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  1. #27
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    Quote Originally Posted by Brian GC View Post
    You are not at all hesitant in telling others how wrong they are but please tell me one thing. Have you ever studied what led up to and what took place during the Councils of Nicea?
    I have and still do. What point are you looking to make? It is clear that from the moment of Jesus's ascent into heaven after His Ressurection that man began to misinterpret Jesus's teachings.
    Government is a disease...
    ...masquerading as its own cure…
    Ecclesiastes 10:2 NIV


  2. #28
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    Quote Originally Posted by corny View Post
    There is no credible evidence at all outside the bible that Jesus walked the earth..... All we as christians have is our faith.

    25,000 manuscripts........lol

    What web site did you dig that up from......or was it an email ???

    Tacitus, Pliny the Elder.... those other roman writers were not writing in the same time of Jesus.....and they were not conveying first hand or second or even third hand information..... and we dont even have the original writings of these roman writers..... about the closest we get are manuscripts or copies of their works from the 600s or so.

    But anyhow....nobody living during the time of Jesus wrote about him. No roman records......no historians.... No contemporary writings whatsover.

    You just got to have faith....and thats good enough for most of us.
    Prior to the invention of photography, there is no absolute evidence that anyone existed as we are told they existed. Once everyone who personally knew any person has perished, we only ever have faith in what we want to believe about that person, or even if they actually existed.

    To claim that there is no evidence that Jesus existed is no different then to claim that your great-great grandparents did not exist, and yet, here you are...
    Government is a disease...
    ...masquerading as its own cure…
    Ecclesiastes 10:2 NIV


  3. #29
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    I know Jesus exists...he mows my lawn!
    " Kill a Commie for Mommy! "

    - Colonel David Hackworth (1930-2005), Korean War Vet

  4. #30
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    Quote Originally Posted by coolwhip View Post
    I know Jesus exists...he mows my lawn!
    There ya go! And a big hallelujah too.....
    Government is a disease...
    ...masquerading as its own cure…
    Ecclesiastes 10:2 NIV


  5. #31
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    Quote Originally Posted by hearthman View Post
    Yes, what is your point?
    Man wrote the Scriptures without being first hand witnesses to Jesus and then 300 years later were in charge of selecting what Christian Scriptures were to be included and omitted from the Bible. For me, that presents a problem of authenticity and accuracy. If that does not raise an eyebrow to you then you must also have faith in all those men.

    But of course one can just say it was divinely inspired and not give it second thought. Simplicity sells, while complexity is a turn-off.

  6. #32
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    Quote Originally Posted by Brian GC View Post
    Man wrote the Scriptures without being first hand witnesses to Jesus and then 300 years later were in charge of selecting what Christian Scriptures were to be included and omitted from the Bible. For me, that presents a problem of authenticity and accuracy. If that does not raise an eyebrow to you then you must also have faith in all those men.

    But of course one can just say it was divinely inspired and not give it second thought. Simplicity sells, while complexity is a turn-off.
    Yes, it is a matter of faith. Not faith in mankind, but faith in our spiritual being. Man is foremost a spiritual being, secondmost a physical being. Spiritual faith can exist forever and never be able to be destroyed while everything physical has an expiration date.

    So, while those keepers of the faith were mere mortals, the spirituality of the faith, which we all are part of of within our spiritual being, is constant and forever.

    Yes, much has been misconstrued in what we have spiritual faith in. What we simply cannot deny is that spirituality exists and cannot be removed from our being.
    Government is a disease...
    ...masquerading as its own cure…
    Ecclesiastes 10:2 NIV


  7. #33
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    Quote Originally Posted by RoBoTeq View Post
    Yes, it is a matter of faith. Not faith in mankind...
    On the contrary, you must have a lot of faith (blind, improvable trust) in all the men who put the Bible together over the ages knowing that none of them ever met Jesus.

    In order for the Bible to be the best, most accurate depiction of Jesus' message is to believe in a near continuous 350 year miracle. If this is so then it would dwarf all of His other miracles.

  8. #34
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    Quote Originally Posted by hearthman View Post
    Roy, you speak of Christ in philisophical terms and state you aren't sure he even walked the earth. Aside from the overwhelming historical evidence outside of the Bible that Jesus of Nazareth indeed did walk this earth, is the question of who he is. According to the Bible and about 25,000 various manuscripts, letters and writings from that period, he in fact is the Son of God, the Creator of the Universe and offered himself for our sins once for all time in exchange for our faith and belief in him and agree to repent of our sins and live our lives for our Father, who is in heaven. Since you do not acknowledge his deity, you cannot therefore believe in Christ. Oh, sure you may think that philosphically, he had some great ideas and taught worthy and honorable things but if you don't accept his as your Savior, then according to Him, as written in the Bible, you are not a Christian and therefore will not spend eternity in heaven. Being a groupie or a fan does not make one a Christian.

