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  1. #222
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    Jan 2001
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    Probably that Kato guy who killed Ron and Nicole.
    YOU SHALL REAP WHAT YOU HAVE _______ SOWN

  2. #223
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    Jun 2003
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    Tampa Bay, FL.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Brian GC View Post
    How did he know he was not getting a direct command from law enforcement and that it could be disregarded? How do you know that now?
    1) Because your not required by law to obey the advise of 911 operators. They can't see what's going on and your phone description is only hearsay therefore they have no jurisdiction to order you to do anything.
    2) He was in a public space and had the legal right to be there. There's no law that says I can't follow a criminal or honest citizen for that matter as long as I'm not trespassing on private property. Again, doing both of these things are FOOLISH, but not illegal.

  3. #224
    Join Date
    Aug 2004
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    S.E. Pa
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    As a former 911 operator and paramedic supervisor let me ditto hydra's points. The 911 operator must always advise bystanders not to get involved in such matters. The only advice they give is to attempt to keep the victim still without movement, attempt to secure the scene so nobody else gets hurt or run over, send someone to flag down emergency responders and administer CPR/ 1st aid only if so trained. We did not attempt to teach CPR over the phone due to the liability.

    As for an operator's advice versus events on scene, they change in a flash and the operator cannot possibly keep up. Keep in mind in many instances, that operator is juggling multiple calls so any directions or advice they give is not something thought out but essentially a standing order based on what I said above. In this case, Zim. perceived a perp. casing out houses to hit in a development riddled recently with break-ins. Martin's appearance and actions certainly sound suspicious enough based on the information made public. It is, in my opinion, reasonable that Zim. would have sufficient evidence of suspicion to attempt to surveil Martin from a distance just to see what he was up to without confronting him. If Zim. wanted to confront the kid, why didn't he take him down back at his vehicle where it was more open and therefore much more advantageous to Zim. instead of moving to a more confined space with the possibility of ambush?

    There are numerous maps with the 911 times overlaid and they all indicate Zim. proceeded past the alley where the confrontation took place as the kid should have reached home. Then, as Zim. was returning towards his car he peeked down that alley where the kid popped out and confronted him. Why is no one playing the times and asking why Martin wasn't in his house at the time of the confrontation? What was Martin doing during all that time? Remember, he was running away from the first location and this kid was in good shape. So good that he had time to run home then double back and confront Zim. or hide and ambush him where they met. The aerial views of the development tell a lot about this story.

  4. #225
    Join Date
    May 2000
    Location
    Rochester, NY, USA
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    14,288
    Quote Originally Posted by corny View Post
    Da only one who is in danger of losing any freedoms over this is Zimmerman..... this isnt a gun control issue..... its an idiots with guns issue and it can be solved by throwing the idiot in jail.
    OR, it might be assault with the intent to kill issue.......

    naaa, I forgot, you were there. My apologies
    The Last four letters


    American = I Can, Republican = I Can, Democrats = Rats


    any questions

  5. #226
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    Jan 2001
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    7,741
    All we know for sure about this case is that George Zimmerman is not capable of defending himself against a teenage kid.......lol

    Without a gun....

    Probably very hen pecked..... anyone seen his wife.......that gal looks mean...

    I bet she berates him and probably even physically abuses him all the time..... its no wonder George had that cop fixation...... he wanted to have a sense of power.....brought on by the fact that he had been dominated by everyone in his life.....

    Lets just be glad that zimmerman took his rage out on one lone kid instead of climbing up onto a building or going to the mall and unleashing his fury at the world....

    Trayvon should get some sort of posthumus medal for saving the world from this monster......

    Trayvon sacraficed his own life that others may live.....
    YOU SHALL REAP WHAT YOU HAVE _______ SOWN

  6. #227
    Join Date
    Jan 2001
    Posts
    7,741
    Hmmmm... must have hit reply too early...

    Anyhow.... I bet when zimmerman was shooting trayvon he probably didnt even see trayvon but instead in a flash of time he saw his domineering wife...his mommy....some kids at school who picked on him.....his boss......his teacher at school who was failing him.....
    YOU SHALL REAP WHAT YOU HAVE _______ SOWN

  7. #228
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    Jun 2002
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    Dacula, GA
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    Quote Originally Posted by corny View Post
    Hmmmm... must have hit reply too early...

