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  1. #1548
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    Sep 2005
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    Quote Originally Posted by barbar View Post
    You may not care, but for data I can find between 40-50% of Americans (all your neighbors) have concerns about the present gun situation, being it real or not, them being big girl or not!. Are their rights as equal to yours, if the present gun situation is having a direct impact on their pursuit of happiness.
    You said pot smoking, is that not illegal, so law has covered, any impact that this may have on your pursuit of happiness.
    So quite a simple question, which has the stronger legal and moral value, the original founding document or the second amendment?
    What part of "Shall not be infringed" is not clear. In the USA... some things are a matter of LAW... Whether it feels good or not.

    I am sure you have some of those things in your country... If I were living there I would accept them. What I wonder is why you do not accept them in our society... even though you do not even live here.

    Seems to me yet another person is trying to dis-arm America...

    I have a question: Why is it SOOOOO important to disarm America? Give me a reason. Note: Safety is NOT a reason... the stats are clear safety comes from armed citizens... not disarmed citizens. So try something else.
    GA-HVAC-Tech

    Quality work at a fair price with excellent customer service!

    Romans Ch's 5-6-7-8

    2 Chronicles 7:14

  2. #1549
    Join Date
    Dec 2011
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    New Zealand
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    2,204
    Quote Originally Posted by jmac00 View Post
    show us your data, be sure it's from some liberal rag
    Data has come from our Local TV news, which is very balanced, which also gave the best predication for the last US election results.
    So do think that very few Americans have concerns real or not about the present gun issues.

  3. #1550
    Join Date
    Nov 2000
    Location
    Eastern PA
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    68,944
    Let's all stop talking about data and statistics and all of the other crap that is being used to change the way the United States of America works, and let's focus on the fact that Americans are under attack by forces within and foreign with the intent to take away American's rights as they are laid out in the U.S. Constitution.

    We are talking about what makes the U.S. different than other countries. We are talking about what make the U.S. the great and powerful nation it has become. The U.S. was built by Americans who relied on God, guns and guts to become the great nation that we are. The attacks on God and guns, and the lack of guts to repel those attackes effectively, can destroy the U.S. just as well as the reliance on God, guns and guts made the U.S. the great nation it is!

    OK, if you are not right now humming "My Country Tis of Thee" to yourself....!
    Government is a disease...
    ...masquerading as its own cure…
    Ecclesiastes 10:2 NIV


  4. #1551
    Join Date
    Jun 2004
    Location
    Eugene, Oregon
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    1,018
    Quote Originally Posted by jmac00 View Post
    how do explain skyrocketing gun sales and violent (and over all crime) cut by 50% in the last 20 year. Go to the FBI Uniform crime statistics and you can see for yourself, don't take my word for it.

    More guns = Less crime
    More guns does not equal less crime. The reasons crime went down had nothing to do with guns.
    http://online.wsj.com/article/SB1000...135009870.html
    http://www.csmonitor.com/USA/2010/05...ix-key-reasons
    "The bitterness of poor quality remains long after the sweetness of low price is forgotten". --Benjamin Franklin
    "Don't argue with an idiot, they will drag you down to their level and beat you with experience". --Mark Twain
    http://www.campbellmechanical.com

  5. #1552
    Join Date
    Sep 2005
    Location
    Atlanta GA area
    Posts
    21,187
    First thing folks need to understand is: News organizations are FOR PROFIT businesses... and as such make MORE $$$ when they 'suck up' to a public thinking trend.

    I can guarantee anyone who wants to understand: News groups could care less about being 'right' (correct) in what they report... what they are interested in is market share and ratings. They will literally say ANYTHING (even to the point of destroying the country they reside in) to make the ratings. The track record for this accusation is out there clear as sunshine if one wants to look for it.

    In GA's opinion... it is the folks who do NOT want to learn... who do not see this.
    GA-HVAC-Tech

    Quality work at a fair price with excellent customer service!

    Romans Ch's 5-6-7-8

    2 Chronicles 7:14

  6. #1553
    Join Date
    Sep 2005
    Location
    Atlanta GA area
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    21,187
    Quote Originally Posted by air1 View Post
    More guns does not equal less crime. The reasons crime went down had nothing to do with guns.
    http://online.wsj.com/article/SB1000...135009870.html
    http://www.csmonitor.com/USA/2010/05...ix-key-reasons
    I hate to be blunt there... however if someone actually believes that rubbish... they are dumber than roadkill.

