Boiler System Air Issue
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  1. #1
    Join Date
    Jun 2011
    Location
    Seattle WA
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    1,225

    Boiler System Air Issue

    Hi Guys, we installed a Carrier boiler about a year ago and about 2 months after we got a no heat call. Came out and found that the system was full of air. The radiators have no bleeders. The return lines have spigots on them for bleeding. It was a straight change out with no funds available to re-do the piping. I bled all the air out which took 2 hours (no joke). Just got a call from the home owner again with the same issue. Somehow there is air getting into this system and the Honeywell Supervent is not getting rid of it. The old 50 year old boiler didn't have this issue. There was a shotty remodel done in the home, I'm wondering if they tied the domestic into the boiler lines somehow? Forgive me, boilers are not my specialty. Also, the Grudfos pump was set on Medium, I switched it to High in hopes that it might move the air to the eliminator better. Do you guys have any suggestions for me on this one?

    America; first we fight for our freedom,
    then we make laws to take it away.

    -Alfred E Newman

  2. #2
    Join Date
    May 2000
    Location
    Indianapolis, IN, USA
    Posts
    33,817
    Are you pumping away from the expansion tank/air vent?

  3. #3
    Join Date
    Jan 2004
    Location
    Lancaster PA
    Posts
    67,590
    Looks like the vent is piped up to a bypass. Won't get rid of air too well that way. What temp is the boiler high limit set to, and what PSIG is it running at.

    Are the rads old seam rads, that were converted over to hot water.
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  4. #4
    Join Date
    Jan 2004
    Location
    Lancaster PA
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    67,590
    Quote Originally Posted by BaldLoonie View Post
    Are you pumping away from the expansion tank/air vent?
    Looks like toward them, and the circ is mounted in a position(motor up) that the system should be at 20PSIG.
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  5. #5
    Join Date
    May 2012
    Location
    Upper Michigan
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    3,588
    Check the exp tank to see if its water logged, other than that I really can't tell what's going on because my pics are so small on my phone. Mabe the messed with the system and now your stuck bleeding it, sometimes that air takes some time to dislodge.

  6. #6
    Join Date
    Jan 2007
    Location
    Mn the state where absolutey nothing is allowed
    Posts
    1,330
    that is seriously ugly. your air problems are due to the near boiler piping.

    i know its the customers money, but like it or not its now your job to convince him to either live with it or pony up and have it done right.

    get Houlihans book pumping away. great book, can read in an hour. it will open you eyes to the difference between good, bad and ugly near boiler piping
    my boss thinks its possible to repeal the laws of physics

  7. #7
    Join Date
    Jun 2011
    Location
    Seattle WA
    Posts
    1,225
    I believe its set at 125* and 20 PSI. I'm not exactly sure about the temp, I would have to look at it again. I don't even know what a rad is... A guy I had working for me did the installation.
    America; first we fight for our freedom,
    then we make laws to take it away.

    -Alfred E Newman

  8. #8
    Join Date
    Jun 2011
    Location
    Seattle WA
    Posts
    1,225
    I know it looks like crap. It was either change out or lose the job which was clearly stated by the home owner. Why would the piping be causing air issues? Why did the old boiler work just fine with this piping?
    America; first we fight for our freedom,
    then we make laws to take it away.

    -Alfred E Newman

  9. #9
    Join Date
    Jun 2011
    Location
    Seattle WA
    Posts
    1,225
    Yes, its tied into the supply side and all the water is not forced through the vent. There are 2 tees in the main supply that build this vent/expansion manifold. I was wondering how good of a job this configuration could do. Would adding another vent or re-doing this one help me?
    America; first we fight for our freedom,
    then we make laws to take it away.

    -Alfred E Newman

  10. #10
    Join Date
    May 2012
    Location
    Upper Michigan
    Posts
    3,588
    Do you have leaks anywhere? The tank is full it will lose pressure and take in air. Some systems are harder than others to get the air out. If you pump away from your air scoop the pressure drop will let the air out also. I would be looking for leaks or bad exp tank, air has to come from somewhere.

  11. #11
    Join Date
    Feb 2010
    Location
    In a boiler room
    Posts
    7,031
    Yes, it is the piping that is causing your air problems.

    Read the book ch4man mentioned and pipe accordingly. You will not have air problems again.

  12. #12
    Join Date
    Jan 2004
    Location
    Lancaster PA
    Posts
    67,590
    Quote Originally Posted by LibertyTree View Post
    Yes, its tied into the supply side and all the water is not forced through the vent. There are 2 tees in the main supply that build this vent/expansion manifold. I was wondering how good of a job this configuration could do. Would adding another vent or re-doing this one help me?
    All the water is to go through the vent. And of course it should be much bigger.
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  13. #13
    Join Date
    May 2012
    Location
    Upper Michigan
    Posts
    3,588
    Chuck and beenthere must have good eyes, everytime I look at the pic I feel like mine are going to bleed lol

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