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  1. #144
    Join Date
    Sep 2005
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    Atlanta GA area
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    21,759
    Goodmorning and a Merry Christmas and Happy New Year to the crowd at ARP!

    From Corny's post: I know a guy right now who will absolutely freak out if you even attempt to show him a gun..... Im not word smithing either..... this boy will freak out to the point of threatening to become violent....lol.... If you dont put the gun away.

    When I read this, my first thought was not freaking out about guns... rather someone that was soooo emotionally unstable they did not have any self-control. This kind of emotional unstability comes from a really messy life, a place where denial is the only way one can function. Sometimes the person is running from a situation, sometimes from an experience, sometimes from themselves. Regardless... the person is not mentally healthy... and they are potentially a threat to themselves as well as those around them... How? Well when that cashier in the store freaked out over the mag... well she also has to drive home after her shift... I wonder if she is mentally stable enough to not do something irrational and cause an accident?
    We really need to address the was our society lives on the edge... rather than blame an inanimate object... when our frayed lifestyle causes issues.
    GA-HVAC-Tech

    Quality work at a fair price with excellent customer service!

    Romans Ch's 5-6-7-8

    2 Chronicles 7:14

  2. #145
    Join Date
    Jan 2002
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    tip of the mitt
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    2,002
    Quote Originally Posted by corny View Post
    Aint no real killing difference between a shotgun and one of those assault looking weapons..... that kid in newtown would have been just as deadly with a shotgun.

    I dont agree that you need special training for a semi auto.... but I do think that when these kids get hold of mommy or daddys gun and end up killing themselves or another family member or friend that the parents should see some way serious jail time.

    If I was going to go on a killing spree I would much rather have a shotgun..... really tear some people up..... Shotgun is a lot more intimidating too... you point a 12 gauge at someone and you are more than likely going to send them packing........even if they are armed.

    exactly, that's why a assault weapons ban is a ploy. The first step at total firearm ban. How do you eat a elephant?, one bite at a time.
    I have my own little world. But it's OK...they know me here.

  3. #146
    Join Date
    Jan 2004
    Location
    Northern California Central Valley
    Posts
    90
    Very simply put, for hunting, home protection and thirdly it's my second amendment right completely spelled out in the Constitution.

    Sent from my SCH-I535 using Tapatalk 2

  4. #147
    Join Date
    Jun 2002
    Location
    Dacula, GA
    Posts
    12,954
    Quote Originally Posted by corny View Post
    Aint no real killing difference between a shotgun and one of those assault looking weapons..... that kid in newtown would have been just as deadly with a shotgun.

    I dont agree that you need special training for a semi auto.... but I do think that when these kids get hold of mommy or daddys gun and end up killing themselves or another family member or friend that the parents should see some way serious jail time.

    If I was going to go on a killing spree I would much rather have a shotgun..... really tear some people up..... Shotgun is a lot more intimidating too... you point a 12 gauge at someone and you are more than likely going to send them packing........even if they are armed.
    Well I can agree with you on one thing corny. This training is BS. All one needs for training is to take the gun to a firing range hopefully with someone who is familiar with firearms and practice loading and shooting the gun to ascertain its accuracy, firepower, kick and get used to using it. There is no training requirement in GA for a CCW just a clean "record" and you being mentally sound.

    The mere fact that you may be packing is in itself a big deterrent to a lot of maniac killers out there. I sure wish I knew what is wrong with the NRA lately. That is crazy having a armed guard in every school. It would be far better and 0 cost to allow every adult who works at the school to pack if they have a CCW. Then you might have some heat on every floor if not every other classroom. That would be far preferable in my opinion. Again Merry Christmas crony. Thank you, thank you very much
    "I could have ended the war in a month. I could have made North Vietnam look like a mud puddle."
    "I have little interest in streamlining government or in making it more efficient, for I mean to reduce its size. I do not undertake to promote welfare, for I propose to extend freedom. My aim is not to pass laws, but to repeal them. It is not to inaugurate new programs, but to cancel old ones that do violence to the Constitution."
    Barry Goldwater

  5. #148
    Join Date
    Sep 2008
    Location
    Western PA
    Posts
    25,945
    Quote Originally Posted by mcjo tech View Post
    I think as a American citizen you should be allowed to purchase and carry ANY gun you want.

    But to purchase a semi automatic weapon you should at least need to go thru the similar training and background you do to get a concealed carry type permit to purchase it.

    It is a small compromise to help make certain these types of weapons remain in the hands of responsible gun owners.

    I really don't understand why anyone would have a viable reason to not agree with this.

    You may all contend that it will do nothing and this may indeed be true but it is a reasonable idea that my bring both gun owners and gun banners to a middle ground where both can say they agree and say they both gave or got something to try to stop even one of these tragic shootings.

