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  1. #1
    Join Date
    Oct 2003
    Location
    Dallas,Texas
    Posts
    52

    is this normal? the thick pipe is not cold

    I don't know the name of the pipe. There is one thin and thick pipe. The thin one gets hot and the thick one I believe is supposed to be cold when the unit is on.

    I have about 11 years split system in Dallas. Coil is in the attic and condensor is outside. The pipe used to be cold when A/C was on. When my pipe was nailed by a roofer and fixed last year, I asked the A/C guy why the pipe was not cold any more and he said it'd be still okay. The house was cooling anyway. I survied last year summer with the unit. It still took longer to cool the house though. The temp difference I heard is 15 degree which was excellent per him.

    This year, the pipe is still not cold and it takes a lot longer to cool the house and I am worried. There is no condensation whatsoever when my the other unit for upstair has condensation and the pipe is very cold.

    Is it something I should call soemeone to check? The temp difference when outside was 90 was about 12-13 degree in the way I measured. The coil inside was replaced 2 years ago and outside unit is about 11 year old carrier 3.5 ton for 3500 sq house. I have another 4 ton for upstairs as well.

  2. #2
    Join Date
    Jul 2005
    Posts
    5,153
    It isn't normal. There are several problems that can cause that though, so basically it's time to have it checked. There are some pro members in this forum who work in your area. Check the contractor locator map if you'd like to give one of them a shot at it.

    http://www.icemeister.net/aop_map.html

  3. #3
    Join Date
    Oct 2003
    Location
    Dallas,Texas
    Posts
    52
    Quote Originally Posted by hvacrmedic View Post
    It isn't normal. There are several problems that can cause that though, so basically it's time to have it checked. There are some pro members in this forum who work in your area. Check the contractor locator map if you'd like to give one of them a shot at it.

    http://www.icemeister.net/aop_map.html
    I will call the one who fixed mine last year first to see what he has to say.
    However, can you tell me the posssible causes so that I could have some understanding?...I don't want to let the guy do whatever he tells me that he has to do....

    low in freon is the only thing I know?!!!....

    Thanks in advance.

  4. #4
    Join Date
    Apr 2005
    Posts
    412
    could be low on freon, or Overchared with freon or Compressor internal valves leaking. But you deff have a problem..
    Jason J Saylor
    Pinellas County Schools
    HVAC Tech
    Pinellas County Florida

    "You will encounter many distractions and many temptations to put your goals aside: The security of a job, a wife who wants kids, Whatever. But if you hang in there, always following your vision, I have no doubt you will succeed.
    Larry Flynt quote

  5. #5
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Location
    Galveston Texas
    Posts
    530
    based on your original post that would NOT be the first guy i'd call back. if the big line (the suction line) wasn't even cold in last years heat wave and he said it'd be ok and a 15 degree split was excellent is not someone I'd consider my first choice in technicians.

  6. #6
    Join Date
    Apr 2006
    Location
    Barrie Ontario
    Posts
    312
    As you can see a good percent of the people here take pride in there work and doing it right the first time, do yourself a favor use one of them for the service besides if it's low on "freon" I highly doubt it will be warranty and chances are you'll just be calling that guy back out next year.
    For some reason I learn more with my mouth shut

  7. #7
    Join Date
    Sep 2008
    Location
    Western PA
    Posts
    24,947
    Quote Originally Posted by noltian View Post
    I don't know the name of the pipe. There is one thin and thick pipe. The thin one gets hot and the thick one I believe is supposed to be cold when the unit is on.

    I have about 11 years split system in Dallas. Coil is in the attic and condensor is outside. The pipe used to be cold when A/C was on. When my pipe was nailed by a roofer and fixed last year, I asked the A/C guy why the pipe was not cold any more and he said it'd be still okay. The house was cooling anyway. I survied last year summer with the unit. It still took longer to cool the house though. The temp difference I heard is 15 degree which was excellent per him.

    This year, the pipe is still not cold and it takes a lot longer to cool the house and I am worried. There is no condensation whatsoever when my the other unit for upstair has condensation and the pipe is very cold.

    Is it something I should call soemeone to check? The temp difference when outside was 90 was about 12-13 degree in the way I measured. The coil inside was replaced 2 years ago and outside unit is about 11 year old carrier 3.5 ton for 3500 sq house. I have another 4 ton for upstairs as well.
    This disturbs me.

    There's a difference between "working okay" and "working properly"

  8. #8
    Join Date
    Oct 2003
    Location
    Dallas,Texas
    Posts
    52
    Quote Originally Posted by jpsmith1cm View Post
    This disturbs me.

    There's a difference between "working okay" and "working properly"
    well, the guy came in and told me the freon is a bit low now
    Without having him add the freon, I just asked him what's the pressure and let him go. I couldn't trust him ...

    when outside was 80 degree, suction pressure 70psi per him. The tubing temp was 78 which I measured myself. I get 55-72 degree from vent when inside is 78 degress...

    does it sound like I need freon?

