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  1. #1
    Join Date
    Dec 2009
    Location
    Hotlanta GA.
    Posts
    217

    RTAC 500 Oil presure ???

    Hey, still alaive ..............Heart is a ticking Ok for now !!

    RTAC 500 Oil presure, I know the presure is reflective of the head presure, what I am seeing is an increace in my oil presure with still cool air outside, there is a constant load, I do probable have dirty coils, I DO NOT have an oil cooler on these beast. What elese drive the presure ?? I am thinking oil filter..

    I've come a long way on these things RTAC 500, with the warmer weather comming I have to look at things now before too late, can not take machines down after mid April due to load and critical load........

    So any info on the oil presure and its twurks and tweeks, bring em on !!!

    HOTLANTA already...........

  2. #2
    Join Date
    Jul 2007
    Location
    The Hot South
    Posts
    1,372
    What really matters is the differential between oil pressure, head pressure, and evaporator pressure. There is no oil pump. Oil just flow from high side to low side.

  3. #3
    Join Date
    Dec 2009
    Location
    Hotlanta GA.
    Posts
    217
    Well how about that !!!
    I had one of those brain fart moments

    Been so involved with all the diferant equipment at this building, went and forgot all about the NO PUPMP issue.

    Broke a rule of mine as well, forgot to READ THE BOOK !! Yep I'll need to go back and read up on the oil circuit for these screws.........

    So for now I'll just go back to my bucket and ponder the info I'll review, hate it when I go to sleep and most of the Data I have stored from the day is not uploaded into the memory storage disk thingie I have (the brain) !!
    That or it may be the heat, Hotlanta is a cookin all ready !!!


    Again this place is the best for bouncing things off the wall to jog the old brain. I long for the days of a block of ice and a fan blowing across it !!

  4. #4
    Join Date
    Mar 2012
    Location
    montreal/canada
    Posts
    81
    Check if your compressor starts unloaded

  5. #5
    Join Date
    Aug 2000
    Location
    Austell, Ga.
    Posts
    1,296
    Quote Originally Posted by Mongo and me View Post
    Well how about that !!!
    I had one of those brain fart moments

    Been so involved with all the diferant equipment at this building, went and forgot all about the NO PUPMP issue.

    Broke a rule of mine as well, forgot to READ THE BOOK !! Yep I'll need to go back and read up on the oil circuit for these screws.........

    So for now I'll just go back to my bucket and ponder the info I'll review, hate it when I go to sleep and most of the Data I have stored from the day is not uploaded into the memory storage disk thingie I have (the brain) !!
    That or it may be the heat, Hotlanta is a cookin all ready !!!


    Again this place is the best for bouncing things off the wall to jog the old brain. I long for the days of a block of ice and a fan blowing across it !!
    If you were anything other than a 6'4" ex-Army Ranger that more than likely made too many jumps landing on yer' noggin', I was gonna' give you my advise on the block of ice and fan idea. But being a wise man that knows his limitations I would simply recommend not using a oscillating fan.
    Ain't "None" of us as smart as "All" of us..

  6. #6
    Join Date
    Dec 2009
    Location
    Hotlanta GA.
    Posts
    217
    LOVE THE COMMENTS .......

    OK, back with my oil situation ....
    I haev seen the formula for oil presure. Due to lack of involment with OLD MATH, I am looking for soem clearification on definition of oil formula by TRANE.

    0.50 > Pc -Pi / Pc - Pe

    PC = Condenser Pressure
    PI = Intermediate Pressure
    PE = Evaporator Pressure


    WHAT would you say PI is ??? Is it the presure reading on the display pannel, or is a presure that I get when I finish calculating ??

    Should it be the result of calculating, and since I did do a few jumps WITH a chute, I would be very happy to have one of you guys show me the resulting math !! I for got my A. B. C's > < ect. ect ..... That and I'm comming off a bad weeek.........

    Thanks all......

    By the way; A restriction (dirty filter or non-functioning oil control valve) will cause the compressor to be very loud and/or trip on Low Oil Flow.

    I have a new machine RTAC 500, that the compressor sounds like a jet engine and the sound is comming form the oil seperator, or close to it.........

    HP - 104
    SP - 40
    Oil P - 128
    O/A - 57 F.

    Load - 1 comp. = 35 % no other comp. running, this is cir. 2 comp A that is doing this.
    Other units are running fien and no screaming...... very low load conditions these days..... look to load up in about 2 months.....