    And if it saves one single life that is reason enough for me.

    My state, Pennsylvania, has no classes or qualification courses for a CCW permit.

    I go to the sheriff's office, fill out a form, submit to a background check (the same NICS check that I go through to buy a gun) and, if nothing negative comes back, I've got a permit.

    Next door, in Ohio, one must take an 8 hour course and pass a basic shooting competency course.

    I don't necessarily have a problem with either system.

    I don't have a problem, either, with increased requirements for training and competency.

    I DO have a problem with mandatory inspections of my home in order to own a firearm.

    I might have problems with psychological testing as, I believe, the mind-set of the person administering the test can skew the results of the test. These things are subjective and not objective.


    I'd agree to something like this if we lift some of the idiotic prohibitions on guns, too, like gun free zones.

  6. #149
    Join Date
    Sep 2005
    Location
    Atlanta GA area
    Posts
    21,759
    Respectfully, I will disagree on training.

    While I think we all agree on range time... there is more to training than range time. Having said that... regular range time is important... one needs to keep the skill sharp.

    What training is about is two-fold: First to know the laws associated with carrying and use of deadly force, and Second to learn how to evaluate the situation and make the correct decision as how to proceed. Here are a couple of examples:

    You are at a gas station, you see someone robbing at gunpoint the attendant... you personally are not in danger... what do you do?
    You are in a restaurant late one evening; you see your favourite wait-person turn white at a table and see a piece pointed at her... what do you do?
    You are walking your pooch in the park (we have lots of parks, many of them are over 100 acres, with paved trails). You hear a woman scream... and stealthily check around the bend to see a big guy pinning down a small lady... nobody around... what do you do?
    We could write a dozen more... the point is to evaluate each situation and understand what to do.

    Now we can arm-chair QB this online... however in the heat of the moment... that adrenaline rush does not always allow us to think clearly. TRAINING is what allows one to make the correct decision!
    BTW: ALL THREE situations I intentionally left out key information one would need to evaluate using deadly force. Anyone want to comment as to what was not mentioned in each situation? Also, each situation has a factor within it that would trigger adrenaline... anyone care to note the potential adrenaline factor and comment how they would handle the adrenaline rush in each situation?

    In GA's opinion: if one is not gonna get proper training, they really should not have a CCW permit. GA would support a required training law to get a permit in this state, specifically with repeat training every time it is renewed.
    Now think with me a minute: It would be hard for the anti-gun folks to say CCW folks are dangerous if record showed they were trained... right...
    GA-HVAC-Tech

    Quality work at a fair price with excellent customer service!

    Romans Ch's 5-6-7-8

    2 Chronicles 7:14

  7. #150
    Join Date
    Sep 2008
    Location
    Western PA
    Posts
    25,945
    Quote Originally Posted by corny View Post
    Aint no real killing difference between a shotgun and one of those assault looking weapons..... that kid in newtown would have been just as deadly with a shotgun.

    I dont agree that you need special training for a semi auto.... but I do think that when these kids get hold of mommy or daddys gun and end up killing themselves or another family member or friend that the parents should see some way serious jail time.

    If I was going to go on a killing spree I would much rather have a shotgun..... really tear some people up..... Shotgun is a lot more intimidating too... you point a 12 gauge at someone and you are more than likely going to send them packing........even if they are armed.
    I've said that for YEARS.

    IF (HUGE IF, here) but, IF I wanted to inflict the MAXIMUM amount of damage in the minimum about of time, I'd grab my trust duck/rabbit/squirrel/pheasant shooter, take 2 minutes and remove the federally mandated plug that limits it to 3 rounds, stuff it with heavy "fine" shot or light "buck" shot and go to town.

    Given 000 Buck, one shot puts 9-12 .36" pellets in the air with every pull of the trigger. For reference, a 9mm and a .357 magnum fire the same diameter projectile.

  8. #151
    Join Date
    Sep 2008
    Location
    Western PA
    Posts
    25,945
    Quote Originally Posted by ga-hvac-tech View Post
    Goodmorning and a Merry Christmas and Happy New Year to the crowd at ARP!

    From Corny's post: I know a guy right now who will absolutely freak out if you even attempt to show him a gun..... Im not word smithing either..... this boy will freak out to the point of threatening to become violent....lol.... If you dont put the gun away.

    When I read this, my first thought was not freaking out about guns... rather someone that was soooo emotionally unstable they did not have any self-control. This kind of emotional unstability comes from a really messy life, a place where denial is the only way one can function. Sometimes the person is running from a situation, sometimes from an experience, sometimes from themselves. Regardless... the person is not mentally healthy... and they are potentially a threat to themselves as well as those around them... How? Well when that cashier in the store freaked out over the mag... well she also has to drive home after her shift... I wonder if she is mentally stable enough to not do something irrational and cause an accident?
    We really need to address the was our society lives on the edge... rather than blame an inanimate object... when our frayed lifestyle causes issues.
    Does ignorance play a part in this?