    Anyhow.... I bet when zimmerman was shooting trayvon he probably didnt even see trayvon but instead in a flash of time he saw his domineering wife...his mommy....some kids at school who picked on him.....his boss......his teacher at school who was failing him.....
    Who knows maybe he was just like the rest of us here, envisioned seeing you and just lost it. Understandable. . Thank you, thank you very much
    "I could have ended the war in a month. I could have made North Vietnam look like a mud puddle."
    "I have little interest in streamlining government or in making it more efficient, for I mean to reduce its size. I do not undertake to promote welfare, for I propose to extend freedom. My aim is not to pass laws, but to repeal them. It is not to inaugurate new programs, but to cancel old ones that do violence to the Constitution."
    Barry Goldwater

  8. #229
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    Mar 2008
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    Long Beach, CA
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    Quote Originally Posted by hearthman View Post
    As a former 911 operator and paramedic supervisor let me ditto hydra's points. The 911 operator must always advise bystanders not to get involved in such matters. The only advice they give is to attempt to keep the victim still without movement, attempt to secure the scene so nobody else gets hurt or run over, send someone to flag down emergency responders and administer CPR/ 1st aid only if so trained. We did not attempt to teach CPR over the phone due to the liability.

    As for an operator's advice versus events on scene, they change in a flash and the operator cannot possibly keep up. Keep in mind in many instances, that operator is juggling multiple calls so any directions or advice they give is not something thought out but essentially a standing order based on what I said above. In this case, Zim. perceived a perp. casing out houses to hit in a development riddled recently with break-ins. Martin's appearance and actions certainly sound suspicious enough based on the information made public. It is, in my opinion, reasonable that Zim. would have sufficient evidence of suspicion to attempt to surveil Martin from a distance just to see what he was up to without confronting him. If Zim. wanted to confront the kid, why didn't he take him down back at his vehicle where it was more open and therefore much more advantageous to Zim. instead of moving to a more confined space with the possibility of ambush?

    There are numerous maps with the 911 times overlaid and they all indicate Zim. proceeded past the alley where the confrontation took place as the kid should have reached home. Then, as Zim. was returning towards his car he peeked down that alley where the kid popped out and confronted him. Why is no one playing the times and asking why Martin wasn't in his house at the time of the confrontation? What was Martin doing during all that time? Remember, he was running away from the first location and this kid was in good shape. So good that he had time to run home then double back and confront Zim. or hide and ambush him where they met. The aerial views of the development tell a lot about this story.
    Hearthman,
    I commend you that you are the only one here that is willing to look a little deeper into this rather than just speaking in sweeping generalities.

    I listened to three of the timelines and none of the narrators listened to Zimmerman’s on-scene explanation he gave to the cops before speculating what took place when. Zimmerman was lying through his teeth to the police from the time after he got out of his car.

    His lies were:
    He got out of his car to look for addresses when an address was right in front of him.
    He said he had to walk to the other side of the complex to get an address. Not so he was walking in that direction to pursue Martin.
    He said Martin confronted him at the ‘T’ in the sidewalk. Not so, it happened at least 50’ from that ‘T’.
    Four minutes lapsed from the time he hung up to the time of the confrontation. That gave him a lot of time to further pursue Martin. His explanation to the police does not account for those four minutes.

    Since Zimmerman was obviously lying, what else is he lying about…like him confronting Martin instead of Martin confronting him. Even Martin’s girlfriend said “he cornered me.” But you are very correct that Martin should have reached his home in that time.

  9. #230
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    Dacula, GA
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    Quote Originally Posted by Brian GC View Post
    .....I listened to three of the timelines and none of the narrators listened to Zimmerman’s on-scene explanation he gave to the cops before speculating what took place when. Zimmerman was lying through his teeth to the police from the time after he got out of his car.

    His lies were:
    He got out of his car to look for addresses when an address was right in front of him.
    He said he had to walk to the other side of the complex to get an address. Not so he was walking in that direction to pursue Martin.
    He said Martin confronted him at the ‘T’ in the sidewalk. Not so, it happened at least 50’ from that ‘T’.
    Four minutes lapsed from the time he hung up to the time of the confrontation. That gave him a lot of time to further pursue Martin. His explanation to the police does not account for those four minutes.

    Since Zimmerman was obviously lying, what else is he lying about…like him confronting Martin instead of Martin confronting him. Even Martin’s girlfriend said “he cornered me.” But you are very correct that Martin should have reached his home in that time.
    Funny Brian, Please explain why should anyone listen to your made up stories on the death of Martin. You are always making up "facts" for us to digest and never seem to stop. Non fact No 1 in your post here:

    "He got out of his car to look for addresses when an address was right in front of him. He said he had to walk to the other side of the complex to get an address. Not so he was walking in that direction to pursue Martin."

