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  1. #1
    Join Date
    Sep 2012
    Posts
    7

    HELP! goodman 3 ton dumping water in attic!

    Hello, this is my first post on this forum, and it may seem like diy, but here I go... Me and my brother replaces a dead amana 2.5 ton air handler with a goodman 3 ton ARPT air handler. Someone else did the line brazing and charging. 2 weeks after install, the ceiling below started dripping water. We pull down the damaged sheetrock to find nearly a gallon of water on top of the sheetrock under the intake plenum. Our first theory was that an air leak at the bottom of the plenum was allowing attic air to hit the inside of the plenum and cause condensate, which runs back out. The leak is outside the drip pan underneath the unit, where it hits the insulation and runs down to ruin the sheetrock. At first, we pulled one of the return pipes off and filled the gaps with spray foam, and double taped all joints. No good. With the side panels off, we noticed the water was having issues going down the drain, so we gave the intake side of the unit a 1" rise, to keep the water from running into the plenum. This caused the water to leak out of the exaust plenum on the other side of the unit. We had another theory when we took the side panels off again. We saw that the unit was sloped from side to side, causing the water in the drainpan inside the unit to collect on the side without a drain pipe (this tilting was not our fault, we tipped it in a different direction). We also saw signs of water being picked up by airflow and being thrown toward the blower fan, wetting the inside of the case, but fortunately not the motor or the control board. We then turned the blower speed down to attempt to fix this issue. and that was just this morning, don't know yet if that will fix that issue. Please give me and my brother some advice. I just thought of some more details. one, my brother noticed that the intake filter(not in the unit, it is in a wall register) had collapsed from pressure against it. This made us turn the fan down. Two, with the unit off and the sidecovers off, we poured several gallons of water inside the unit to see if the internal pan was leaking. That checked out good. We have not seen water in the emergency pan beneath the unit, which is odd. And third, the condition gets worse if you set the unit to fan auto, and cool. It gets better if you set the fan from auto to on, leaving the other settings alone. And please, to the moderators, don't delete my post, this is an urgent issue that must be fixed very quickly, due to the fact that we are trying to refinance the house. thanks in advance.

  2. #2
    Join Date
    Dec 2005
    Location
    Cincinnati, Oh
    Posts
    5,092
    Quote Originally Posted by NTkiller View Post
    Hello, this is my first post on this forum, and it may seem like diy, but here I go... Me and my brother replaces a dead amana 2.5 ton air handler with a goodman 3 ton ARPT air handler. Someone else did the line brazing and charging. 2 weeks after install, the ceiling below started dripping water. We pull down the damaged sheetrock to find nearly a gallon of water on top of the sheetrock under the intake plenum. Our first theory was that an air leak at the bottom of the plenum was allowing attic air to hit the inside of the plenum and cause condensate, which runs back out. The leak is outside the drip pan underneath the unit, where it hits the insulation and runs down to ruin the sheetrock. At first, we pulled one of the return pipes off and filled the gaps with spray foam, and double taped all joints. No good. With the side panels off, we noticed the water was having issues going down the drain, so we gave the intake side of the unit a 1" rise, to keep the water from running into the plenum. This caused the water to leak out of the exaust plenum on the other side of the unit. We had another theory when we took the side panels off again. We saw that the unit was sloped from side to side, causing the water in the drainpan inside the unit to collect on the side without a drain pipe (this tilting was not our fault, we tipped it in a different direction). We also saw signs of water being picked up by airflow and being thrown toward the blower fan, wetting the inside of the case, but fortunately not the motor or the control board. We then turned the blower speed down to attempt to fix this issue. and that was just this morning, don't know yet if that will fix that issue. Please give me and my brother some advice. I just thought of some more details. one, my brother noticed that the intake filter(not in the unit, it is in a wall register) had collapsed from pressure against it. This made us turn the fan down. Two, with the unit off and the sidecovers off, we poured several gallons of water inside the unit to see if the internal pan was leaking. That checked out good. We have not seen water in the emergency pan beneath the unit, which is odd. And third, the condition gets worse if you set the unit to fan auto, and cool. It gets better if you set the fan from auto to on, leaving the other settings alone. And please, to the moderators, don't delete my post, this is an urgent issue that must be fixed very quickly, due to the fact that we are trying to refinance the house. thanks in advance.
    Here's what you need to do:

    Hire a professional for the entire job, not just for "the brazing and charging".


    At this point, hire a professional to fix the problem, and be prepared to pay dearly.
    "Better tell the sandman to stay away, because we're gonna be workin on this one all night."

    "Dude, you need more than 2 wires to a condenser to run a 2 stage heatpump."

    "Just get it done son."

    Dad adjusted

  3. #3
    Join Date
    Aug 2010
    Location
    Northern Cali
    Posts
    72
    This is the Ask Our Pro's forum. In order to post a response here, you must have verified qualifications and have been approved by the AOP Committee. You may ask a question by starting a new thread.