    I've met a lot of people that don't know the first thing about guns. People that can almost figure out which end of the barrel the bullet comes out of.

    Maybe a combination of their ignorance and the media's portrayal of firearms have combined to create a near hysterical phobia in a small sub-set of the population.


    Heck, just thinking.

  9. #152
    Join Date
    Sep 2005
    Location
    Atlanta GA area
    Posts
    21,759
    Quote Originally Posted by jpsmith1cm View Post
    My state, Pennsylvania, has no classes or qualification courses for a CCW permit.

    I go to the sheriff's office, fill out a form, submit to a background check (the same NICS check that I go through to buy a gun) and, if nothing negative comes back, I've got a permit.

    Next door, in Ohio, one must take an 8 hour course and pass a basic shooting competency course.

    I don't necessarily have a problem with either system.

    I don't have a problem, either, with increased requirements for training and competency.

    I DO have a problem with mandatory inspections of my home in order to own a firearm.

    I might have problems with psychological testing as, I believe, the mind-set of the person administering the test can skew the results of the test. These things are subjective and not objective.


    I'd agree to something like this if we lift some of the idiotic prohibitions on guns, too, like gun free zones.
    I pretty much agree with JP with one exception (as noted in my previous post); I would encourage required training each time the CCW permit is issued (or renewed). Those of us that take this responsibly seriously could probably teach the instructor a thing or two... however IMO the casual citizen who gets a permit because 'his neighbor or brother did'... needs the training.

    I would suggest 6-8 hours of classroom split between gun laws, the seriousness of taking a life, and how to evaluate a situation before drawing.

    Then each NEW applicant needs a basic range course (one could substitute NRA or GOA training for this)... and a qualifying shoot. Each renewal needs a qualifying shoot. Qualifying would be something simple like 5 rounds in a target grouped nicely, while the instruct\or discussed and watched your handling of the gun and attitude towards basic gun safety.
    GA-HVAC-Tech

    Quality work at a fair price with excellent customer service!

    Romans Ch's 5-6-7-8

    2 Chronicles 7:14

  10. #153
    Join Date
    Sep 2008
    Location
    Western PA
    Posts
    25,945
    As we're discussing this, my wife piped in.

    Her sister is a teacher in Ohio.

    She (the sister) has stated that "If they make me carry a gun, I'll quit my job"

    Who would MAKE her carry a gun?

    All that should happen is to remove the restriction, the PROHIBITION, on carrying a firearm.

  11. #154
    Join Date
    Jan 2002
    Location
    tip of the mitt
    Posts
    2,002
    herein michigan there is a provision in the law called the good Samaritan law. If a ccw permit holder comes across another person getting attacked, legally they have the right to help.
    I have my own little world. But it's OK...they know me here.

  12. #155
    Join Date
    Sep 2008
    Location
    Western PA
    Posts
    25,945
    Quote Originally Posted by ga-hvac-tech View Post
    I pretty much agree with JP with one exception (as noted in my previous post); I would encourage required training each time the CCW permit is issued (or renewed). Those of us that take this responsibly seriously could probably teach the instructor a thing or two... however IMO the casual citizen who gets a permit because 'his neighbor or brother did'... needs the training.

    I would suggest 6-8 hours of classroom split between gun laws, the seriousness of taking a life, and how to evaluate a situation before drawing.

    Then each NEW applicant needs a basic range course (one could substitute NRA or GOA training for this)... and a qualifying shoot. Each renewal needs a qualifying shoot. Qualifying would be something simple like 5 rounds in a target grouped nicely, while the instruct\or discussed and watched your handling of the gun and attitude towards basic gun safety.
    I have spent a LOT of time doing research into the laws surrounding self-defense shootings.

    I plan on taking an upcoming course in Ohio and passing their shooting course. I live less than 1/2 mile from the state line and, as of right now, I'm not permitted to carry there.

    FYI. I do not do so, regardless of the fact that I could easily get away with it.

  13. #156
    Join Date
    Aug 2004
    Location
    S.E. Pa
    Posts
    6,300
    Quote Originally Posted by jpsmith1cm View Post
    As we're discussing this, my wife piped in.

    Her sister is a teacher in Ohio.

    She (the sister) has stated that "If they make me carry a gun, I'll quit my job"

    Who would MAKE her carry a gun?

    All that should happen is to remove the restriction, the PROHIBITION, on carrying a firearm.

    They should offer a choice to teachers:

    a) firearms training, which includes basics of their state's gun laws and incident response or

    b) free battle dressings

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