    It was raining and at night. Windshield wet and hard to see, possible poor night vision but you discount these actual facts to invent one of your own "facts".

    "He said he had to walk to the other side of the complex to get an address. Not so he was walking in that direction to pursue Martin."

    How do you know this?

    Let it go Brian just say you think Zimmerman is guilty and that is your opinion and stop inventing "facts" all the time here on this thread. Gees give us all a break and take a "chill pill" you need something bad. Thank you, thank you very much
    "I could have ended the war in a month. I could have made North Vietnam look like a mud puddle."
    "I have little interest in streamlining government or in making it more efficient, for I mean to reduce its size. I do not undertake to promote welfare, for I propose to extend freedom. My aim is not to pass laws, but to repeal them. It is not to inaugurate new programs, but to cancel old ones that do violence to the Constitution."
    Barry Goldwater

  10. #231
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    Mar 2008
    Location
    Long Beach, CA
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    Quote Originally Posted by glennac View Post
    Funny Brian, Please explain why should anyone listen to your made up stories on the death of Martin. You are always making up "facts" for us to digest and never seem to stop. Non fact No 1 in your post here:

    "He got out of his car to look for addresses when an address was right in front of him. He said he had to walk to the other side of the complex to get an address. Not so he was walking in that direction to pursue Martin."

    It was raining and at night. Windshield wet and hard to see, possible poor night vision but you discount these actual facts to invent one of your own "facts".

    "He said he had to walk to the other side of the complex to get an address. Not so he was walking in that direction to pursue Martin."

    How do you know this?

    Let it go Brian just say you think Zimmerman is guilty and that is your opinion and stop inventing "facts" all the time here on this thread. Gees give us all a break and take a "chill pill" you need something bad. Thank you, thank you very much
    You should be embarrassed that you won't even listen to the 911 tape or Zimmerman’s description of events that night but you still seem to know the “facts.” I can only imagine where your 'facts' come from.

    Is the definition of 'troll' "someone who drops in to drop 'bombs' but won't engage in the conversation?"

  11. #232
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    Jun 2002
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    Dacula, GA
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    Quote Originally Posted by Brian GC View Post
    You should be embarrassed that you won't even listen to the 911 tape or Zimmerman’s description of events that night but you still seem to know the “facts.” I can only imagine where your 'facts' come from.

    Is the definition of 'troll' "someone who drops in to drop 'bombs' but won't engage in the conversation?"
    Funny I haven't given any "facts" but you have though and most are your invention. Not "facts" at all. Should be ashamed of your self, posting that stuff on here like that.

    I have now listened to the tapes and nothing there implicates Zimmerman in commiting a crime IMHO. But you see it as a crime because of the PC nature of this so you invent facts to get Zimmerman unless he can "prove" himself innocent beyond a reasonable doubt.

    Easy job here for the prosecution the way you want this case to go down. We understand this all to well. But you keep on with your make believe. Thank you, thank you very much
    "I could have ended the war in a month. I could have made North Vietnam look like a mud puddle."
    "I have little interest in streamlining government or in making it more efficient, for I mean to reduce its size. I do not undertake to promote welfare, for I propose to extend freedom. My aim is not to pass laws, but to repeal them. It is not to inaugurate new programs, but to cancel old ones that do violence to the Constitution."
    Barry Goldwater

  12. #233
    Join Date
    Nov 2000
    Location
    Eastern PA
    Posts
    68,938
    Yep, the killer with a judge for a father is back. Yet, his unarmed victim that he stalked and shot to death is not ever going to be able to come back. I'm sure that justice will be served.
    Government is a disease...
    ...masquerading as its own cure…
    Ecclesiastes 10:2 NIV


  13. #234
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    Mar 2008
    Location
    Long Beach, CA
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    3,377
    Quote Originally Posted by glennac View Post
    Funny I haven't given any "facts" but you have though and most are your invention. Not "facts" at all. Should be ashamed of your self, posting that stuff on here like that.

    I have now listened to the tapes and nothing there implicates Zimmerman in commiting a crime IMHO. But you see it as a crime because of the PC nature of this so you invent facts to get Zimmerman unless he can "prove" himself innocent beyond a reasonable doubt.

    Easy job here for the prosecution the way you want this case to go down. We understand this all to well. But you keep on with your make believe. Thank you, thank you very much
    If you cannot see the lies from Zimmerman then your ears are closed. He parked in front of a house and said he couldn't furnish 911 with an address. He said he encountered Martin at the 'T' in the sidewalk, lie #2. He never accounted for his whereabouts for the missing four minutes, lie #3. If I listened to it again I could come up with more.

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