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  1. #27
    Join Date
    Jun 2011
    Posts
    15
    I do plan on using nitrogen to purge while dehydrating. I may also sweep a few times just for good measure. Luckily I was able to push most of the oil out of the machine with nitrogen before the tubes thawed out and began leaking. I am still holding out hope that since the barrel was drained there isn't much moisture in the machine. But i will prepare for the worst....hoping for the best. Thanks for your help!

  2. #28
    Join Date
    Mar 2012
    Location
    WV
    Posts
    21
    John 98 who did you talk to at mcquay about plugging condenser tubes? Your not gonna believe this I had a mechanic freeze and bust tubes on a subcooler today on a mcquay in the sub cooler

  3. #29
    Join Date
    Jan 2009
    Location
    Keokuk, IA
    Posts
    5,520
    We're having a Trane Centrifugal (CVHE028) retubed right now. We're into it for some major cash... probalby 1/4 the cost of repalcement and possibly more because they are concerned there's enough errosion on tube sheet, that retubing might fracture it. It also includes cutting the shell in several places as well.

    I don't know the company. Its' subcontracted through Trane. But they do travel.

  4. #30
    Join Date
    Jan 2009
    Location
    Keokuk, IA
    Posts
    5,520
    FWIM, I think our guys evacuate the refrigerant while tower water is still flowing but I'm not sure.

  5. #31
    Join Date
    Jan 2008
    Location
    Dallas ,Texas
    Posts
    3,718
    Quote Originally Posted by motoguy128 View Post
    FWIM, I think our guys evacuate the refrigerant while tower water is still flowing but I'm not sure.
    Wow you are in worse shape than he is.
    UA 100

    It takes three people to do anything around here. Two do the work, one explains to the crowd of people who showed up when they seen smoke and flames.

  6. #32
    Join Date
    Jun 2011
    Posts
    15
    Quote Originally Posted by browntrout View Post
    John 98 who did you talk to at mcquay about plugging condenser tubes? Your not gonna believe this I had a mechanic freeze and bust tubes on a subcooler today on a mcquay in the sub cooler
    I spoke with Anthony Blake at Daikin McQuay. He said only plug up to 7 % of the condenser bundle. But if its in the subcooler then you have to total up the amount of tubes in the subcooler section and only plug 7% of that total. For me i had 161 tubes in the subcooler which means 12 tubes total i could plug.

  7. #33
    Join Date
    Jan 2009
    Location
    Keokuk, IA
    Posts
    5,520
    Quote Originally Posted by thegoodlistener View Post
    Wow you are in worse shape than he is.
    Like I said, I could be wrong. I'm off to chiller school next month. Should help clarify things a little more.

  8. #34
    Join Date
    Jun 2011
    Posts
    15
    Quote Originally Posted by browntrout View Post
    John 98 who did you talk to at mcquay about plugging condenser tubes? Your not gonna believe this I had a mechanic freeze and bust tubes on a subcooler today on a mcquay in the sub cooler
    Do you have any idea how they froze? Did the machine flood?

  9. #35
    Join Date
    Mar 2004
    Location
    ottawa canada
    Posts
    2,058
    Quote Originally Posted by jon98tt View Post
    Do you have any idea how they froze? Did the machine flood?
    Question 1 - its called stupidity !!!!!!
    Question 2 - what was your first clue !!!!
    The 64 roars to life Whoo hoo ...shes a rolling chassis .
    You bend em" I"ll mend em" !!!!!!!
    I"m not a service tech.. I"m a thermodynamic transfer analyst & strategic system sustainability specialist
    Best Austin Healey In Show twice in 2013 .....All those hrs paid off .

  10. #36
    Join Date
    Jan 2011
    Posts
    1,167
    Quote Originally Posted by HealyNut
    Question 1 - its called stupidity !!!!!!
    Question 2 - what was your first clue !!!!
    I take exception to this kind of answer. Are we here to help others who might not have the experience that we may possess or are we here to somehow dismiss questions by making wisecracks? If it's the latter, it isn't working for me. If one doesn't want to take the time to answer a question...fine...don't.

