Questions on HVAC install in a Church

[fkphvac]

Very new to HVAC talk . Can you install a 4 ton indoor air handler within the room of the main church but not above a ceiling and can you have an open return with no ductwork on the return side ? As well do you have to install smoke detector? The building is an older office building and is going to be church. It has no fire system installed. The ceiling is 14 high and the floor this unit is serving is about 1200 square feet and has to also cool a mens and ladies room with three stalls each.

[small change]

Maybe if David Copperfield installs it..... Thanks I'll be here all week....Try the veal

There are very specific requirements needed to calculate the load for a church or any space that has
people adding to the actual load of the building.

[BaldLoonie]

Probably could do that but any return right of an air handler will be LOUD. I'd have some ductwork and what you have should be lined to absorb sound. Have to check code on the smoke detector, usually used if over 5 tons/2000 CFM but there could be requirements in your area that call for one just being commercial.

[tedkidd]

Loony, how about a mod with ECM and media filter? Think that might not be too noisy, particularly on lower stages?

[BaldLoonie]

That would help though on cooling it will run 100%. Still think some kind of return box or ducting with liner will be desirable.

[beenthere]

1600 CFM through a coil opening is gonna be about the same amount of noise weather its a PSC, X13, or VS ECM blower. A return plenum and some duct will help a lot.

4 tons, for a 1200 SQ FT church? might be cutting it close, probably under sized for the people load alone. Might need close to 5 tons for teh people load alone. How many members can it seat. you will have to provide fresh air, that adds a lot to the cooling load.

[teddy bear]

Location and number of occupants? Fresh make-up air?
Regards TB

[Sleuth]

4 tons, for a 1200 SQ FT church? might be cutting it close, probably under sized for the people load alone. Might need close to 5 tons for teh people load alone. How many members can it seat. you will have to provide fresh air, that adds a lot to the cooling load.

.

Yep, I'm thinking an "air and a spare".

Primary to maintain comfort without the people load and a second for catch up.

What area is the Church located?
..

[tedkidd]

1600 CFM through a coil opening is gonna be about the same amount of noise weather its a PSC, X13, or VS ECM blower. A return plenum and some duct will help a lot.

4 tons, for a 1200 SQ FT church? might be cutting it close, probably under sized for the people load alone. Might need close to 5 tons for teh people load alone. How many members can it seat. you will have to provide fresh air, that adds a lot to the cooling load.

And co2 monitor so people dont fall asleep...

[dan sw fl]

Hopefully, a unit will never be installed without the thorough layout and planning required by Permitting and State Building Code.

Outside Air required for just 40 people alone may overwhelm a 4-ton unit.

No Outside Air ... Pastor won't be to pleased with people sleeping all the time.
____________ ... Great way to NOT get a message received.

COMFORT has MANY, MANY Aspects.

[teddy bear]

Sounds like 400 cfm of make-up air shen occupied, plus 40,000 btus of load for the occupants plus the building load.
Include 100 pint per day whole building dehumidifier to keep the building dry during the unoccupied time. As the a/c will oversized because of the occupants load.
Regards TB

[tedkidd]

4 tons, for a 1200 SQ FT church? might be cutting it close, probably under sized for the people load alone. Might need close to 5 tons for teh people load alone. How many members can it seat. you will have to provide fresh air, that adds a lot to the cooling load.

.

Yep, I'm thinking an "air and a spare".

Primary to maintain comfort without the people load and a second for catch up.

..

Sounds like 400 cfm of make-up air shen occupied, plus 40,000 btus of load for the occupants plus the building load.

Include 100 pint per day whole building dehumidifier to keep the building dry during the unoccupied time. As the a/c will oversized because of the occupants load.
Regards TB

Minisplit and a 4 or 5 ton 2 stage unit?

Big inverter Mini and 3 ton ahu (needs only one filter and smaller duct, quieter).

[gearhead3]

This is the Ask Our Pro's forum, and only Pro members that have been vetted by the AOPC may post advise here. Please apply to the AOPC today, thank you.

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[gearhead3]

This is the Ask Our Pro's forum, and only Pro members that have been vetted by the AOPC may post advise here. Please apply to the AOPC today, thank you.

You can find the rules for posting and qualifications here.

Further infractions may result in loss of posting privileges.

[tedkidd]

On the other hand., a church that's not had cooling before, I suspect they don't have high expectations and might prefer $ savings over perfection, at least in the first pass.

[beenthere]

On the other hand., a church that's not had cooling before, I suspect they don't have high expectations and might prefer $ savings over perfection, at least in the first pass.

Under sized will make it a hot sticky church.

Money spent with no return in comfort is never a savings. But can make for many unwanted conversations between the church members.

[tedkidd]

I was just thinking about 2 funerals I was at recently. One church was really miserable, no ac at all. The other had insufficient equipment to carry the load from a full house, but the cool air offered some relief.

Anything can be solved with unlimited $. But sometimes there is a balance point that incremental investment does not return justifiable incremental benefit.

And isn't going to church supposed to be penance for sins? Most would conjecture there's no AC in hell.

[toocoolforschool]

I had a guy in a resturaunt ask me to do the same thing I turned down the job.

[beenthere]

I was just thinking about 2 funerals I was at recently. One church was really miserable, no ac at all. The other had insufficient equipment to carry the load from a full house, but the cool air offered some relief.

Anything can be solved with unlimited $. But sometimes there is a balance point that incremental investment does not return justifiable incremental benefit.

And isn't going to church supposed to be penance for sins? Most would conjecture there's no AC in hell.

Going to church service is not for penitence. As least not everytime, or for everyone that goes. Maybe in your church it is though. ROFL

Doesn't take unlimited $$$$. And they do get a break, No sales tax.

[mechanical'al]

any job worth doing is worth doing write if not make sure they pray for comfort and you