New DOE mins. Waivers?

[Glennhvac]

Hey all. As you know in May 2013 many regions will have a new minimum efficiency for furnaces which will require condensing units. I have been notifying clients with older units about this and informing them of the added cost once we can no longer install 80%. I have also let them be aware of the difficulty venting a 90 in many cases.

My question is, does anyone know of any waivers to this new law? Sure enough yesterday I was on a no heat call on one of the original Carrier 80's. That unit with the two boards, one up by the inducer. I got him going but told him he better decide before May what he wants to do. Sure enough this was a condo with no way possible to vent to the outdoors with PVC!

He has a Bvent that runs up through second floor but I did not get into checking it out. This poses another question. Let's say you run into one of these scenes with say a straight shot chimney or Bvent that could be used as a chase for PVC. Years back I used the chimney as a means to run PVC for an Amana HTM/w dhw. My question is if this is doable as a last resort to vent PVC it means the water heater would have to be a PVC vent model as well. Has anyone tied a 90 furnace and fan vented PVC water heater into a common PVC vent?

This DOE ruling is going to open up a rat nest!

[craig1]

Has anyone tied a 90 furnace and fan vented PVC water heater into a common PVC vent?

It is not allowed because the pipe is positive pressure and the exhaust will just back up into whatever appliance is not firing.

[BigBacardi]

been dealing with this for several years up in canada. can honestly say still have never ever run intosituation where i cant vent.

a lot of time owners pissed about location.....but not my problem.

rules are rules.

i dont like it, but meh....whatever...as long as we all on same playing field

[carmon]

have fun...... we lost 80 % furnaces 4 years ago..... venting the high effiicent ones can become challenging

[syndicated]

have fun...... we lost 80 % furnaces 4 years ago..... venting the high effiicent ones can become challenging

My boss was smart, when the import ban went into effect my boss bought 75 mids for the hard cases like townhouses and condos.
Most cases if sidewall venting isn't possible we sell a PV hot water tank and run the pipes up the b-vent.

[carmon]

you can not install a mid anymore... your boss has 75 boat anchors

[motoguy128]

At 80% tankless water heaters still allowed? Can you B-vent with any of those? If yes, you could install combi systems as a work around.

I agree with others, where theres' a will, there a way for PVC venting. Basement hopper windows repalced with a sheet of plywood can work. My tankless and furnace are vented that way.

[kangaroogod]

Last I heard they were going to use exemptions for situations such as condos and they are pondering that the exemptions would need to be made my Nate certified contractors. That was the last rumor I heard but who know what the truth is.

[syndicated]

you can not install a mid anymore... your boss has 75 boat anchors

That is incorrect. The law states that mid efficient furnaces cannot be imported anymore. We've installed nearly all 75 of them post-2010. All had permits pulled and all passed.