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  1. #1340
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    Quote Originally Posted by air1 View Post
    I think we need to first identify the problem before we can propose a solution.
    People that do not wish to follow the norms of society easily get their hands on guns and cause the rest of society to pay the price.
    Never argue with a fool, onlookers may not be able to tell the difference. —Mark Twain

  2. #1341
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    Quote Originally Posted by ga-hvac-tech View Post
    Looks like I need to read this thread and get involved again...

    First comment (not having read the thread yet):

    Never saw a gun in my life that killed someone unless it was in the hands of a person. Also saw a lot of those same hands (a person you know) kill someone with a knife, machete, baseball bat, big stick, pipe wrench, pall-peen hammer (my great-grand-father was murdered with a ball-peen hammer... true fact). You gun haters need to reconcile the reality that another weapon will be front-center the minute guns are not. However:

    Guns will ALWAYS be available... because there will always be an illegal way to get guns. Note Mexico... our neighbor to the south: Citizen ownership of guns is not the norm down there... yet the cartels have endless guns (and some of them were supplied by the US govt--Operation Fast and Furious). Yet crime in Mexico is WORSE than the USA.

    Seems there is an example just south of our border your anti-gun ideals are just that... ideals... which are PROVEN to not work.

    Tell you what: If you want to live somewhere without guns... there are lots of English speaking countries you can move to. Just leave us with our freedoms.
    A gun is a lot more efficient tool to kill other people than a hammer. Otherwise we would have a hammer in our holsters. The question is how efficient a tool do we need to kill with? Another is do we need 15 round mags?
    Never argue with a fool, onlookers may not be able to tell the difference. —Mark Twain

  3. #1342
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    Mar 2008
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    Long Beach, CA
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    Take an incident like Newtown. There are many possible causes for such a crime and ways to curtail such crimes in the future. Let’s list some. I’ll list them in my order of importance.

    1) Mrs. Lanza introduced her sick son to very deadly semi-auto weapons.
    2) She did not prevent him from having access to these weapons.
    3) If the neighbors knew that the mentally unstable Adam had access to these weapons there is nothing the police could do about it if they were made aware of this deadly situation.
    4) Adam harbored a hostile, anti-social outlook upon society.
    5) He had probably been picked on and thought of negatively his whole life.
    6) He rarely received anything positive from people around him.
    7) Armed guards did not stop him as he entered the school.

    1, 2 and 3 are front and center. 4, 5, and 6 are so common that plucking those people from society is virtually impossible. 7 is very expensive, not practical, not effective and probably not accepted by most elementary school parents.

  4. #1343
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    Sep 2005
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    Quote Originally Posted by jpsmith1cm View Post
    Because he is petrified of freedom.
    I would add he is petrified of the responsibility of that freedom. Kinda like a child who is too lazy to live life... yet is 'working' their parents (and anyone else who is dumb enough to allow themselves to be manipulated)...
    GA-HVAC-Tech

    Quality work at a fair price with excellent customer service!

    Romans Ch's 5-6-7-8

    2 Chronicles 7:14

  5. #1344
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    Sep 2005
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    Atlanta GA area
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    Quote Originally Posted by the dangling wrangler View Post
    Cool! Love it!!!!!

    Hey DW... how's it going? Give me a call when you have time... nothing changed here except a Spring day in the winter... outdoor temp is 71D.... In January...
    GA-HVAC-Tech

    Quality work at a fair price with excellent customer service!

    Romans Ch's 5-6-7-8

    2 Chronicles 7:14

  6. #1345
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    Sep 2005
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    Quote Originally Posted by Brian GC View Post
    Take an incident like Newtown. There are many possible causes for such a crime and ways to curtail such crimes in the future. Let’s list some. I’ll list them in my order or importance.

    1) Mrs. Lanza introduced her sick son to very deadly semi-auto weapons.
    2) She did not prevent him from having access to these weapons.
    3) If the neighbors knew that the mentally unstable Adam had access to these weapons there is nothing the police could do about it if they were made aware of this deadly situation.
    4) Adam harbored a hostile, anti-social outlook upon society.
    5) He had probably been picked on and thought of negatively his whole life.
    6) He rarely received anything positive from people around him.
    7) Armed guards did not stop him as he entered the school.

    1, 2 and 3 are front and center. 4, 5, and 6 are so common that plucking those people from society is virtually impossible. 7 is very expensive, not practical, not effective and probably not accepted by most elementary school parents.
    I have a 'C' note that says if you collected ALL the "legal" guns... mass murder crimes would STILL happen... Care to take the bet? And I will take it a step farther: There would still be mass murders with guns... cause folks can get them illegally. Warning: In the 1920's... a person bombed a school and killed over 40 kids... worst kid mass murder in modern history... and NO GUNS were involved.

    Looking forward to having an extra 'C' note... that is... if the lib is man enough to take the bet.
    GA-HVAC-Tech

    Quality work at a fair price with excellent customer service!

    Romans Ch's 5-6-7-8

    2 Chronicles 7:14

  7. #1346
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    Quote Originally Posted by ga-hvac-tech View Post

    Guns will ALWAYS be available...
    It is slogans like this and “guns don’t kill” that need to be dismantled.

    Let’s take your “guns will always be available” slogan to the Newtown incident. Do you really think that Adam Lanza could have stockpiled those weapons and got the experience to use them if his mother forbid them in her house? I realize older people can just buy them, but in this occurrence how would a whack job like him have bought and possessed them behind his mother’s back?

