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  1. #27
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    Quote Originally Posted by scrogdog View Post
    Yes! That's PRECISELY The point!

    Facts are not about what someone thinks is plausible or probable. Sorry.

    Lack of hard evidence does certainly affect probability from a scientific standpoint.

    ... and SETI continues to be a study WITHOUT A SUBJECT.

    Ufologists do not say the existence of UFO’s is a proven fact. They say there is a preponderance of evidence. All you have to do is research it, which no vocal, debunking scientists will do.

    But there are facts surrounding the issue: People do not understand the implication surrounding the topic, it does not interest them, they believe what politicians, clergy, and the six O’clock new says about them and they have the ability to “snicker” at hundreds of very high level, credible witnesses.

  2. #28
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    I think it is CEH that has a sig line something like this:

    Dancing seems silly to a deaf person who cannot hear the music, as
    Faith seems dumb to one who does not KNOW God.
    (I am sure I mis-quoted it, the idea is there).

    Religion, IMO, is man's attempt to understand God... which is in itself not possible. How would a pre-schooler understand what goes on inside Einstein's head? However for a learned adult to admit there was/is a supreme being out there who is beyond their understanding... just goes against human pride... so mankind looks for their solution... thus all these (false) religions.

    If one truly studies the Bible, with a open mind (open to hearing God speak to you as to what He wrote), one can learn what the truth really is... it is not rocket science, it is simple.

    The problem, IMO, comes in when organizations try to turn attending worship services into a business... these are represented by denominations of our current day religions (Baptist, Lutheran, Catholic, etc)... note I am not calling out any faith as right or wrong... however I have in my lifetime found numerous areas in every religion I studied which do NOT line up with what Scripture teaches.

    So we come to a question: What was God's plan for the human race He created? The answer is to have a relationship with them; each one of them as well as collectively. Only problem is... God is a Spirit being... how does a human have a relationship with a Spirit? Well, as noted in the OP, we are created in God's image... so I guess that means we are indeed Spirit beings (even though we temporarily live in a boi-degradable 'earthsuit'... ST Paul called it a temporary tent in 1 Corinthians).

    So lessee... If I am indeed created in God's image, and God is a Spirit, then that means I must have a Spirit also... even though I learned to relate through physical and scientifically provable methods (talking, etc). Could it be there is a Spiritual way to relate to another Spirit? If so, how would I get in touch with this Spiritual 'cell phone' (grin)? And if I did, would communication with the king of the universe be on my terms, or on His terms? What would I say to Him? Would I be in such awe of His power and glory I would end up tongue-tied? Or would I be arrogant and p*ss off the God of the universe... thinking I was equal to Him (I am sure this has happened before)?
    (Hint: check out the last Scripture in my sig line)

    Questions... anyone care to attempt an answer or two?
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  3. #29
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    Quote Originally Posted by scrogdog View Post
    Yes! That's PRECISELY The point!

    Facts are not about what someone thinks is plausible or probable. Sorry.

    Lack of hard evidence does certainly affect probablity from a scientific standpoint.

    ... and SETI continues to be a study WITHOUT A SUBJECT.
    And where does fact in religion come into play? LOL! There is far more evidence of the existence of Extra Terrestrial entities influencing our ancestors then there is of any religious creation fairy tale. People need religion or else their little minds would pop. This is why they refuse to consider anything to the contrary, no matter how compelling. This is why religious folk say that thousands of people saw "flares" in the sky and not a display of an advanced unknown technology. To anyone with half a brain and an unchained mind that notion is insane. You see, the problem is that it does not fit within the religious confines, it can't be wrapped up into a neat little box. If there are beings more advanced than we are your god could not have created them as god supposedly created man in his image, therefor they cannot exist, no matter what.
    America; first we fight for our freedom,
    then we make laws to take it away.