    It is not the person of Christ that matters most but his deity and what he has offered Believers. One day we'll find out who's right.
    Who are you to judge me, who made you God. Does it ever occure to you that your believe system is intolerant, which actually goes against the very teachings of Jesus. The very reason he repeated Confucius "Golden Rule", was to bring home the point to be tolerant toward others

    Look around you, we are killing each other because of intolerance, and who does that serve...good...or evil. Its iodolism thats the problem in this world, Jesus, Mohammed, Budda, the Pope etc etc. For some reason we need an Idol to follow, beause internally many are weak and need some Father/Mother figure to be obediant. There needs to be only one rule to follow on this panet for us to get along, but as simple as this rule is, its very hard to follow, for our teachings from young on tells us we are a special people, and others that dont believe the same, are evil, and treating them less then us dont matter so much, for we are after all special.


    "Treath others, they way you would want them to treath you"
    Its the only law we need to follow, the rest are toppings

    You just dont get it, I dont care if he ever existed one way or the other. Its not the man that matters, its his message that matters.

    Roy
    "The perfect Totalitarian State is one where the political bosses, and their army of managers, control a population of slaves, who do not have to be coerced, because they love their servitude"

  9. #35
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    So I propose we can all look to Rodney King..."can't we all just get along"...

    Don't worry zombies are looking for brains, you're safe...

  10. #36
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    Do you believe Socrates and Plato existed? If so, how do you know they existed? Upon what do you base your belief?
    "No matter how thirsty your imagination, mirages contain no water"

  11. #37
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    Quote Originally Posted by Brian GC View Post
    On the contrary, you must have a lot of faith (blind, improvable trust) in all the men who put the Bible together over the ages knowing that none of them ever met Jesus.

    In order for the Bible to be the best, most accurate depiction of Jesus' message is to believe in a near continuous 350 year miracle. If this is so then it would dwarf all of His other miracles.
    No, Brian. You keep missing the point. The faith in God and in Jesus Christ is what allows those of us of faith to believe that man has been so inspired by God and by Jesus Christ to have "faithfully" passed down the oral and written words of our Lord.

    I'm sorry, Brian, but you don't seem to have a grasp of what "faith" in God really is all about. Keep thinking about it though. In fact, do some praying on the subject as well. Spiritual faith is not something we can find in just the writings of men, but rather in the hearts of the men who did the writing.

    Those of us of spiritual faith have no reason to doubt what has been written about Jesus Christ, so why would we doubt what we our spiritual being tells us is truth?
    Government is a disease...
    ...masquerading as its own cure…
    Ecclesiastes 10:2 NIV


  12. #38
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    Quote Originally Posted by royc View Post
    Who are you to judge me, who made you God. Does it ever occure to you that your believe system is intolerant, which actually goes against the very teachings of Jesus. The very reason he repeated Confucius "Golden Rule", was to bring home the point to be tolerant toward others

    Look around you, we are killing each other because of intolerance, and who does that serve...good...or evil. Its iodolism thats the problem in this world, Jesus, Mohammed, Budda, the Pope etc etc. For some reason we need an Idol to follow, beause internally many are weak and need some Father/Mother figure to be obediant. There needs to be only one rule to follow on this panet for us to get along, but as simple as this rule is, its very hard to follow, for our teachings from young on tells us we are a special people, and others that dont believe the same, are evil, and treating them less then us dont matter so much, for we are after all special.


    "Treath others, they way you would want them to treath you"
    Its the only law we need to follow, the rest are toppings

    You just dont get it, I dont care if he ever existed one way or the other. Its not the man that matters, its his message that matters.

    Roy
    The Golden Rule is nice, but it is flawed. As I have already pointed out, there are some people who want to be treated in ways that I never want to be treated. I certainly don't want to be treated the same by someone who utters the phrase; "Whip me, beat me, treat me like the slut I am...." Nor do I want to be treated the same by the guy who wants to be physically molested by another man. So you see, Roy, it is not quite the same.
    Government is a disease...
    ...masquerading as its own cure…
    Ecclesiastes 10:2 NIV


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