Load Calculations

[NewYorkMinute]

all a/c units work if installed correctly and maintained.....

We always maintain our a/c and heating. Filters were changed every month and we always had a sprint and fall tune up.

[hvacmike85]

I have a Payne here in NY and a mid size Carrier in our Florida house. The Carrier great!!! The Payne is a pain and a builders grade product.

I'm confident based on experience with it in Florida and what I'm being told now that I will be getting a much better system that is also more reliable.

That could be for sure, but another thing for sure is carrier makes payne, the base line units use the exact same parts, same warranty, same supply houses, payne even makes higher efficient and seer units now, only difference is the condensers have a dense grille (carrier) crappy one on payne. As far as running reliably and efficient they are the same, you might have got a better install with one, or just bad luck, you can have two carriers side by side and still have one better any day, not usually I may add.. I like payne for its price, and warranty. unless you are going with something so high tech payne doesnt make it, carrier is a name your paying prob another 1,000 buck for IMOI mean no offense just trying to educate, most of my customers want whats good equip for reasonable price so I sell alot of it, carrier is my second choice if they want to buy a name.. Bryant is also the same btw

[carmon]

its a good product that i choose not to sell.... absolutely nothing wrong with it...

[NewYorkMinute]

Your in the business and your entitled to your opinions when it comes to products. I am very well aware the Carrier owns Payne. We are selecting a new Carrier product that has features that will be better for our comfort. Also the Payne we have only had a 5 year warranty the Carrier has 10 year and the Carrier has more advanced features. I'm also familiar with the Bryant and have no interest. Based on what I have been told its right down there with the Payne. Like I said, I have both and there is a significant difference between the Carrier mid level and Infinity lines and Payne!!! BTW, I know others in my community that also have Payne and they can't wait to get rid of it.

BTW, I heard the exact opposite of what you said. I was told, depending on the Carrier model, it is "not' the same parts, board etc. We want better than a base line unit.

[XcelTech]

I think you all are missing a simple solution to this problem.

Call an engineering firm, hire them to do a load calculation, pay them, hand the information to all the prospected HVAC companies.

Then you know you had a professional engineer do your load calculation and check your ductwork, his results are of no use to him, he got paid for the work, and the companies have proper information without a chance of loss for the inspection.

Then you just have to decide which company to choose. Ask for 3 good references that match your situation. Check their rep out with BBB and other local means, some states like Texas have a licensing board with online information. Ask the companies to provide VERY DETAILED list of how they will install the system. Ask for photos of past jobs. Ask them what type of training they preform. A professional company has strong training practices.

Then stay on top of them during the installation. Put pictures on the site here, a lot of pictures. Before you sign a completed paperwork, ask for the company to send out a Quality Assurance check, meaning a manager to verify the work. Tell them you want a two week checkup after the installation before you sign the paper work. Tell them all this before agreeing to the work and have them put it in writing. If it is a good company they should say we are pretty busy but if you can work with us on the time schedule sure.

[NewYorkMinute]

I think you all are missing a simple solution to this problem.

Call an engineering firm, hire them to do a load calculation, pay them, hand the information to all the prospected HVAC companies.

Then you know you had a professional engineer do your load calculation and check your ductwork, his results are of no use to him, he got paid for the work, and the companies have proper information without a chance of loss for the inspection.

Then you just have to decide which company to choose. Ask for 3 good references that match your situation. Check their rep out with BBB and other local means, some states like Texas have a licensing board with online information. Ask the companies to provide VERY DETAILED list of how they will install the system. Ask for photos of past jobs. Ask them what type of training they preform. A professional company has strong training practices.

Then stay on top of them during the installation. Put pictures on the site here, a lot of pictures. Before you sign a completed paperwork, ask for the company to send out a Quality Assurance check, meaning a manager to verify the work. Tell them you want a two week checkup after the installation before you sign the paper work. Tell them all this before agreeing to the work and have them put it in writing. If it is a good company they should say we are pretty busy but if you can work with us on the time schedule sure.

Actually the first company who came in and did the LC and said I need a 4 ton is a mechanical engineering firm who does HVAC sales, repair and installation. This is the company I used to repair my a/c & heating for the past several years. They also told me they can't do the install until October.

Perhaps your suggesting I get an engineering company to do the LC who doesn't sell hvac?

[motoguy128]

I would want to see the load calculation. Just because they did a calculation, doesn't mean they are using the correct design temperatures, window data, shading info, air leakage and so on.

Its a incorrect, but common practice ot "pad" the calculations in terms of design temperatures. It also might be that their load calculation was borderline and called for maybe 37,000 BTU's, so they went up. But IMO, they should have still gone down.

[NewYorkMinute]

I would want to see the load calculation. Just because they did a calculation, doesn't mean they are using the correct design temperatures, window data, shading info, air leakage and so on.

Its a incorrect, but common practice ot "pad" the calculations in terms of design temperatures. It also might be that their load calculation was borderline and called for maybe 37,000 BTU's, so they went up. But IMO, they should have still gone down.

I sent them an email asking them to provide me with some backup data that substaintiates the recommendation for a 4 ton because I was quite shocked that they recommended it. I sent it on Saturday so I'm sure they didn't read it yet. I will follow-up my request with a telephone call today.

[motoguy128]

You summer design temp for example is probably around 87-88F and 71F dewpoint. So fairly moderate. Winter is around 2-3F outside the city. In the city, winter design jumps to 15-17F with all that concrete and close proiximity to the ocean.

[NewYorkMinute]

I don't live in NYC, I live in the Northern suburbs and we are surrounded by hills and trees - no concrete!!

[motoguy128]

I don't live in NYC, I live in the Northern suburbs and we are surrounded by hills and trees - no concrete!!

That's what I thought... that's why I listed the slightly lower temperatures of other surrounding areas. 87-88F summer and around 2-3F winter. Relatively moderate. Abotu typcail for much of the east coast.