ReplyWhat are you guys doing with the solenoid on the liquid line?
Regular Guest
I have a client who replaced his air handler due to the age and the cost to replace his evap coil due to it leaking. He bought a 2 ton Trane horizontal air handler from me and the company I work for, and let me tell you we are not the cheapest around by a long shot I sell on our quality installs and our awesome service. I get my last call of the day today and it is for this client. His complaint is the unit is not cooling properly. It was just installed less than a week ago. I figured maybe the drain line or something silly like that. I arrive out there and climb into the attic and see this
I just sighed and said "oh boy here we go again" we installed a 3 ton R-410A knock off Trane air handler on a 2 ton XLI Trane R-22 condenser. I was so embarrassed to go and tell my client that we dropped the ball on him and we will return tomorrow morning with the correct unit. This is the kind of client everyone wishes for, no shopping around no beating you up on price, just says go ahead and do what ever you have to do and pays his bills up front in advance.
I just wanted to share my frustration with you guys and vent a little.
The topic says here's another. Wondering why I work here is because this happens a lot not so much the wrong unit but lazy techs, lazy installers, tons of call backs. The money is extremely good is probably why I have been sticking it out here for over 8 years. But it is getting really old!!
Professional Member
What are you guys doing with the solenoid on the liquid line?
Regular Guest
The original air handler had it on there probably because the condenser is 200 feet away from the house.
Professional Member
Lower the blower speed
Professional Member*
I know what your thinking but?
what will that due when you have a 410a a/h with a r-22 condenser?Originally Posted by Texanna Slim
As iron sharpens iron so one man sharpens another Proverbs 27:17 NIV84
Professional Member
Change the metering device
Regular Guest
We changed the air handler to the correct air handler (what the client paid for)
Lower the blower speed?? Change the metering device??
Why do that? It's new,,
Professional Member
Because the coil is compatible with both refrigerants, match the metering device and voila. Lowering the blower speed doesn't compute with me either though.
Professional Member*
X2
Don't you guys know that 410A is heavier then R22 so you gotta slow the Blower LMFAO.
I agree give the man what he payed for don't band aid the screw up if you wanna stand behind your reputation.
Regular Guest
I get that but really the whole problem to me is the bait and switch that had happened. I agree change the metering device and maybe lower the fan speed but I would only do that if another company installed it and the client had no other way of making it right. And that would be after I slammed the other company really wellbut really though if any other tech would of came behind another company and seen this, I think they would of raised a red flag.
And on another note my install manager and others in the company are saying that a 410 air handler will work fine with R-22. I don't agree but that's what they are saying:/ lol oh well!!
What do you think??
Global Moderator
The big question is: did the TXV get changed? If yes, he's fine. If no, he's in trouble.
But I agree, not a job I'd be proud of if my employer did this even with right TXV.
Professional Member
everytime we do a new coil with r-22 cond. it always comes with 410a metering device txv or orifice, we always take it out and install an r-22 txv for the correct tonnage had no problems with that... except the 410a coils seem to be leaking quicker and quicker installed a brand new 410a system in place of 22 and the coil leaked after 2 yrs!!!! had this happen many a times with carrier
Regular Guest
Nope they did not change the TXV they just installed a new GAM 2ton Trane air handler, they stand by the fact that it will work just fine!
Professional Member
It will, IF they put in the proper metering device. Do they really think it would work out of the box lol.
Professional Member*
why would the air handler change between 410A and 22?? the coil temps are the same.
airflow is the same. the diff. would be efficiency i.e. coil size, and the metering device. 22 and 410 are no diff. other than pressures to reach the same temps.
Professional Member
^ this, and if you're hooking up to an older unit efficiency most likely isn't a huge concern on the job so just match the metering device. I understand what your saying about what the customer paid for but in the end it's the same result. You could have saved a lot of labor just by matching the txv or piston. Hell whenever we do a coil replacement we have to change the txv because our coils come out of the box ready for 410a.
Regular Guest
Ok but a 3 ton air handler and a 2 ton condenser, even if you replaced the metering device, there still is a couple of other problems: we are in south Florida and the units are only straight cool so at 3 tons it is typical and we did install a 10kw heater and requires a 60 amp circuit with #6 wire. We pulled out a 2 ton and usually has and had a 5kw heater that requires a 30 amp circuit with #8 wire. So now we have a 10kw heater on a 30amp circuit with #8 wire so you can guess what would happen when the client operates the unit in heat mode. I know we could of just changed the heater to a 5kw heater but even if you lower the fan speed you will still have a problem of not enough temp rise adequate to heat the area "properly" even though we don't use heat all that much but when you want it you should have it. And on cooling a 2 ton duct system with a 3 ton air handler even with the fan speed lowered you still will have a higher static pressure and the unit will sweat in the attic even if it doesn't sweat and the static pressure wasn't that far off and the heater was the correct size, you still have the problem of he was under the impression that he was getting a 2 ton Trane air handler and we did not install that. I wish I could tell you openly here what his cost was to have it installed was. But the biggest in my mind screw up is that we would and still didn't do the right thing for the client. I wish he would of chosen the coil replacement vs the new unit.
You see it is and always should be about doing the right thing and do what you tell some one you are going to do and that is where we as a company failed him.
Ok I know the air handler is technically a Trane because it is made by the Trane company but it is really called tex fan or something like that, real bottom line and the name to me is more than a name it isn't what he paid for.
Oh one more thing think of the price he paid was like the song "my next THIRTY years" I know you have herd that song like a HUNDRED times!!! Lol you get it?
Professional Member
AFAICT as long as you have a metering device that is correct for the compressor tonnage and 350-400cfm per ton you can run a larger evap coil, with a caveat, a too far over-sized coil won't have enough vapor velocity to properly return the oil so it will load up with oil and drain the compressor sump. It also increases the required refrigerant charge weight.
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