Grundfos pump

[will smith]

Anyone ever run across a Grundfos pump model UPS 65 160, with an additional tag on it of "8542 Dual"? We've tried our local rep with little success so far-the numbers on it aren't coming up good for them.

[qwerty hvac]

I have never seen a setup like that. Are they setup to cycle on and off or do they run in tandem?



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[heatingman]

That looks like an older model.

When pumps are run together in parallel, the head function is the same as just one pump, but the gpm flow more or less doubles.

I've never seen that particular set up, but I've done that in the past. Often times, two smaller pumps cost a lot less then 1 big one.

Is there a specific question about the pumps you have?

[will smith]

Pump number 1 failed mechanically about three months ago, and number 2 failed electrically yesterday. We would like to replace it with a B&G-which is easier to get parts for here in Chicago-but can't yet find info on this Grundfos. I've had conflicting stories as to whether or not both pumps were to run at the same time, or if it was supposed to be a lead/lag setup.

[heatingman]

What's the application?

A new pump selection can be made if you know the following:

Btu output of the boiler, or chiller (gives you flow in gpm)

For a 20 degree delta, output btu/10,000 = gpm required

for a 40 degree delta, output btu/5000 = gpm

If chiller, 3 gpm per ton. for a tower, 4 gpm per ton.



Length of longest run (gives head requirement)

If length is unknown, measure the perimeter of the building and add the height times two.

Take that number and multiply by 1.5, then by .042

Example 500 ft * 1.5 = 750 * .042 = 31.5 feet of head.

If this is an open system like on a tower, then find the height between the sump and the spray nozzles and add that to the final # from the calculation.

[heatingman]

Anyone ever run across a Grundfos pump model UPS 65 160, with an additional tag on it of "8542 Dual"? We've tried our local rep with little success so far-the numbers on it aren't coming up good for them.

Who is your rep, I'm in Chitown also, and might have a better resource.

[dlove]

Anyone ever run across a Grundfos pump model UPS 65 160, with an additional tag on it of "8542 Dual"? We've tried our local rep with little success so far-the numbers on it aren't coming up good for them.

http://www.plumbnation.co.uk/site/gr...ta-booklet.pdf

hope this helps.

[Tech Rob]

It looks similar to an Armstrong DualArm pump. They are designed to run both at the same time at a lower frequency to save energy, and also provide some redundancy. It is more efficient to run two motors at 45-50hz on a VFD than it is to run one larger motor at 60hz on a VFD. The Armstrongs are usually much bigger than that, though.

I don't know if the concept is the same with what you have there. I haven't worked on many Grundfos pumps. Most of the ones I have seen are small circulator pumps for water cooled DX equipment.

[dlove]

IMO they dont run at the same time. You had one go bad, how was the other working before it broke? you can run both at the same time i guess, but it don't make sense. Unless you can tell us the function and what controls the pump.

[SolarMike]

Check and see if there is an integral check valve in the pump body. If not, both pumps run at the same time. I doubt there is a check valve because they didn't make them in the mid 80s when there pumps were made, AFAIK.

[XcelTech]

Joyce Madl : jmadl@gasvoda.com
Gasvoda & Associates, Inc.
1530 Huntington Drive
Calumet City, Illinois 60409
708-891-4400

Here is a link to your parts list Cir Pumps

UPS 65-160F is in the middle of page 16

[will smith]

Thanks for all the input-the manual helped clarify what this pump was capable of, though I have to say Grundfos' site is as clear as mud. We've since found that parts are no longer available for this one. This application is simply 100% demand all the time-no deviation in the load-i.e., no valves closing, no means of monitoring flow-as long as the overload on the pumps were made and the power switches for each were "on", the pumps ran. They replaced a B&G pump with this Grundfos years ago-even though B&G is made 2 towns away from this location.
We're looking now into replacing it with a single pump, though the customer is concerned about not having a 2 pump setup for redundancy.

[hvac69]

If both were supposed to run together that may be why the second one failed shortly after the first due to it not being able to handle the head on its own. So not really sure what kind of redundancy he had in the first place.

[SolarMike]

If both were supposed to run together that may be why the second one failed shortly after the first due to it not being able to handle the head on its own. So not really sure what kind of redundancy he had in the first place.

That pump wasn't a redundancy pump. It was either put in because there wasn't a single one with the right specs or a lack of knowledge.

[JGT]

Anyone ever run across a Grundfos pump model UPS 65 160, with an additional tag on it of "8542 Dual"? We've tried our local rep with little success so far-the numbers on it aren't coming up good for them.

Hi, I work for Grundfos in the Kansas City office. I may be able to help you answer some of your questions.

FYI, the "8542" is a date code, indicating the year and week the pump was made. So, 8542 = 1985, Week 42 (mid-October). Nice to see that it survived for 27 years.

These pumps don't have a lead/lag feature on them;the new MAGNA pumps have such capability. We also stopped selling the dual-head pumps several years ago (but I think they'll be coming back).

Here is an approximate curve for the pump you have...hopefully this will help you find a suitable replacement. If you have specific application requirements (head, flow, etc., then we can help you size one that may fit.

http://goo.gl/ClRyx

- Joshua Talley

[will smith]

Thanks to everyone for their input on this one. We've ended up putting in a new Wilo Stratus D series dual pump. I'm heading back out today to put the finishing touches on it, though we got it in and powered up yesterday. Except for some glitches with actually getting the pump, I have to say so far I'm impressed with it. Although we don't actually need it's variable capacity capabilities with this particular job (it's constant volume heating-no modulation necessary), I'm looking forward to using it again when we can use the bells and whistles. Unbelievably quiet. The manual could use a little work, and time will tell ultimately how reliable the pump itself is, but-fingers crossed-so far so good!