    -Alfred E Newman

  4. #30
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    Quote Originally Posted by LibertyTree View Post
    And where does fact in religion come into play? LOL! There is far more evidence of the existence of Extra Terrestrial entities influencing our ancestors then there is of any religious creation fairy tale. People need religion or else their little minds would pop. This is why they refuse to consider anything to the contrary, no matter how compelling. This is why religious folk say that thousands of people saw "flares" in the sky and not a display of an advanced unknown technology. To anyone with half a brain and an unchained mind that notion is insane. You see, the problem is that it does not fit within the religious confines, it can't be wrapped up into a neat little box. If there are beings more advanced than we are your god could not have created them as god supposedly created man in his image, therefor they cannot exist, no matter what.
    That sounds a lot like an elitist comment... 'I am so smart... I understand how the stupid folks think...' Arrogance is the word that comes to mind...

    Seems the extremists on both sides of the political isle are arrogant... wonder why?
    GA-HVAC-Tech

    Quality work at a fair price with excellent customer service!

    Romans Ch's 5-6-7-8

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  5. #31
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    Here is a thought I have entertained, how big does science say the universe is? To answer my own question, very big. As a Christian I believe that God created the HEAVENS & the EARTH. With that said I have a hard time believing there isn't other life in the universe whether plant, animal or Humanoid(human looking). Am I right? I don't know. But I believe it's possible that God made other planets with life on them. Unless I meet one of these aliens face to face, the answer may be something I'll never get until the full Glory of God is revealed.

  6. #32
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    I'm not very smart, but smart enough to know that, nothing to do with arrogance. Its not arrogant to say the sky is blue... Its easy to see without the fear-based religious cloud over your head. You also speak of political arrogance. There is a clear right and wrong in the political realm. We know this from looking at history. Limited government, liberty, free market capitalism is the best form of government, there should be no argument. One man should not have to pay another mans way in life, government power grabs should be answered swiftly and mercilessly. If charitable organizations wish to feed the eaters it is their prerogative. This is what neo-liberals fail to understand. Call it arrogance if you want to.
    America; first we fight for our freedom,
    then we make laws to take it away.

    -Alfred E Newman

  7. #33
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rob_in_WV View Post
    Here is a thought I have entertained, how big does science say the universe is? To answer my own question, very big. As a Christian I believe that God created the HEAVENS & the EARTH. With that said I have a hard time believing there isn't other life in the universe whether plant, animal or Humanoid(human looking). Am I right? I don't know. But I believe it's possible that God made other planets with life on them. Unless I meet one of these aliens face to face, the answer may be something I'll never get until the full Glory of God is revealed.
    Einstein said the universe was a sphere with a radius of 100 billion light years. He said if you could travel fast enough and long enough, you would eventually wind up right back where you started.

  8. #34
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    Quote Originally Posted by exreo View Post
    Einstein said the universe was a sphere with a radius of 100 billion light years. He said if you could travel fast enough and long enough, you would eventually wind up right back where you started.
    I had never heard that, I was taught that the universe is believed to be still expanding. Thanks for the answer, always room for another little factoid in the ole brain.

  9. #35
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    Quote Originally Posted by ga-hvac-tech View Post
    That sounds a lot like an elitist comment... 'I am so smart... I understand how the stupid folks think...' Arrogance is the word that comes to mind...

    Seems the extremists on both sides of the political isle are arrogant... wonder why?
    Here's another thought on this: Why is it that primitive tribes, both present and antiquated, always form up a deity? Why do they feel the need to answer the question of "Who are we and where are we going in this ocean of chaos?". My comments are not a dig on you personally, they are a dig on humans in general. Its human nature to first ask this question then attempt to answer it in whatever way they can. Some have more sophisticated theories than others but the fact still stands that we do not know who we are and where we are going in this ocean of chaos.

    "Throughout human history, as our species has faced the frightening, terrorizing fact that we do not know who we are, or where we are going in this ocean of chaos, it has been the authorities — the political, the religious, the educational authorities — who attempted to comfort us by giving us order, rules, regulations, informing — forming in our minds — their view of reality. To think for yourself you must question authority and learn how to put yourself in a state of vulnerable open-mindedness, chaotic, confused vulnerability to inform yourself."

    -Timothy Leary
    America; first we fight for our freedom,
    then we make laws to take it away.

    -Alfred E Newman

  10. #36
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    Are you kidding me? Quoting the world's biggest acid head on this?

    You post shows people have recognized that there must be some supreme creator and force over the world. They just didn't know the truth until it was revealed to them by missionaries.