  9. #9
    Join Date
    Sep 2008
    Location
    Western PA
    Posts
    24,947
    Quote Originally Posted by noltian View Post
    well, the guy came in and told me the freon is a bit low now
    Without having him add the freon, I just asked him what's the pressure and let him go. I couldn't trust him ...

    when outside was 80 degree, suction pressure 70psi per him. The tubing temp was 78 which I measured myself. I get 55-72 degree from vent when inside is 78 degress...

    does it sound like I need freon?

    Well, it's hard to say precisely, but I would not say that your system is operating properly.

  10. #10
    Join Date
    Jun 2005
    Location
    SW Wisconsin
    Posts
    4,467
    Quote Originally Posted by noltian View Post
    well, the guy came in and told me the freon is a bit low now
    Without having him add the freon, I just asked him what's the pressure and let him go. I couldn't trust him ...

    when outside was 80 degree, suction pressure 70psi per him. The tubing temp was 78 which I measured myself. I get 55-72 degree from vent when inside is 78 degrees...
    does it sound like I need freon?
    Tell us exactly how & with what did you take that 78-F suction temperature; taken near suction line access port. Is suction line well insulated?

    On an R-22 system; 70-psig is 41-saturated suction temperature (SST).

    Get a relative humidity gauge so we can possibly generate some numbers.
    Is it a fixed orifice refrigerant metering device or a TXV?

    An R-22 fixed orifice device: using a Superheat Table; @80-F outdoors, @80-F dry bulb indoors & @54% relative humidity shows Superheat at 23-F; you indicate 78-F or14-F too much superheat at the stated numbers I list here. The climate is usually quite dry in Dallas TX; but could vary sharply...

    If indoor humidity is at around 50% the indoor temp-split should be 18 to 22-F, not as low as 12 to 13-F you indicated when 90-F outdoors; unless humidity was extremely high indoors.

    Unit appears to have refrigerant system problems that need diagnosing; could be under-charged or has air in system or other partial restriction problems, etc.

    Too bad the nail punctured the line as that appears to have caused the work to fix it, - to have some problems.

    If it has a TXV they are usually set at around 12-F superheat; 41-F plus 12-F is 53-F SH, could add +one degree-F SH when taken at suction line port at condenser.

    You can buy a low cost humidity gauge with TH at most ACE hardware stores, every homes needs one for each floor level.

  11. #11
    Join Date
    Mar 2007
    Location
    tx
    Posts
    986
    udarrell, after all of the posts I have read from you, I finally found one that I do not agree with. I live in west texas most of the time, but have a house in the Dallas area as well. Most of the time that I go to DAllas, I have to learn to breath all over again to get used to the increase in relative humidity compared to west texas. I find it very humid there. Now I know that this is a relative statement, as I would think it is dry compared to Houston or Galvaston.
    Bad information is worse than no information at all.

    There are three kinds of people in this world. Those who can count and those who can't!

  12. #12
    Join Date
    Jul 2006
    Posts
    1,091
    Dallas/Fort Worth Climate Overview
    Key quotes....
    "The Dallas-Fort Worth climate is humid subtropical with hot summers."
    "The highest temperatures of summer are associated with fair skies, westerly winds and low humidities."

    Translation.... Miserable

    As you can see from udarrell's post, there's a little more to it than the thick pipe being diet mountain dew can cold.

  13. #13
    Join Date
    Jun 2005
    Location
    SW Wisconsin
    Posts
    4,467
    Quote Originally Posted by surenuff View Post
    udarrell, after all of the posts I have read from you, I finally found one that I do not agree with. I live in west texas most of the time, but have a house in the Dallas area as well. Most of the time that I go to Dallas, I have to learn to breathe all over again to get used to the increase in relative humidity compared to west Texas. I find it very humid there. Now I know that this is a relative statement, as I would think it is dry compared to Houston or Galveston.
    Key quotes....
    "The Dallas-Fort Worth climate is humid subtropical with hot summers."
    "The highest temperatures of summer are associated with fair skies, westerly winds and low humidities. - rickboggs
    Well, I have never lived in Dallas-Fort Worth, TX area, but was relying on the 2.5% summer design of 100-F dry bulb & 75-F wet bulb which is around 31% relative humidity.

    Makes you wonder about those summer design numbers especially when it comes to humidity, huh...

    Here in SW WI we can get 90-F to 100-F plus with high humidity which means a lot of grains of moisture in that hot air; that makes a heavy latent load on the A/C depending on the rate of air infiltration.

    We have had some occasional horrendous Heat Indexes & A/C loads to deal with here, however, my two little window A/Cs handled those horrific latent load incidences very well.

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