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  1. #1

    Condo cooling - Fan coil issue or Insuffiency

    I hope I am posting this in the right place.

    I live in a condo called Mondeo Springs (Tridel building managed by Del). We have been having issues with the fan coil unit not being able to cool the suite sufficiently. I have been informed that the fan coil unit is our problem (not really an issue if that's the issue). The unit used to cool to ~70F (65-67 as per the wall thermostat under the coil unit), the temperature now is 76.0 @50%RH (~81F humidex value). It runs 24/7 and never (even at night) goes below 70F on the thermostat (72.7F in the room), even when the outside temperature is in the mid to low 60's).

    I believe that the chiller values were altered from what they were when the building was built. I have no problems getting someone in to "fix" the fan coil unit, if I believed it was an issue with the unit, but I don't. I have been monitoring the fins, and the actuator has been remaining open, I was charged @$$$ to change the actuator which was never an issue, since it did not alter temperatures in the slightest (the chiller was not running at the time they changed the actuator, so no tests could be done). When I called the HVAC contractors to come back and fix the issue, they did not (they were also the company that was in charge of the chiller at the time).

    The suite is 900sqft, the fan coil unt is a TVE 600 (with a 3 row coil). We live on the PH level (our ceiling is the buldings roof) 9' ceilings with a southern exposure. I believe the temperature of the chiller water used to be low to mid 30's F. Now my fins and outer temperature of the pipes read 55F.

    http://www.temspec.com/guides/Temspe...ise%20Book.pdf

    I have no clue how to calculate what temperature and flow rates the chiller would need to be set to provide adequate cooling for the fan coil they had installed. I do understand that some (keyword some), inefficiency in cooling due to inefficiencies (caused by dirt), but not 7 degrees worth. The fact that the incoming water pipe and the fins are at the same temperature, pretty much rules out any blockage in the pipes running through the coils.

    Does anyone know at what chiller settings the fan coil unit would have enough capacity to cool the suite? Also, is there anyway to get the original settings for the chiller when the unit was built? thanks.
    Last edited by jpsmith1cm; 05-25-2012 at 08:23 PM. Reason: Addendum

  2. #2
    Join Date
    Dec 2010
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    You have the worst suite in the building in terms of heat and cool. A lot of extremes and lots of heat loss/gain.

    I know these are new buildings but how long have you been in the suite. The company has a fixed time that they are responsible for system.

    Chiller temps can range depending on the control used so can you get a thermometer and place it on the feed and return lines and see what those temps are? Are both pipes 55F? If they are both 55F, your fancoil is not taking any heat out of the air which could be a fan issue or plugged coil. There is not much to go wrong with a unit like this.

    I would also ask the super what the design water temps are for the building and why they may be changed, so you have something to go by.

  3. #3
    Quote Originally Posted by SolarMike View Post
    You have the worst suite in the building in terms of heat and cool. A lot of extremes and lots of heat loss/gain.

    I know these are new buildings but how long have you been in the suite. The company has a fixed time that they are responsible for system.

    Chiller temps can range depending on the control used so can you get a thermometer and place it on the feed and return lines and see what those temps are? Are both pipes 55F? If they are both 55F, your fancoil is not taking any heat out of the air which could be a fan issue or plugged coil. There is not much to go wrong with a unit like this.

    I would also ask the super what the design water temps are for the building and why they may be changed, so you have something to go by.
    Tell me about it! I wish we had some heat loss! Even on the coldest winter day, with the fan coil unit completely shutdown, and the water to the coils closed, the suite NEVER drops below 79F (it's almost magical).

    We purchased the unit before the building was built (2001), and moved in 2003. I would think that they are responsible for the system (regardless of time), if the issue is caused by parameters which are outside of the suite owners control. If the original fan coil was meant for chiller temps and flow rates of X, and "management" has those factors lowered by a factor of Y, then any inadequacy is a result of their alterations. I don't believe that a time frame can be placed on that kind of an issue.

    At first I thought the pipes running through the coils could be plugged. Then I figured that if they were plugged, the air going through the fins would heat them up, and raise my probe temperature (and that is remaining basically constant). Since that isn't happening, and the register air is cooled to 57F, I assume that blockage isn't an issue.

    Management (and the super) have been less then forthcoming in regards to the chiller temperatures now, but they claim to have no clue as to what they were. I assume the temperatures and/or flow rates have been altered to save money (to our detriment).

    Does anyone know where I can get the original chiller specifications?

    I am so pissed at this point, that I am tempted to make a couple holes from the fan coil housing compartment to the outside wall (about one foot deep), and mounting an AC compressor to the side of the building. I want a meat locker, damn it!!!
    Last edited by QuantumJump; 05-25-2012 at 07:24 PM. Reason: Clarification

  4. #4
    Join Date
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    Post what the entering and leaving AIR temp is and entering and leaving WATER temp is by measuring the pipe temp. Make sur you use a good quality digital thermometer. Make sure when you measure pipe temp, you give an accurate temp by having good contact and insulating the tip of the thermometer? Make sure the actuator is wide open.

  5. #5
    Join Date
    Dec 2010
    Location
    Toronto
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    The original builder has no more responsibility for the suite anymore. You need to check the Terrion warranty document. That said, the original constructions docs and spec should be available at the management office and if they don't play ball, you then need to talk to the other owners.

    AHHHH the joys of condo ownership. I don't even bother trying to interest condos in things like solar because I have almost never been successful at getting the herd of cats to walk in the same direction.

    With the temps measured "properly", we can also get an ultrasonic flow meter to check the flow without opening the pipe. With that you can determine the heat transfer and you can then approach the management and the other tenants (if needed). BTW, the fancoils output is stated at 6C liquid temp.

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