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  1. #27
    Join Date
    Dec 2002
    Location
    Houston,Tx.
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    16,000
    Quote Originally Posted by BaldLoonie View Post
    That will work and is clearly addressed in the installation manual if they will get it out and look at it.
    Are you positive he can achieve de-humidication in the communication mode? this says no. Remember normally Y1 and Y2 are "inputs" but they become "outputs" when installed with a UAPM, so I would like to see how his system can be wired in a true "communication" mode were there is a constant signal to the condenser and also provide de-humidication.


    Figure 27 of the install manual.

    SPECIAL CONFIGURATION –COMMUNICATING THERMOSTAT AND FURNACE WITH A NONCOMMUNICATING CONDENSER Y1 and Y2 – These terminals may be used to connect directly to a non-communicating condenser when a communicating thermostat is installed to the furnace but a non-communicating condenser is installed in the system. While the optimum configuration is with a communicating condenser connected to the network, there may be installations where this is not desired. In these cases, the thermostat will be communicating with the furnace control and the furnace control will energize the condenser as necessary (the additional relays have been added to the furnace control to allow this operation). The thermostat connections labeled “Y1” and “Y2” on the I.F.C. are normally inputs to the furnace control to turn on the blower when they are energized. However, in this configuration, these (normally) inputs become outputs to energize the condenser when a cooling call has been sent from the communicating thermostat.


    __________________________________________________ _______________________
    “Experience is a hard teacher because she gives the test first, the lesson afterwards". - Vernon Law

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  2. #28
    Join Date
    May 2000
    Location
    Indianapolis, IN, USA
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    34,156
    To have dehum, could skip the comm control and use a Honeywell IAQ or the like.

    Sent from my HTC VLE_U using Tapatalk 2

  3. #29
    Join Date
    Dec 2012
    Posts
    17
    What about jumper Y1 to HUM SAT, install a diode on Y1 out wire, then jumper Y2 to Y1 wire downstream (down current) of the diode.

    I think HUM SAT would cause furnace blower to run at 85% while Y1 terminal is hot. When Y2 becomes hot, diode would prevent Y1 terminal and HUM SAT terminal from becoming hot, so blower would run at 100%.

    I'M WELL AWARE THIS ISN'T A DIY FORUM, AND WHAT I'M PROPOSING SHOULDN'T BE TRIED UNLESS YOU ARE A TECH WHO KNOWS FOR CERTAIN HOW THESE BOARDS WORK. I'M ONLY GUESSING AND PROVIDING "OUT OF THE BOX" GUESSES. I HAVEN'T A CLUE WHICH TERMINAL REQUIRES 24V POWER TO CHANGE BLOWER SPEED FROM 100% TO 85%. AS HAS PREVIOUSLY BEEN MENTIONED, DIP SWITCHES HAVE CONTROL OVER WHAT THIS SYSTEM DOES & DOES NOT DO.

    BaldLoonie, thank you for mentioning the Honeywell IAQ stat. Current contractor will provide either the 501 or 550 series stat since it was included in price, but I will research Honeywell IAQ for possible future use.

    Another thing to consider when pondering what size unit my home requires: I have a 140 gallon salt water aquarium in living room, 15 gallon water auto top off tank, 40 gallon filtration refrugium, 5 gallon skimmer, and 15 gallon salt water mixing tank. So I have a huge 80 degree radiant heater in the living room. I must be careful how low the humidity gets to prevent over evaporation from aquarium.

    Everybody, please continue this discussion,
    Tripntx

  4. #30
    Join Date
    Dec 2012
    Posts
    17
    Copied from RUUD website:

    UAPM-JEZ Series Ruud Ultra Series 14.5 SEER with The Comfort Control System featuring R-410A Refrigerant

    HUMIDITY CONTROL
    When matched with a Prestige Series Air Handler, the system adjusts airflow to help control humidity for unsurpassed comfort in the cooling mode.

  5. #31
    Join Date
    Jun 2001
    Location
    Moore, Oklahoma, United States
    Posts
    4,271
    Varying the amount of cfm per ton changes the tempature of the evaporator coil and the sensible heat ratio. 325 - 500 is accepatble, going below 325 doesn't significantly increase sensible heat ratio. Going over 500 cfm per ton reduces latent heat removal to minimal levels.

    With the internal high latent load and the relatively large AC, you have your work cut out for you even at 325 cfm per ton....

    Keep in mind the AC can only dehumidify when its running, and in moderate weather the large AC will cycle off before the coil gets loaded with water. Smaller AC dehumidify better because the unit run long enough for the coil to get cold, even on moderate weather.