    Jon, in answer to your question, the freeze occurred because the recovery company removed the liquid and then started vapor recovery. That part is fine. Where they messed up is that when the pressure of the R-134a in the shells got to the freezing point water (about 29 PSIG) they didn't go into the "wait" mode. Once you get to the freezing point, you have to stop all recovery and wait 15-20 minutes to see if the pressure rises. If it does, then it means there is still liquid refrigerant in the shell. There are many places in the shells where refrigerant can "pocket" and in this instance it can be assumed that the sub-cooler tubes were sitting in liquid refrigerant. As the recovery company continued to lower the pressure in the vessels the refrigerant temperature got below freezing and the water that was remaining in the tubes froze.

    I don't think the chiller completely flooded because the original poster said he had drained the water out of the machine. Unfortunately, there is still water laying in the bottom of the tubes and since heat flows from a material at a certain temperature to a material at a lower temperature then ice started to form. Once that got started then the water molecules along the length of that tube started moving toward the cold. Enough so that an ice ball was formed and it expanded until the tube burst. Water still found it's way into the condenser through the burst tubes as the ice melted.

    I hope that helps.

  11. #37
    Join Date
    Mar 2004
    Location
    ottawa canada
    Posts
    2,058
    [QUOTE=KnewYork;12722051]I take exception to this kind of answer. Are we here to help others who might not have the experience that we may possess or are we here to somehow dismiss questions by making wisecracks? If it's the latter, it isn't working for me. If one doesn't want to take the time to answer a question...fine...don't.

    I answered the way I did as it is obvious to me and others that Jon never bothered to take the time to read all of the posts as to the situation .
    Any fool with a PT chart can tell you why it froze it aint rocket science ....look under how to read a PT chart 101 the answers are all there .

    If I remember correctly one of the questions on the Canadian CofQ exam to get your licence in refrigeration goes something like this .

    When removing refrigerant from a high pressure water cooled chiller what MUST you ensure ?? ....
    choose from the following answers
    A- water flow .
    B- wear your rubber boots .
    C- phone a freind and tell him what your doing .
    D- make sure you have lots of coffee its going to be a long job .
    JMHO
    P.s Yes I do have a strange sense of humour that doesnt appeal to everyone
    The 64 roars to life Whoo hoo ...shes a rolling chassis .
    You bend em" I"ll mend em" !!!!!!!
    I"m not a service tech.. I"m a thermodynamic transfer analyst & strategic system sustainability specialist
    Best Austin Healey In Show twice in 2013 .....All those hrs paid off .

  12. #38
    Join Date
    Jan 2008
    Location
    Dallas ,Texas
    Posts
    3,718
    [QUOTE=Healey Nut;12722441]
    Quote Originally Posted by KnewYork View Post
    I take exception to this kind of answer. Are we here to help others who might not have the experience that we may possess or are we here to somehow dismiss questions by making wisecracks? If it's the latter, it isn't working for me. If one doesn't want to take the time to answer a question...fine...don't.

    I answered the way I did as it is obvious to me and others that Jon never bothered to take the time to read all of the posts as to the situation .
    Any fool with a PT chart can tell you why it froze it aint rocket science ....look under how to read a PT chart 101 the answers are all there .

    If I remember correctly one of the questions on the Canadian CofQ exam to get your licence in refrigeration goes something like this .

    When removing refrigerant from a high pressure water cooled chiller what MUST you ensure ?? ....
    choose from the following answers
    A- water flow .
    B- wear your rubber boots .
    C- phone a freind and tell him what your doing .
    D- make sure you have lots of coffee its going to be a long job .
    JMHO
    P.s Yes I do have a strange sense of humour that doesnt appeal to everyone

    You sure use that rocket science phrase a lot I figure your right since I don't think Canada uses any rockets.
    UA 100

    It takes three people to do anything around here. Two do the work, one explains to the crowd of people who showed up when they seen smoke and flames.

  13. #39
    Join Date
    Jan 2011
    Posts
    1,167
    I get it. Rather than say what part of the previous posts didn't you understand (because I had answered the question in post #9) it's easier to flame the guy. What if everybody did that to you when you were starting out? If that's the way you roll, then so be it.

    I do my best to treat everyone the way I want to be treated. I have no problem in pointing out that a question was already answered. I see many posts that say stuff like "Take it easy on me..." IMHO there should be no need for that. If you don't know something, you don't know it and asking a question is the only way to learn. I think we're members here. Treating other members with respect and contributing to their education should be a guiding principle of this forum.

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