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  1. #14
    Join Date
    Jan 2004
    Location
    Lancaster PA
    Posts
    66,774
    outdoor unit is an A/C only unit, R22 dry ship. Indoor may have strip heaters if your in an area that needs heat once in a while.

    They may not have the proper metering device in the indoor unit.
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  2. #15
    Join Date
    May 2000
    Location
    Indianapolis, IN, USA
    Posts
    33,396
    Got a nice little mismatch here but being straight cool, probably not bad enough to affect performance that much. Efficiency could be compromised a bit. Were you in there with the old system? Was it a Payne A/C that matched the air handler? Any idea what kind of failure the old outdoor unit had?

  3. #16
    Join Date
    Jun 2001
    Location
    Moore, Oklahoma, United States
    Posts
    3,948
    Quote Originally Posted by beenthere View Post
    outdoor unit is an A/C only unit, R22 dry ship. Indoor may have strip heaters if your in an area that needs heat once in a while.

    They may not have the proper metering device in the indoor unit.
    +1

  4. #17
    Join Date
    Aug 2012
    Posts
    11
    Quote Originally Posted by BaldLoonie View Post
    Got a nice little mismatch here but being straight cool, probably not bad enough to affect performance that much. Efficiency could be compromised a bit. Were you in there with the old system? Was it a Payne A/C that matched the air handler? Any idea what kind of failure the old outdoor unit had?
    I was here before the old system was replaced but, unfortunately, I was not able to note the specs of the system that was replaced.
    All I know is that the fins of the condenser unit was at least 50% damaged when it was pelted by hail last March.
    I have a pix of the old condenser.
    Name:  Condenser-Unit.jpg
Views: 76
Size:  74.7 KB
    Note that the front and the left side have the same damage since that was the direction the hail was coming from.
    Does that look like cosmetic damage.
    At least that's how one of the AC techs described it to the property manager which she actually believed even when I showed it to her.

  5. #18
    Join Date
    Aug 2012
    Posts
    11
    Quote Originally Posted by V3212 View Post
    AC Condenser unit was replaced about 3 week ago.
    Specs:
    Goodman GSC130361GA
    208 - 230 volts AC
    60 Hz
    Fan motor: 1.10 FLA; 1/6 HP
    Compressor: 13.4 RLA; 74 LRA
    Min Ckt amps: 17.9
    Nominal operating charge: 77 oz (R-22)
    Condenser Info Tag:

    Name:  Condenser-Tag.jpg
Views: 61
Size:  43.8 KB

  6. #19
    Join Date
    Aug 2012
    Posts
    11
    Quote Originally Posted by V3212 View Post
    AC Evaporator coils were acid washed a week before the condenser was replaced.
    Specs:
    Payne model PF1MNC036
    Prod Num: PF1MNC036000AAAA
    208 - 230 volts AC
    Motor: 2.4 FLA; 1/3 HP
    Phase 1
    60 Hz
    R-22 design PSIG: 300

    Evaporator Info Tag:

    Name:  Evaporator-Tag.jpg
Views: 45
Size:  54.8 KB

  7. #20
    Join Date
    Dec 2007
    Posts
    4,575
    with tag info posted, looks like an air handler and it shows TXV as metering device.

    evap, if read correctly, appears to be a size match to cond unit- 3 ton.

    you definitely have an issue, but without being there and the info you posted, we can only offer educated WAGs; incorrect refrig, incorrect fan speed, improper operation of TXV, leaking duct work, etc.
    The Food Stamp Program, administered by the U.S. Department of Agriculture, is proud to be distributing the greatest amount of free meals and stamps EVER.
    Meanwhile, the National Park Service, administered by the U.S. Department of the Interior, asks us to "Please Do Not Feed the Animals". Their stated reason for this policy "... the animals become dependent on handouts and will not learn to take care of themselves."
    from an excerpt by Paul Jacob in Sun City, AZ

  8. #21
    Join Date
    Aug 2012
    Posts
    11

    Cost of a complete system check (including duct work)

    Quote Originally Posted by pacnw View Post
    with tag info posted, looks like an air handler and it shows TXV as metering device.

    evap, if read correctly, appears to be a size match to cond unit- 3 ton.

    you definitely have an issue, but without being there and the info you posted, we can only offer educated WAGs; incorrect refrig, incorrect fan speed, improper operation of TXV, leaking duct work, etc.
    I'll have to go with what all of you are recommending i.e. to hire a pro to check the whole system - duct work & all.
    Since it will be coming out of my own pocket & am not expecting any reimbursement, would anyone know how much it would cost to have everything checked out by a REAL CERTIFIED PRO & not just by someone who may have been certified but does not really know what they are doing?
    It's that or my electric bill goes through the roof while my family suffers.