  6. #32
    Join Date
    Dec 2002
    Location
    Houston,Tx.
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    16,000
    Quote Originally Posted by tripntx View Post
    .Another thing to consider when pondering what size unit my home requires: I have a 140 gallon salt water aquarium in living room, 15 gallon water auto top off tank, 40 gallon filtration refrugium, 5 gallon skimmer, and 15 gallon salt water mixing tank..
    Everybody, please continue this discussion,
    Tripntx
    Trip, don't spend a lot of your time justifying the size of your a/c here, most folks here don't have any idea the " Bermuda Triangle" we live in around Houston, I would not even consider any oversize posts, just read past them or your will be a mental case in a week, you can't un-ring a bell.
    __________________________________________________ _______________________
    “Experience is a hard teacher because she gives the test first, the lesson afterwards". - Vernon Law

    "Never let success go to your head, and never let failure go to your heart". - Unknown

  7. #33
    Join Date
    Dec 2002
    Location
    Houston,Tx.
    Posts
    16,000
    Quote Originally Posted by BaldLoonie View Post
    To have dehum, could skip the comm control and use a Honeywell IAQ or the like.
    Well your out of my league now, but I could hook him up with the Ruud Tech support person in Houston, we call him the professor.

    John, I know you probably know more about the Ruud equipment than I do, no doubt, I am basically service now, and have installers that do all the setup, so I am just a little behind on setup now days, but I still consider myself a great service tech, now were is that "pat on the back" gif.
    __________________________________________________ _______________________
    “Experience is a hard teacher because she gives the test first, the lesson afterwards". - Vernon Law

    "Never let success go to your head, and never let failure go to your heart". - Unknown

  8. #34
    Join Date
    Dec 2002
    Location
    Houston,Tx.
    Posts
    16,000
    Quote Originally Posted by tripntx View Post
    Copied from RUUD website:

    UAPM-JEZ Series Ruud Ultra Series 14.5 SEER with The Comfort Control System featuring R-410A Refrigerant

    HUMIDITY CONTROL
    When matched with a Prestige Series Air Handler, the system adjusts airflow to help control humidity for unsurpassed comfort in the cooling mode.
    But, you don't have an "air handler" you have a Furnace, and "air handler" is an electric device.
    __________________________________________________ _______________________
    “Experience is a hard teacher because she gives the test first, the lesson afterwards". - Vernon Law

    "Never let success go to your head, and never let failure go to your heart". - Unknown

  9. #35
    Join Date
    May 2000
    Location
    Indianapolis, IN, USA
    Posts
    34,156
    Maybe ODD isn't possible with this configuration with any stat. I've only done it with the predecessor RGPR with no communication. That one we used the Vision Pro IAQ on for dual fuel too.

  10. #36
    Join Date
    Dec 2012
    Posts
    17
    Quote Originally Posted by Mr Bill View Post
    But, you don't have an "air handler" you have a Furnace, and "air handler" is an electric device.
    You are so right, unfortunately I didn't pay attention to "air handler" when I was picking a condenser to go with my furnace. I simply clued in on the part where it would adjust airflow to help control humidity. It does beg the question, how is it connected to an "air handler"? What is different about between how it connects to a "prestige series air handler" versus how it connects to my "ultra series gas furnace"?

    What are "prestige series" air handlers? All I see are Ultra, Achiever, and some that aren't listed as part of series.

  11. #37
    Join Date
    Dec 2012
    Posts
    17
    I found this in another thread: http://hvac-talk.com/vbb/showthread....i+stage+system

    "A little secret if you go with the Ruud.
    A two stage thermostat tied into the On Demand Dehumidification function can give you a quazi two stage system. Or of course a humidistat can be used if you prefer"

    "My understanding is that Doc was talking about wiring the thermostat so the VS blower runs in the lower airflow dehumidification mode when the thermostat is calling for 1st stage cooling, then kicks into normal airflow if the thermostat calls for 2nd stage cooling.

    If this is the case, all VS equipment can be wired the same way, with no relays or creative wiring.

    On Trane equipment you would need to remove the jumper between BK and R. Then wire the Y1 from the thermostat to Y in the furnace/AHU, and Y2 from the thermostat to BK in the unit.

    All VS equipment I have seen has a similar terminal that will cause the blower to run at 80% if there is no control voltage to the terminal. "

  12. #38
    Join Date
    Dec 2002
    Location
    Houston,Tx.
    Posts
    16,000
    You can't add relays to this system anyway, the motor speed is controlled by signals/communication, from the thermostat to the furnace to the condenser, all through boards starting with the thermostat it's basically a board also. I don't know if the system has changed since that thread was posted in 2006 or not, that's been almost 7 years, if any changes were made that thread would be irrelevant now.


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
    __________________________________________________ _______________________
    “Experience is a hard teacher because she gives the test first, the lesson afterwards". - Vernon Law

    "Never let success go to your head, and never let failure go to your heart". - Unknown

  13. #39
    Join Date
    Jun 2001
    Location
    Moore, Oklahoma, United States
    Posts
    4,271
    I think you are making it harder than it needs to be. Just get a non-communicating thermostat with dehumidification control. The thermostat will drop the dehumidify terminal when the humidity is high, the board will slow the blower down. No need to to Y1/Y2 tricks, relays, diodes, etc.

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