  11. #37
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    Quote Originally Posted by LibertyTree View Post
    Here's another thought on this: Why is it that primitive tribes, both present and antiquated, always form up a deity? Why do they feel the need to answer the question of "Who are we and where are we going in this ocean of chaos?". My comments are not a dig on you personally, they are a dig on humans in general. Its human nature to first ask this question then attempt to answer it in whatever way they can. Some have more sophisticated theories than others but the fact still stands that we do not know who we are and where we are going in this ocean of chaos.

    "Throughout human history, as our species has faced the frightening, terrorizing fact that we do not know who we are, or where we are going in this ocean of chaos, it has been the authorities — the political, the religious, the educational authorities — who attempted to comfort us by giving us order, rules, regulations, informing — forming in our minds — their view of reality. To think for yourself you must question authority and learn how to put yourself in a state of vulnerable open-mindedness, chaotic, confused vulnerability to inform yourself."

    -Timothy Leary
    Quote Originally Posted by hearthman View Post
    Are you kidding me? Quoting the world's biggest acid head on this?

    You post shows people have recognized that there must be some supreme creator and force over the world. They just didn't know the truth until it was revealed to them by missionaries.
    I think Hearth understands...

    Mankind looks for a leader, yet rebels when the leader does not lead where they want to go...
    Mankind looks for a special being (makes up religions), yet rebels and re-writes the religious books when the dogmas do not agree with lusts of the world...
    Mankind sets up elaborate political systems to govern themselves... so they can corrupt them with greed...

    All because mankind is hopelessly evil without a savior... yet mankind rejects the very Savior mankind's Creator provided for them, the one they desperately NEED.

    The more I learn about this thing called human nature, the more I realize how corrupt it is without the leadership of the One who created humans... that being the God of the Bible. "...even the rocks will cry out of His diety..." If even mother nature understands God... I wonder why mankind is so rebellious? The answer is the arrogance of mankind's mind...

    As the gospel of Pogo noted years back: "We have met the enemy, and the enemy is us(me)." A smart person will self-examine... a not-so-smart person will think they have the answers.
    GA-HVAC-Tech

    Quality work at a fair price with excellent customer service!

    Romans Ch's 5-6-7-8

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  12. #38
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    Quote Originally Posted by LibertyTree View Post
    And where does fact in religion come into play? LOL! There is far more evidence of the existence of Extra Terrestrial entities influencing our ancestors then there is of any religious creation fairy tale. People need religion or else their little minds would pop. This is why they refuse to consider anything to the contrary, no matter how compelling. This is why religious folk say that thousands of people saw "flares" in the sky and not a display of an advanced unknown technology. To anyone with half a brain and an unchained mind that notion is insane. You see, the problem is that it does not fit within the religious confines, it can't be wrapped up into a neat little box. If there are beings more advanced than we are your god could not have created them as god supposedly created man in his image, therefor they cannot exist, no matter what.
    Not sure what prompted this bit of silly, but I'm an agnostic.

    So, did you have some relevant point to make about my post?

    Oh, and BTW, there is not a SINGLE shred of hard evidence that aliens exist, aboard UFOs or otherwise.
    "Social networking" is an oxymoron.

  13. #39
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rob_in_WV View Post
    I had never heard that, I was taught that the universe is believed to be still expanding. Thanks for the answer, always room for another little factoid in the ole brain.
    There are several models of the universe which are still debated among scientists. What Einstien proposed is called the Friedmann–Lemaître–Robertson–Walker (FLRW) model.

    The true shape and nature of the universe has not been established at a global level. The universe is still expanding. The current thought is that the expansion is going faster than it should with regards to our present knowledge of physics. That's what led to the theories of dark matter and dark energy. Now, we don't know of those things exist, but if they don't, it still makes sense that some unknown force is behind it. You can consider dark matter and dark energy as "place holder" ideas, pending further study.

    In any case, the fact that it is exanding at this rate means that at some point, the space between various elements of matter will be too great and the matter will no longer be able to hold its cohesion, thus flying apart at the molecular level and resulting in the destruction of ordered matter and the universe as we know it.
    "Social networking" is an oxymoron.

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