    BTW, the house I'm renting is a bungalow that has a living area of about 1600 sq ft.

  9. #22
    Join Date
    Aug 2003
    Location
    Fort Worth, TX
    Posts
    11,086
    Your landlord might object to you hiring outside help to look at their equipment. Or might not. Either way I would contact the landlord and express your intentions.

    Providing landlord gives green light, next challenge is to find a certified, competent pro who wants to work on rental property. Contractors can be reluctant to do this because prior experience with landlords objecting or tenants not paying leaves a bad aftertaste.
    • Electricity makes refrigeration happen.
    • Refrigeration makes the HVAC psychrometric process happen.
    • HVAC pyschrometrics is what makes indoor human comfort happen...IF the ducts AND the building envelope cooperate.


    A building is NOT beautiful unless it is also comfortable.

  10. #23
    Join Date
    Jun 2005
    Location
    SW Wisconsin
    Posts
    4,467
    In your extreme situation; if U really want help; there is some temperature data you can collect prior to getting permission to call an expert tech.

    I know it seems like a lot; however, this is not difficult when U do it a step at a time & log the data. It must be done within the same time sequence to be meaningful...

    All U need is a good thermometer (digital reading in tenths preferable) & and indoor Humidity Gauge

    1) Tonnage & SEER of Unit &/or outdoor condenser model number: __________________

    2) TXV or, orifice metering device? TXV. Only if U know…

    3) Outdoor condenser’s discharge-air-temperature ______-F
    Subtract Outdoor air temperature: _______
    Outdoor Condenser Air-Temp-Split _______

    4) Need the ‘Indoor’ percent of relative humidity - in the middle of the rooms or, at Return-Air inlet grilles ___
    5) Indoor Return-Air Temperature ______
    Subtract Indoor Supply-Air Temperature ______ -F
    Indoor temperature-split _______-F
    ----------------------------------------------
    If U can find a turn in the small liquid line insulate the temperature-probe; get its temperature for the subcooling analysis:
    Small liquid line temperature ____F

    To measure return air the wet bulb temp, wrap a small/thin, wet (not dripping) piece of cloth around the probe and put it into the Return Air grille & then close to the closest Supply Air diffuser near the air handler (need air movement). Wait until the temperature stabilizes - may take a little while.

    Return Air wet bulb ____F
    Supply Air Wet Bulb ____F

    Need the above information for troubleshooting & performance analysis.

    Example below:
    A Goodman 2-Ton 13-SEER condenser, @800-cfm indoor airflow; 80-F indoor dry bulb & 50% relative humidity; Indoor temp-split 18 to 19-F.
    @ 85-F outdoors; 103.9-F - 85-F outdoors or around an 18.9-F temp-split;
    @Indoor 75-F, 63-wet bulb around 50% RH - condenser temp-split is only 14.9F.
    ================
    A Tech: Below is helpful
    Indoor Total-ESP - External Static Pressure ______
    You or Tech- All Supply Air velocities in FPM: ______
    Measure supply register louvered area.
    We’ll do the math for the total CFM ______

    Tech: Suction line pressure _____
    Suction-Vapor line temperature: ______
    Tech: Saturated Suction Temp – Gage - Suction Saturated Temperature. ____
    Tech- Superheat ______
    Tech- Head pressure _______
    Tech- SCT – Gage - Saturated Condensing Temp _______
    Tech- Small Liquid line - temperature: _______
    You/me/Tech- Subcooling: _______
    Return Air temp Dry Bulb &, Wet Bulb & %RH: _______
    Tech- Supply Air temp DB, WB &/or %RH: _______

    Make sure the Tech does the above plus, checks the discharge temperature of the compressor _____ Too high above 225-F or too low a temp indicates problems that need attention.

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