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  1. #1
    Join Date
    Oct 2011
    Location
    somers ct
    Posts
    4

    York Yt oil foaming

    Hey guys, a new member, been around a long time with big chillers, mostly Tranes, I am having a oil foaming problem, with a small YT r-11 chiller, too much refrigerant in the oil sump, heater works fine, 140deg. off, ref/oil eductor is closed off, purge ref. coil has no leaks, is this a common problem with flash off,when the vent opens momentairy drop in pressure and shut down on low diff, and any ideas on a soloution?

  2. #2
    Join Date
    Aug 2006
    Location
    Mixing oil and fire with a big spoon.
    Posts
    4,493
    welcome to the site! around here, you need to give a lot of information, more is better. do not make an assumption about what is important and what isn't important...give all the info possible. and it helps to talk about pudding and asparagus since everybody seems to be talking about it in most of the threads for some reason.

    as for this chiller, is the chiller pretty tight? or is it leaky? medium leaky?
    "If you pull one more stunt like you just pulled with Tommy, you won't have to get on a plane because I will personally kick your ass from here to Korea!" - Best of the Best

  3. #3
    Join Date
    Sep 2011
    Location
    Northwest Louisiana
    Posts
    281
    Early model YTs had the oil cooler laced thru the botttom of cooler, so on start up some were bad to cavitate oil pump until oil warmed up, we had success in adding AMOT to oil piping as the later versions of YTs have. this mod bypasses oil cooler until oil warms to apox 120 degrees. Also the vent valve may be hung full open dropping pressure in oil sump foaming out oil on start-up, valve is normally closed except for small port allowing some flow of gas until a few minutes has lapsed then going full open. You are fortunate to have been exposed to the best low pressure chiller ever put on market by any manufacturer! Hope this info helps.

  4. #4
    Join Date
    Dec 2008
    Location
    Dixiana, AL
    Posts
    2,611
    Quote Originally Posted by jayguy View Post
    ....and it helps to talk about pudding and asparagus since everybody seems to be talking about it in most of the threads for some reason......
    Dang, jay, you're gonna make the new guy wonder why he ever wanted out of prison just to get into an industry with a bunch'a guys that talk about pee & puddin'.

    Arrow: good advice from jay. Your basic question is "The oil is foaming in the sump - what do I do?". That ain't much for me to make up a lie from. You gave a little info in that the oil reclaim is valved out and there are no apparent leaks in the purge drum coil, but those two things don't generally create problems at startup. Oil pressure? Oil level? Oil temp sensor telling you the truth? How long between shutdown and restart? Oil temp to bearings? Anyone changed the vent solenoid? What's the timing on the vent solenoid? And so on and so forth......

  5. #5
    Join Date
    Feb 2009
    Location
    good old Europe
    Posts
    160
    I fully agree with the comments before and want to add a few more questions, -which oil is used with the compressor?
    -what is the saturated pressure / temperature in the chiller after it has been stopped for a while vs. oil temperature?
    -does the oil foaming appear on start or during operation?
    "Quality exists, when the price is long forgotten."

    Henry Royce

  6. #6
    Join Date
    Oct 2011
    Location
    somers ct
    Posts
    4
    Thanks for all the good replies replies, vent solonoid confirmed, not leaking, foaming is excessive when vent valve opens, high boiling for about 30 seconds long enough to cause pressure drop and lock out, then oil recovers, tried delaying opening beyond the initial board settings, sometimes it work, sometimes not.

  7. #7
    Join Date
    Aug 2000
    Location
    Austell, Ga.
    Posts
    1,296
    The late, great Mssr. Don Bull in York engineering wrote several papers on the York YT's, OT's & HT's on this problem he titled "System Depression".
    Condensing the several pages of his very wisened pages I will shorten his findings & reccomendations quite a bit.

    1- Insure that the condenser water pump does "NOT" start before the start signal is initiated to the motor starter. If the condenser water pump is to be started before the chiller compressor see to it that it starts at least "8 Hours" before the chiller.

    2- If problem still exists after the "Correct" starting sequence of the condenser water pump, then the start signal to the motor starter should be delayed for up to five minutes by installing a time delay relay allowing the oil temperatures and pressures to stabilize prior to the compressor starting.

    R.I.P. Don, As for one....I miss your very gruff voice and reading your now collectable "Green Sheets".
    Ain't "None" of us as smart as "All" of us..

  8. #8
    Join Date
    Dec 2008
    Location
    Dixiana, AL
    Posts
    2,611
    Didn't know Don had departed from us. That is a loss.

  9. #9
    Join Date
    Dec 2008
    Location
    Dixiana, AL
    Posts
    2,611
    Quote Originally Posted by arrow4 View Post
    Thanks for all the good replies replies, vent solonoid confirmed, not leaking, foaming is excessive when vent valve opens, high boiling for about 30 seconds long enough to cause pressure drop and lock out, then oil recovers, tried delaying opening beyond the initial board settings, sometimes it work, sometimes not.
    So the only thing we know now that we didn't know before is that the vent solenoid has been confirmed. What was confirmed about it we have no idea, but it is confirmed, so I guess that's a good thing. Hope your chiller quits going out on low oil pressure..........

  10. #10
    Join Date
    Oct 2011
    Location
    somers ct
    Posts
    4
    Vent solonoid does not leak by, this was confirmed by inspection and testing, thanks for the reply though

  11. #11
    Join Date
    Dec 2008
    Location
    Dixiana, AL
    Posts
    2,611
    Quote Originally Posted by arrow4 View Post
    Vent solonoid does not leak by, this was confirmed by inspection and testing, thanks for the reply though
    I'm truly sorry if this offends you, but the vent solenoid is definitely leaking by - there's a 3/16" hole drilled in the dividing wall of the valve, so you have no control over whether it "leaks" or not.

    I promise this will be my last time to comment unless we get some info worth commenting on. Is there any chance that you could answer any of the questions that have been asked? As jay said, the more info the better. And even though you may think you're giving the needed info, I'll tell you what I had an old guy tell me once - "If you don't know what's wrong, then you don't know what's needed to make the diagnosis, so you giving me what you think you need isn't doing a lot of good, so answer the questions and give all of the information asked for and I'll cull out what I don't want". I took that lesson to heart. It's gotten me where I'm going much quicker over the years.

  12. #12
    Join Date
    Oct 2011
    Location
    somers ct
    Posts
    4
    again, I say thanks, and yes I am aware of the small vent, the plunger was changed, as the original one had a cracked disc seat, and flash off occoured before the compressor came up to full speed, after repalcing the plunger/seat, the start up problem ended. However, when the vent solonoid energizes app 4 min after start, and opens, this is when the real problem occours as ,most people can relate to what occours when you shake a bottle of warm coke, then open it, results are the same.

  13. #13
    Join Date
    Dec 2008
    Location
    Dixiana, AL
    Posts
    2,611
    Quote Originally Posted by arrow4 View Post
    ,most people can relate to what occours when you shake a bottle of warm coke, then open it, results are the same.
    I believe that the guys who have tried to help you are well aware of what the issues are that you're dealing with - that's why they and I asked you questions about your operating conditions so that we could try to help you. Apparently, you don't want any help since for some reason you can't get past the "confirmation" of the vent line solenoid and simply answer what's been asked. I reckon this was just an exercise to see whose time could be wasted. I wish you the best in your endeavor to figure out the answer to your own problem...........

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