    You can find the rules for posting and qualifications here.

    Additional infractions may result in loss of posting privileges.
    Last edited by jpsmith1cm; 09-04-2012 at 07:59 PM. Reason: non AOP member

  4. #4
    Join Date
    Dec 2008
    Location
    Buffalo NY
    Posts
    3,127
    Please call in a pro. You do not know what you are doing. When I need my taxes done I call a tax guy because I do not know how to do it.


    Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk HD
    Join http://scopeny.org/ Shooter’s Committee on Political Education

    The world is full of sheep,try not to join the flock.

    Support the Skilled Trades, Don't DIY

  5. #5
    Join Date
    Sep 2012
    Posts
    7
    Quote Originally Posted by hvacvegas View Post
    Here's what you need to do:

    Hire a professional for the entire job, not just for "the brazing and charging".


    At this point, hire a professional to fix the problem, and be prepared to pay dearly.
    Well, when we built the house, we had hammonds put the first units in. This was a complete failure, because first of all, the lineset. They had it running over the roof of our 2 story house, which made it extremely hard for the compressor to push liquid up to the evaporator. Then, they didn't put in the drier THAT CAME WITH THE CONDENSER! So, the poor 2.5 ton unit was having an extremely hard time. Then, it started leaking freon. At the end, which was 2 years after install, it was leaking 4 out of 5 pounds of freon in 3 months! This was too expensive to continue, so we went out and purchaced window units. A friend of ours gave us a 1 ton window unit which would cool most of the downstairs of the house, while the upstairs had window units. The downstairs has a 5 ton unit which had been struck by lightning a year after the other one quit, blowing up the elecronic blower motor. So all we had left was the widow units, which we continued to use for about 10 years (both units had died by the year 1998,while the house was finished in late '96). A year ago, my mom was getting annoyed by the electric bills the 7 window ac units were giving her, so we went under the house to see if we could resurect the 5 ton unit. We took the blower out, threw away the motor and it's controller board, and put in a dayton condenser fan motor with the same specs, since the ecm motor, which wasn't made anymore, was $$$$
    . Our solution was $$$$
    . While the 5 ton was sitting up, it had leaked out all the freon. We waited about 6 months for our financial issues to stabilize, and we had it gassed up. The machine then came on with no issue, and has been running since, except with a little situation with a "pro" repairman. He had come out to work on resurecting the 2.5 ton. This had failed. Before he left, the 5 ton unit's start capacitor failed. He then proceded to "fix" it. He had a spare capacitor, and what he did was he cut the old one out, cut the wiring for it out, and wired the capacitor in parallel with the run capacitor. While he was doing this he kept saying "I will keep this unit running as long as I can". After he left, the machine stopped again. We took the side off and shook our heads at his wiring job. My brother had wired up 120, 240, and 480 motors, and he wanted to call the guy and cuss him up one side and down the other. After we fixed that, we looked up how he had it wired to make sure it was a mistake, and in the service manual to the condenser it said the way he had it wired had basically rigged it to blow itself apart. This made us forget the entire "pro" thing, since our pros were dumb a$$es who didn't know what THEY were doing. With the big unit running again, we had another friend of ours who had a universal license take the remaining freon out of the little unit, and we pulled it out. We then put in the new one, moving the condenser unit to a better location, shortening the line set from an estimated 200 feet to 23 foot (we know about the thing where a bend counts a 8 feet). We then put on our plenums, mastic and all, and the unit cools great. Just our water problem is stumping us. Just for the record, we are what you call "technically inclined", so we unterstand how it works, and everything else on the unit works, so we haven't messed anything up... yet. We did use the drain pipe hammonds put in, and knowing them they screwed that up too. You see, our original system's problems were cause by a botched install, and we hooked up everything up to code, to the letter of everything we learned from googling for the details. So, we can handle anything you got to say, except "go for pro", because every "pro" has screwed us over. But at least someone is listening. Thanks for the reply anyway.
    Last edited by jpsmith1cm; 09-04-2012 at 08:02 PM. Reason: pricing

  6. #6
    Join Date
    Dec 2005
    Location
    Cincinnati, Oh
    Posts
    5,092
    So, you had a bad install.
    So instead of finding a better company to install a new system, you decided to have a person with less experience install a new system?

    "At the end, which was 2 years after install, it was leaking 4 out of 5 pounds of freon in 3 months! This was too expensive to continue, so we went out and purchaced window units."

    Ahhhh.....thats a warranty repair.......you didn't have the problem fixed, while it was under warranty.......?

    I'm offically claiming shananigans.

    The drain worked before you touched it.
    "Better tell the sandman to stay away, because we're gonna be workin on this one all night."

    "Dude, you need more than 2 wires to a condenser to run a 2 stage heatpump."

