily be inserted into a firearm.
    “(D) Fixed magazine.–The term `fixed magazine’ means an ammunition feeding device contained in, or permanently attached to, a firearm.
    “(E) Folding or telescoping stock.–The term `folding or telescoping stock’ means a stock that folds, telescopes, or otherwise operates to reduce the length, size, or any other dimension, or otherwise enhances the concealability, of a firearm.
    “(F) Forward grip.–The term `forward grip’ means a grip located forward of the trigger that functions as a pistol grip.
    “(G) Pistol grip.–The term `pistol grip’ means a grip, a thumbhole stock, or any other characteristic that can function as a grip.
    “(H) Threaded barrel.–The term `threaded barrel’ means a feature or characteristic that is designed in such a manner to allow for the attachment of a firearm as defined in section 5845(a) of the National Firearms Act (26 U.S.C. 5845(a)).

    The bill was referred to the Committee on Ways and Means on January 14, 2013, much like the bill that seeks to eliminate the 22nd Amendment that was put forth earlier by Congressman Jose Serrano (D-NY).

    Americans must resist this kind of enticement and stand upon what the Founders provided us in the Second Amendment. If we do not make our stand on that right, we will eventually lose all other rights.

  2. #1809
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    Quote Originally Posted by bigtime View Post
    Im just amazed by the passion of people on both sides of this issue. Im not a gun owner but definately dont want to take the right away from people who want them. Its not really an important issue to me and I have a hard time seeing why its so important to others. I dont really have a problem with restricting how many bullets a gun will hold. Unless one is okay with citizens owning nuclear weapons, we all support limits on the right to bear arms, just a matter of how powerful we are okay with.

    I dont really give a poop if its illeagal or not, if I felt like I needed a weapon Id get one.
    The passion is over our rights being attacked more so than the specific thing that our rights are being attacked for.

    Once our rights are successfully taken from us on any issue, it sets legal presidence for all rights to come under attack whenever the current powers to be get a bug up their butt about something.

    This is the process that was used to make it illegal for Americans to grow, cultivate or even just use a naturally growing weed. Between the lobbyists for the new synthetic fibers manufacturer's wanting to get hemp products banned so they could sell their newly invented rayons and polyesters, and desire to force Latino immigrants who were brought legally into the U.S. during the boom days of the Roaring Twenties, but then became a burden on society during the Great Depression, politicians were bribed to vote for the banning of marijauna. So, it's not just guns, folks. Once president is set to take away the Constitutional rights of Americans, all rights come under the possibility of attack.

    You want another example? How about some Americans not being able to purchase certain efficiencies of HVAC equipment while other Americans can? How about the Department of Labor being able to interfere with a State's rights to determine the status of organized labor, or the manufacturer's of companies that move to States that are more labor friendly?
    Government is a disease...
    ...masquerading as its own cure…
    Ecclesiastes 10:2 NIV


  3. #1810
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    Quote Originally Posted by ga-hvac-tech View Post
    Lessee... If I read this correctly... we are saying the Creator is timeless... And the mere word 'CREATOR' would indicate the created (that would be mankind) is a product of the Creator's handiwork... SOOO
    It seems the Creator is smarter than the created... even though the created wants to think otherwise (reminds me of a benevolent father and a rebellious child--in child body or an adult body). OK... that makes sense.

    So lets carry this logic a step farther: if the Creator is timeless and smarter... then perhaps the created needs to pay heed to the Creator... rather than live in a world of arrogance, thinking (incorrectly... more likely being deceived by their own arrogance) they (the created) have all the answers and have no need for the Creator?

    It would appear the Founders, in writing the founding documents, understood these principles... something our current society seems to be short of understanding... SOOO
    It would appear the founders may (IMO do) have a better understanding of issues political than today's so called intelligent folks... Not withstanding a significant measure of today's learned folks are indeed simply spin (read that BS) artists.

    Now we can apply this to the Constitution; It is a document of wisdom, similar to the Creator in the document is smarter (wiser) than the people it governs. To revere this document and voluntarily place oneself under its authority... to live in a nation of the rule of law... would produce a society of organization. Seems today we have a govt that abhors the rule of law... and we have something similar to chaos.
    Perhaps the founders recognized the NEED for a finite authority the Govt was to be held UNDER... to minimize the potential for this chaos we see today?
    If this logic is true... then would it be smarter to:
    1: Require govt to operate UNDER the authority of the Constitution... or
    2: Try to usurp the Constitution and make up the rules as we go... knowing this approach is both against the wisdom of the Creator as well as the founders... both of which are proven by reasonable logic to have more insight and understanding than we hold today in matters of politics.