    Go For It !!

  7. #7
    Join Date
    Jul 2007
    Location
    The Hot South
    Posts
    1,372
    PI is the pressure reading on the DynaView display. (you can't use the RESULT of the formula as one of the numbers IN the formula)

    The reason your oil seperator is screaming is because there's no oil in it! You need to check the screen on the oil scavanger line and clean it out before you loose your compressors.

    HP - 104
    SP - 40
    Oil P - 128
    O/A - 57 F

    Your oil pressure can't be higher than your discharge pressure as you stated unless you have a bad transducer.

  8. #8
    Join Date
    Dec 2009
    Location
    Hotlanta GA.
    Posts
    217
    OK, presure readings are as they are, TRANE would NEVER send out a machine with a bad transducer, whould they ??

    Will have them look into it as they are new and still under warrenty coverage. Checked the oil scavanger line, filter dryer is doing well, no drop across it, and it is cold all the way to the compressor. Unit is making water setpoint all be it with a 2 degree differntial, NO LOAD !!! need some heat here in HOTLANTA !! or at least in this "BIG" room we are working on.

    I see your point about the oil presure not higher then the cond. presure, the formula will screw ya up bad !!! As in NO net oil Presure !! Well kinda !!

    so the 0.05 > in front of the formula says ??? .05 or greater then for oil net presure ???


    So will haev TRANE look at the unit and let them have the fun.....

    HOPPY EASTER ALL

  9. #9
    Join Date
    Aug 2006
    Location
    Mixing oil and fire with a big spoon.
    Posts
    4,530
    Quote Originally Posted by Mongo and me View Post
    ...
    0.50 > Pc -Pi / Pc - Pe

    PC = Condenser Pressure
    PI = Intermediate Pressure
    PE = Evaporator Pressure


    WHAT would you say PI is ??? Is it the presure reading on the display pannel, or is a presure that I get when I finish calculating ??...

    HP - 104
    SP - 40
    Oil P - 128
    O/A - 57 F.
    ...
    Pi is Pressure Intermediate...meaning Oil Pressure.

    using your numbers, the formula calculates out to -0.375 which would mean that you have the cleanest filter in the world! yeah, something is out of whack, however, with a very unloaded machine, the pressures can change dramatically with small load changes. the chiller is going to get ALL of the values at the same time without changing screens like you have to do, so it is more likely that it is seeing a valid number unless your transducers are off.

    if your oil pressure transducer reads 15 psi higher than the condenser pressure for more than 30 seconds you will get an 'Oil Flow Fault'.
    "If you pull one more stunt like you just pulled with Tommy, you won't have to get on a plane because I will personally kick your ass from here to Korea!" - Best of the Best

  10. #10
    Join Date
    Dec 2009
    Location
    Hotlanta GA.
    Posts
    217
    CLEANEST oil filter in town hey !!

    Well Ok, then, I did the quick screen look and still see the oil pressure higher than the condenser pressure, will have TRANE decide if they want to change it.

    Due to the screaming the thing was making I decided to put it out of it's misery, yep it's easy to stop a Trane !! Locked out cir. 2 and let 1 take the load, boy ya outa hear the peace and quiet now !!

    So for sure there is trouble in the back end of this machine, no I didn't have the time to try comp. B of cir. 2. that would be interesting to do, see if it screams too !!

    As you say if I get a major difference in the oil pressure I should get an alarm, no alarm so far, so I will just sit back on the old bucket, ponder a while, down a cup or two of that go go juice and wait for "experts " to show up !

    Throw me another one of those tied died eggs ya found in the yard

  11. #11
    Join Date
    Dec 2009
    Location
    Hotlanta GA.
    Posts
    217
    WELL I'LL BE !!

    Yep been taking readings for almost a year, and low and behold I get into the oil pressure and learn to read the front panel to understand the items...........
    Right there in front of me is the word "Intermediate Oil Pressure" !! DA !! all this time I only paid attention to oil pressure !!

    I had been working on a side item of testing and was so engrossed with abbreviations that I total lost it for looking at the panel and seeing the nomenclature. So for all you guys out there looking at machines, sometimes it's a good idea to just stand back and see the screen !!

    Makes all the sense now as for what is PI stand for on a TRAC human interface panel .......

    It's the simple things I miss............

    Thanks all for putting up with my senior moments.

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