R-22 retrofits.

[heresjohnnyb]

Has anyone used the r-22a refrigerant .If so ,how did it turn out. Havent used it yet but i am debating due to the cost.I know its not ideal but for old equipment it could be ok i think Im referring to the superfreeze r22ahttp://www.super-freeze.com/super-freeze-22a-refrigerant-r22-freon-replacement-30-lb-equivalent-tank/ld

[caheiman30]

I know on a few the the RTU's at the one of the stores that our owner own's we have converted them over to MO99, the boss didn't wanna use Super Freeze after talking with one of the suppliers about which wa better. We changed out all the filter driers on all the units tha we converted over to MO99.

[valdelocc]

Has anyone used the r-22a refrigerant .If so ,how did it turn out. Havent used it yet but i am debating due to the cost.I know its not ideal but for old equipment it could be ok i think Im referring to the superfreeze r22ahttp://www.super-freeze.com/super-freeze-22a-refrigerant-r22-freon-replacement-30-lb-equivalent-tank/ld

I heard Honeywell is about to market a new r-22 substitute, compatible with mineral oil, no methane or propane on it and very small glide.
I would advise the customer to wait or buy a new 410a unit, wouldn't use r-22a or mo99, they are loaded with flammables and the unit efficiency takes a big drop in the neighborhood of 30%, the few pennies you save by changing refrigerants become dollars wasted on energy consumption.

[caheiman30]

I asked why not just get a new 410a system, but the stores that we have retrofited to MO99 are a year or two from being remodeled and all new equipment, any way.

I heard Honeywell is about to market a new r-22 substitute, compatible with mineral oil, no methane or propane on it and very small glide.
I would advise the customer to wait or buy a new 410a unit, wouldn't use r-22a or mo99, they are loaded with flammables and the unit efficiency takes a big drop in the neighborhood of 30%, the few pennies you save by changing refrigerants become dollars wasted on energy consumption.

[Andy Schoen]

R-22a is a hydrocarbon blend.

It's fine if you know how to properly handle and don't mind violating a few building codes.

Can you properly identify ignition sources in the equipment? They're a bad idea with hydrocarbon refrigerants.

You might find Hychill's experience with their "Minus 50" hydrocarbon blend of interest: http://www.tamahereforum.co.nz/wp-co...to-inquest.pdf

[valdelocc]

R-22a is a hydrocarbon blend.

It's fine if you know how to properly handle and don't mind violating a few building codes.

Can you properly identify ignition sources in the equipment? They're a bad idea with hydrocarbon refrigerants.

You might find Hychill's experience with their "Minus 50" hydrocarbon blend of interest: http://www.tamahereforum.co.nz/wp-co...to-inquest.pdf

Andy, I enjoyed the article you wrote about it on RSES journal, very informative. thanks.

[Jimmyhat 597]

Read the article. I believe R290 is propane. Was told very popular in europe.ammonia is a lot safer than propane

[Andy Schoen]

Andy, I enjoyed the article you wrote about it on RSES journal, very informative. thanks.

Thanks! R-22 was a very good refrigerant. It is much more difficult to replace than R-12.

[Andy Schoen]

Read the article. I believe R290 is propane. Was told very popular in europe.ammonia is a lot safer than propane

R-290 is propane, and it is now acceptable for use under the EPA SNAP rules.

Only new equipment. No retrofits.

Maximum charge per circuit under SNAP rules is only 150 grams. Only commercial refrigeration applications. And you have to know what you are doing with hydrocarbon refrigerants.

Those who work on small commercial refrigeration systems... you will see this soon.

[swei]

You might find Hychill's experience with their "Minus 50" hydrocarbon blend of interest: http://www.tamahereforum.co.nz/wp-co...to-inquest.pdf

Quite a story there -- plenty of mis-application and some very unfortunate outcomes.

http://www.epa.gov/greenchill/downlo...frigerants.pdf brought me up to speed a bit. Safety systems and controls are about to get a lot more complex.

[heresjohnnyb]

Thanks for the feedback guys. I think im gonna keep breaking the customers banks for now just until there is a reliable solution for the 360 dollar a jug r-22

[Andy Schoen]

You may read a fine article on R-22 alternative refrigerants here: https://www.rses.org/assets/rses_jou...ompressors.pdf

[heresjohnnyb]

thanks andy