    The problem is mankind... In his (our) endless arrogance (not recognizing the superior leadership of the Creator, and rebelling against any form of authority... whether it be a Creator or a document)... tries to gain power by questionable means (means the Constitution rejects). The Constitution is a document to give the common people (remember that "We the People" thing)... the right to tell a person of arrogance seeking power (generally found in govt): NO, you are outside the bounds of authority this country allows its leaders... and as such in the founding documents... we call you out and tell you to cease and desist... or we will remove you from office. (Note 'WE the People" have this authority in the founding documents... ever wonder why power hungry people want to minimize the founders and their writings... it is to promote their power).

    What is a shame... is 'we the people' do not have the gonads to do what the founders gave us... to protect ourselves from the evil which is being shoved upon us. All we have to do is unite together and stand our ground... Our Constitutional ground.

    Really simple... as soon as we choose to 'just do it'.

    I have seen 3, yes three, times in my 60 years... the govt has tried to bull-doze the public... and the public has pushed back. All we have to do is:
    Grow a set...
    Learn what the Constitution says and guarantees...
    And 'just do it'.
    The courts will follow... they know they have to.
    Barbar, I call your attention to this post.

    Although gahvactech posts defines the term verbose and lack intellectual consistency he does manage to convey a sense of originalism that supports my view.

  4. #1811
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    Quote Originally Posted by RoBoTeq View Post
    I believe babar considers himself an atheist as well. At least, he constantly belittles those of us of faith by making comments about our worshipping works of fiction.
    Odd, atheists debating God...
    "You boys are really making this thing harder than it has to be". Me

    "Who ARE you people? And WHAT are you doing in my SWAMP!?" Shrek

    Service calls submitted after 3PM will be posted the next business day.

    I give free estimates [Wild Ass Guesses] over the phone.

    "I am sorry for interrupting, please continue with your quarreling" Some chick on TV

  5. #1812
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    Quote Originally Posted by barbar View Post
    But it is the timeless nature of the creator, which was known! and allowance was made for man not knowing or understanding, where change could and should be made when man understanding increases..
    That is a good point in a hypothetical theologically centered view. However, I am much more of a pragmatist concerning these issues. As such I require evidence and as an originalist I place more credibility on first person testimony than speculation.

    That testimony comes to us in the form of the Bible (Gods/creators diary). In that testimony, we see that god/creator is so jealous of his proprietary knowledge and understanding that he/she destroys an elegant structure of man that if left standing would surely be classified as the first of the list of Seven Wonders of the Ancient World.

    Of course, need I even mention that this very same god/creator wiped out all of mankind (except for an old drunk and his family) simply becuase in his/her view mankind had become intolerably uppity.

    Timeless or not god/creator plays his cards close to his vest.

  6. #1813
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tool-Slinger View Post
    Odd, atheists debating God...
    An intellectually stimulating practice common in Atheist circles which brings joy, joy, joy, joy deep in our hearts.

  7. #1814
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tool-Slinger View Post
    Geer is toying with you.
    Barbar knows the score.

  8. #1815
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    Quote Originally Posted by geerair View Post
    Similar to your god I work in mysterious ways.
    You know nothing of my God, for I have not, nor will I, discuss my spiritual or religious convictions on this or any other web site. Hell boy, for all you know I could worship Natas.
    If a nation expects to be ignorant and free, in a state of civilization, it expects what will never be. (Thomas Jefferson 1816)

  9. #1816
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gib's Son View Post
    You know nothing of my God, for I have not, nor will I, discuss my spiritual or religious convictions on this or any other web site.
    Then I apologize for not realizing that the J/C god is not your god.


    I revise my statement as follows. "Like the Judeo/Christian god, I work in mysterious ways."



    Hell boy, for all you know I could worship Natas.
    Sounds fascinating this Natas. Could you give me a link, I want to explore this further.

  10. #1817
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    Quote Originally Posted by RoBoTeq View Post
    I believe babar considers himself an atheist as well. At least, he constantly belittles those of us of faith by making comments about our worshipping works of fiction.
    Your belief is wrong, I can not be an atheist, for the same reason I can not be a man faith.
    I can not belittle your faith because your faith is between you and god. Only you can do this.
    I have never attacked your right to faith, more so I am the biggest defender of a mans right to his faith. This right is not limited to Christians or any other specific religion.
    The great books, are written by man, not by God. Therefore are open to interpretation. never mind the other writing that could or should have been included.

  11. #1818
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    Quote Originally Posted by ga-hvac-tech View Post
    Barber said he was an agnostic... MeThinks Barber is what Barber wants to be...
    Correct on both accounts
    "Barbar", ( my chat up line),

  12. #1819
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tool-Slinger View Post
    Geer is toying with you. He is an atheist.
    Thank you for your concern.
    Love him or hate him, he is an interesting character.

  13. #1820
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tool-Slinger View Post
    Odd, atheists debating God...
    They always do. And they don't understand just how silly it is for them to argue against something that they claim to not believe exists.
    Government is a disease...
    ...masquerading as its own cure…
    Ecclesiastes 10:2 NIV


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