    "Just get it done son."

    Dad adjusted

  7. #7
    Join Date
    Aug 2010
    Location
    Northern Cali
    Posts
    72
    This is the Ask Our Pro's forum. In order to post a response here, you must have verified qualifications and have been approved by the AOP Committee. You may ask a question by starting a new thread.

    You can find the rules for posting and qualifications here.

    Additional infractions may result in loss of posting privileges.
    Last edited by jpsmith1cm; 09-04-2012 at 08:00 PM. Reason: non AOP member

  8. #8
    Join Date
    Sep 2012
    Posts
    7
    Quote Originally Posted by hvacvegas View Post
    So, you had a bad install.
    So instead of finding a better company to install a new system, you decided to have a person with less experience install a new system?

    "At the end, which was 2 years after install, it was leaking 4 out of 5 pounds of freon in 3 months! This was too expensive to continue, so we went out and purchaced window units."

    Ahhhh.....thats a warranty repair.......you didn't have the problem fixed, while it was under warranty.......?

    I'm offically claiming shananigans.

    The drain worked before you touched it.
    NO! Well, it depends on your version of "touched it". If you're talking about the original install, then, no, it did not leak. Otherwise, yes. As for the forum's aditude, You treat me like I am stupid... We know just as much as ya'll do about these things. But we are having a unique problem with this unit. As for smarts, I got bored one day and took a dead window unit and converted it fron R22 to propane, and it still works today. And another story. I got bored one day and rebuilt a briggs and stratton motor using common sense and a service manual for torque specs. So please treat me as one of you. As for pics, I need to get hold of my phone and take some. Thanks for all of the replies, but I need some real help, not people telling me to go find some douche bag who will ask for a $1000 and not do squat.

    P.S. THIS IS NOT SHANANAGANS! WE DID A MUCH BETTER JOB THAN HAMMONDS DID ON THE ORIGINAL INSTALL! THEIR INSTALL DIDN'T WORK RIGHT FROM DAY ONE, EITHER! NOT TO BE MEAN OR ANYTHING, BUT WE DO NEED THIS FIXED!
    As for us putting it in ourselves, we did not want to experiment with anybody else, since we aren't planning to leave the house anythime soon. And besides, for us anyway, it has always worked better for us when we did the work ourself. As for warranty repair, the fine print got us. So and So's "warranty" at the time didn't cover freon as parts, so they got us there. Ah well.
    Last edited by beenthere; 09-04-2012 at 09:08 PM. Reason: removed name of company

  9. #9
    Join Date
    Aug 2003
    Location
    Fort Worth, TX
    Posts
    11,358
    The entire HVAC trade tainted by a bad installation. SMH

    I will give you one hint: does the blower suck or blow through the cooling coil? If it sucks, trap it. If it blows, unclog it.
    • Electricity makes refrigeration happen.
    • Refrigeration makes the HVAC psychrometric process happen.
    • HVAC pyschrometrics is what makes indoor human comfort happen...IF the ducts AND the building envelope cooperate.


    A building is NOT beautiful unless it is also comfortable.

  10. #10
    Join Date
    Aug 2010
    Location
    Northern Cali
    Posts
    72
    This is the Ask Our Pro's forum. In order to post a response here, you must have verified qualifications and have been approved by the AOP Committee. You may ask a question by starting a new thread.

    You can find the rules for posting and qualifications here.

    Additional infractions may result in loss of posting privileges.

  11. #11
    Join Date
    Sep 2008
    Location
    Western PA
    Posts
    25,760
    MAC AIR

    This is the Ask Our Pro's forum. In order to post a response here, you must have verified qualifications and have been approved by the AOP Committee. You may ask a question by starting a new thread.

    You can find the rules for posting and qualifications here.

    Additional infractions may result in loss of posting privileges.

  12. #12
    Join Date
    Sep 2012
    Posts
    7
    OK, the air goes over the coils to get to the blower, and then out to the ducting.The drain pipe does get a vacuum when the unit runs, so we put a swaneck pipe on it.Tto MAC AIR, the window unit is actually in my bedroom running as I type. And HAHA, Idon't believe in drugs, nor do I condone them. All they do is kill people and make life hard for the rest of us. Back to the problem at hand, we poured a gallon or two of water into the pan, and it does drain. Now, what do ya'll want pictures of? the drain line itself? or something else? And thank you for some actual help, no offence intended.

  13. #13
    Join Date
    Jan 2004
    Location
    Lancaster PA
    Posts
    68,317
    Quote Originally Posted by NTkiller View Post
    Hello, this is my first post on this forum, and it may seem like diy, but here I go...

    No, it doesn't seem like DIY, it IS DIY.

    Perhaps you missed the part in the rules about no DIY.
    Contractor locator map

    How-to-apply-for-Professional

    How many times must one fix something before it is fixed?

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