    Tell me what YOU would do in a situation of a drugged maniac invading your house with a machete... and you have exactly 10 seconds (waaay too short a time to even get a 911 call off... much less the cops actually getting there). What are YOU gonna do? When you can answer that... you will have the answer as to why guns are just as important as cars, TV's, etc.

    Oh... lets not forget something... it may be a representative of the FED govt rather than a drugged criminal invading your house... what are you gonna do then?
    GA-HVAC-Tech

    Quality work at a fair price with excellent customer service!

    Romans Ch's 5-6-7-8

    2 Chronicles 7:14

  7. #1554
    Join Date
    Mar 2004
    Location
    SE Michigan
    Posts
    17,963
    Quote Originally Posted by RoBoTeq View Post
    Let's all stop talking about data and statistics and all of the other crap that is being used to change the way the United States of America works, and let's focus on the fact that Americans are under attack by forces within and foreign with the intent to take away American's rights as they are laid out in the U.S. Constitution.

    We are talking about what makes the U.S. different than other countries. We are talking about what make the U.S. the great and powerful nation it has become. The U.S. was built by Americans who relied on God, guns and guts to become the great nation that we are. The attacks on God and guns, and the lack of guts to repel those attackes effectively, can destroy the U.S. just as well as the reliance on God, guns and guts made the U.S. the great nation it is!

    OK, if you are not right now humming "My Country Tis of Thee" to yourself....!
    Right on!
    Behind the ostensible government sits enthroned an invisible government owing no allegiance and acknowledging no responsibility to the people.

    Theodore Roosevelt

  8. #1555
    Join Date
    Dec 2011
    Location
    New Zealand
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    2,204
    Quote Originally Posted by ga-hvac-tech View Post
    What part of "Shall not be infringed" is not clear. In the USA... some things are a matter of LAW... Whether it feels good or not.

    I am sure you have some of those things in your country... If I were living there I would accept them. What I wonder is why you do not accept them in our society... even though you do not even live here.

    Seems to me yet another person is trying to dis-arm America...

    I have a question: Why is it SOOOOO important to disarm America? Give me a reason. Note: Safety is NOT a reason... the stats are clear safety comes from armed citizens... not disarmed citizens. So try something else.
    Firstly I am pro-gun, but that does not mean, without restriction and responsibility by by the gun owner and law.

    So you are implying that I have no right to interact with others on the site!

    What i am is looking at the issue from a balanced point of view, you have assumed that I am anti gun, firstly I am pro people, after that comes other issues. Which leads back to my original question.

    "did not answer the simple question", which is the stronger legally and morally, the founding document or the second amendment. One or the other.

  9. #1556
    Join Date
    Jan 2001
    Posts
    7,817
    Looks like bam bam aint gonna do anything at all......

    Among the executive actions Biden is believed to have recommended to Obama are tougher penalties for people who lie on background checks, elevating gun trafficking to a felony charge and ending limits that make it harder for the federal government to research gun violence.

    The president's proposals are also expected to include steps for improving school safety and mental health care, as well as recommendations for addressing violence in entertainment and video games. Pro-gun groups, including the NRA, have long insisted that insufficient mental health care and violent images are more to blame for mass shootings than guns.

    Biden's recommendations follow weeks of wide-ranging talks with key stakeholders, including gun victim's groups, the entertainment and video game industries and gun owner advocacy groups.
    YOU SHALL REAP WHAT YOU HAVE _______ SOWN

  10. #1557
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    Mar 2005
    Location
    Houston, Texas
    Posts
    11,873

  11. #1558
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    Mar 2005
    Location
    Houston, Texas
    Posts
    11,873

    Don't Forget What Day The 19th Is


  12. #1559
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    Sep 2005
    Location
    Atlanta GA area
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    Quote Originally Posted by barbar View Post
    Firstly I am pro-gun, but that does not mean, without restriction and responsibility by by the gun owner and law.

    So you are implying that I have no right to interact with others on the site!

    What i am is looking at the issue from a balanced point of view, you have assumed that I am anti gun, firstly I am pro people, after that comes other issues. Which leads back to my original question.

    "did not answer the simple question", which is the stronger legally and morally, the founding document or the second amendment. One or the other.
    The problem with this idea 'balanced viewpoint' is... it is not.