    That incident started with the mother. She was just another survivalist nut.

  8. #1347
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    May 2000
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    Rochester, NY, USA
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    Quote Originally Posted by Brian GC View Post
    When a topic is discussed both sides state facts that are pro and con to an argument. In a courtroom the persecution and defense both state facts. When you hear someone (on your side) state facts it should not allow you to suspend critical thinking.

    If you cannot see that having bombs planted in your house and having your house shot up is evidence that that person is in extreme danger, much more than the average citizen, then you are blind.

    Here is some Coolwhip logic:

    The Pope has armed guards around him 24/7 so he should condone CCW worldwide.

    Our military uses RPG’s, surface-to-air, grenades, tear gas, etc, so who are they to say we shouldn’t be allowed those same devices?

    Since cops can CCW then any untrained yahoo should be allowed to CCW.

    How about this one: ‘Guns don’t kill’ so why don’t the Israelis let the Palestinians have them? The possession of a gun doesn’t make someone any more of a threat.
    Even the worlds greatest pacifist saw the need for firearms

    "Among the many misdeeds of the British rule in India, history will look upon the act of depriving a whole nation of arms, as the blackest."
    -- Mahatma Gandhi
    BEING AN ADULT

    is the dumbest thing I have ever done

  9. #1348
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    Quote Originally Posted by ga-hvac-tech View Post
    I have a 'C' note that says if you collected ALL the "legal" guns... mass murder crimes would STILL happen... Care to take the bet? And I will take it a step farther: There would still be mass murders with guns... cause folks can get them illegally. Warning: In the 1920's... a person bombed a school and killed over 40 kids... worst kid mass murder in modern history... and NO GUNS were involved.

    Looking forward to having an extra 'C' note... that is... if the lib is man enough to take the bet.
    Just another silly comeback that states "if it is not an absolute fix, it is no fix at all".

  10. #1349
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    Mar 2008
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    Quote Originally Posted by jmac00 View Post
    Even the worlds greatest pacifist saw the need for firearms

    "Among the many misdeeds of the British rule in India, history will look upon the act of depriving a whole nation of arms, as the blackest."
    -- Mahatma Gandhi
    You and GA just can't talk about Lanza's mother can you? Having a little difficulty spinning that one?

  11. #1350
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    May 2000
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    Rochester, NY, USA
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    Quote Originally Posted by Brian GC View Post
    It is slogans like this and “guns don’t kill” that need to be dismantled.

    Let’s take your “guns will always be available” slogan to the Newtown incident. Do you really think that Adam Lanza could have stockpiled those weapons and got the experience to use them if his mother forbid them in her house? I realize older people can just buy them, but in this occurrence how would a whack job like him have bought and possessed them behind his mother’s back?

    That incident started with the mother. She was just another survivalist nut.




    That is a pretty stupid statement. The only thing we do know about Nancy Lanza is she was totally irresponsible with the firearms she did have. SHE is the only enabler in the entire Sandy Hook massacre. Her son did try and purchase firearms from a dealer and the dealer turned him down BECAUSE of the NICS.

    as we have all ready been over this a couple thousand times, lets do it one more time.

    There are over 300 million gun in America (That anyone knows of, how many are there that the government doesn't know about). The black market for guns is so huge, even if you banned every gun on the planet today, this hour. It would take another 50+ years to get rid of all of them. So there are two options: Get rid of all the guns that you know of and have millions of people die defenseless, or continue to let Law abiding, responsible citizens defend themselves and there loved ones and keep the death toll to a minimum.

    Your choice??? My choice is to protect myself and my loved ones with a gun. Im to hold and decrepit to fight someone hand-to-hand
    BEING AN ADULT

    is the dumbest thing I have ever done

  12. #1351
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    Sep 2007
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    Boise, ID
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    Quote Originally Posted by jmac00 View Post
    [/U][/B]


    Im to hold and decrepit to fight someone hand-to-hand
    I hear your pretty ugly too......cant you make that work for you like Medusa's mask? LOL!
    If a nation expects to be ignorant and free, in a state of civilization, it expects what will never be. (Thomas Jefferson 1816)

  13. #1352
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    Mar 2008
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    Long Beach, CA
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    Quote Originally Posted by jmac00 View Post
    [/U][/B]


    That is a pretty stupid statement. The only thing we do know about Nancy Lanza is she was totally irresponsible with the firearms she did have. SHE is the only enabler in the entire Sandy Hook massacre. Her son did try and purchase firearms from a dealer and the dealer turned him down BECAUSE of the NICS.

    as we have all ready been over this a couple thousand times, lets do it one more time.

    There are over 300 million gun in America (That anyone knows of, how many are there that the government doesn't know about). The black market for guns is so huge, even if you banned every gun on the planet today, this hour. It would take another 50+ years to get rid of all of them. So there are two options: Get rid of all the guns that you know of and have millions of people die defenseless, or continue to let Law abiding, responsible citizens defend themselves and there loved ones and keep the death toll to a minimum.

    Your choice??? My choice is to protect myself and my loved ones with a gun. Im to hold and decrepit to fight someone hand-to-hand
    I am in favor of home defense too, but not for people like Mrs. Lanza unless she can prove her crazy son doesn't have access to them. When they fall into the wrong hands it should be looked upon like parents letting drunken teenagers drive home from their house. No difference.

    If Mrs. Lanza is front and center in this massacre why isn’t the press or the NRA holding her at least partially accountable? Why aren't solutions explored along those lines?

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