    Lets take a hard look at the attitude towards guns in the USA... it has gone back and forth like a swinging pendulum as long as I can remember (around 1970 or so). So how is this 'flip-flop' a balanced viewpoint? The answer is... it is NOT. This idea of what I 'feel' at the moment (especially if the person is subject to emotional interpretation from news stories... or for that matter internet forums)... just proves we need a Constitution that does NOT CHANGE... because the public is obviously not smart enough nor mature enough to separate their thinking processes from their emotions.

    The cold hard truth is: the rule of law CANNOT be based on impulsive emotions. It would not be the rule of law if it were.

    Now if some folks want to live in a country ruled by emotions... that is their choice... However I, and my fellow Americans do NOT want to do so. I prefer a predictable set of laws, defined and enforced equally and fairly with NO bias. These laws by which a society chooses to be ruled... do NOT change based on whims... they do NOT change based on emotions... and most importantly they do NOT change based on campaigns of public opinion manipulation by deceitful polecats.

    So please keep your 'balanced viewpoint' in your country... THX!

    BTW: Over the weekend I did some shopping... and spent some time talking to folks in many many gun stores... BassPro, Walmart, Dave's gun room (gunsmith), Norcross Gun club and shooting range, and a few others. Now if an almost majority of folks in the USA supposedly are scared of guns... why are guns going off the shelves faster than they can be replaced? There are a few posts on this forum of gun manufacturers being back-ordered for over a year's production... Is this a society that is afraid of guns? Does not look that way to me.
    On the contrary... what it looks like to me... from talking to folks 'on the street' (not in the halls of intellectual games)... is folks realize safety comes from protecting themselves. And they are buying the ability and taking the training to do so... Because it is obvious the govt will not (and may well be the threat).

    IMO this idea folks do not like guns... is manufactured by a small group and being 'packaged' to try to influence public opinion. So if we follow public opinion (without the true balancing effect of the rule of law that does not change with emotions).... we have a society that is easier to manipulate than a room full of pre-schoolers looking at a HUGE box of candy.

    Now if you want to live in a society where a small minority can influence public opinion and as such change the rule of law... well that is your choice. Personally... that would be about as safe as turning Wash DC over to the drug cartels of Mexico... Sometimes I wonder if it is not already so (Wash DC run by the likes of drug cartel bosses).

    Oh... BTW: IMO if one says they are 'pro people'... yet they would not support folks having and keeping the right to defend themselves (both from criminals AND polecats). I have to wonder about the sincerity of that person's statement.

    Sorry guy... Over my 60 years... I find 'discussion' is anything but a road to wisdom and correct thinking. More like 'life experience' teaches folks to understand what works and what does not. The question becomes: Do the folks want to learn... or do they want to play games to gain control... And IMO it does not take a rocket scientist to separate the ones who want the best for folks from the ones who are in it for personal gain.

    One of the problems in America is: A majority of our polecats could care less about the citizens... and the only way the citizens can keep themselves from becoming serfs... is to keep and bear arms; to keep the 'fear of God' in the polecats. I guarantee you... polecats literally DROOL over the possibility of dis-arming the USA... and the power they would have.
    GA-HVAC-Tech

    Quality work at a fair price with excellent customer service!

    Romans Ch's 5-6-7-8

    2 Chronicles 7:14

  13. #1560
    Join Date
    Mar 2008
    Location
    Long Beach, CA
    Posts
    3,387
    Quote Originally Posted by Super Tech JJ View Post
    Hundreds of Thousands??? Where did you learn math?
    Yes, hundreds of thousands of parents, spouses, and general gun owners across the nation that leave guns accessible to people that should be cut off from them.

    If we kept track of our guns like we do our wallets, wads of cash, passports, and our spouses wedding ring we could cut the black market in half.

    Here’s a solution: Make every gun on the market a minimum of $10,000. That would drive up the cost of existing guns so much that they would be only affordable to the rich. We could offer a $1,000/gun cash buyback, no questions asked. The thieves would be breaking into homes to steal all the unsecured guns. The gun owners would have to pay $10,000 for a new one. Ya won’t leave that laying around anymore. And when Adam Lanza asks mommy for a gun she’d say “hell no, they are too expensive.” Get cops cashing in on the program too with confiscated guns. And you gun nuts could then brag about having a couple hundred thousand dollars worth of guns in your cabinet/safe.

    That would take guns off the street and teach all gun owners to secure their weaponry.

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