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  1. #1
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    UA international (MES) VS Local (BTJ) pension plans

    How the international pension compares to the local? MES get around $3/Hr towards retirement, locally BTJ gets around $8/Hr. somebody told me that international plan gets you more cause there are more workers contributing, locally we are down to $98 per credited year. what would you get out of international?

  2. #2
    The NSMA, Article XII, Line 39, page 7 states: Service Journeyman - Rate of pay, fringes and benefits as specified in the local agreement for Service Journeyman.
    Service Journeyman are sometimes referred to as ServiceFitter Journeyman, Service Tech Journeyman, Mechanical Equipment Service Journeyman, A Card, R1, Service Mechanic Journeyman, etc. Even sometimes Building Trades Journeyman, in error. The UA has two side in HVACR, Building Trades and Service. The NSMA only covers Service - Nationally. Anyone bound by the NSMA performing Building Trades work goes back to the Local agreement as per NSMA, Article VIII, Line.13, page 3. A lot of Locals make it damn near impossible to under the classifications locally most times. If you're working Service either under your Local agreement or the NSMA, there shouldn't be a difference.

  3. #3
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    638B Metel Trade (HVAC Service) NYC pension contribution... is $4.50 per hour worked.some companies pay hours for the watch coverage 10-15hrs times techs rate..union aced that for contributions.....just worked hours on watch OT..mean while they pay 2 as in "TWO" 638A fitters 8hrs minimum(double their rate) for any OT after their exhausting 7 hour day10AM...LUNCH...3PM with $11.10 per hour into the pension
    "when in doubt...jump it out" http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=U1qEZHhJubY

  4. #4
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    in my local we allocate $8.35 per hour worked towards the pension and $2 for the annuity. $31 on the paycheck, retirement age is 55 after 25 years accrued, the payment per year fluctuates with the market. we are now down to $98 from $140. many brothers including my former supervisor retired taking the $3500 a month when the plan was up.
    Nobody seems to know how much an MES would take in pension monies, locally the MES dont get annuity or local pension contributions, they are part of international only.

  5. #5
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    Quote Originally Posted by maxster View Post
    638B Metel Trade (HVAC Service) NYC pension contribution... is $4.50 per hour worked.some companies pay hours for the watch coverage 10-15hrs times techs rate..union aced that for contributions.....just worked hours on watch OT..mean while they pay 2 as in "TWO" 638A fitters 8hrs minimum(double their rate) for any OT after their exhausting 7 hour day10AM...LUNCH...3PM with $11.10 per hour into the pension

    Based on the amount of bud can and joint clips I found in the ceilings on some floors of 7 world, I cannot disagree. Although I'm sure the electricians helped with both to a smaller extent.

  6. #6
    We'll call the UA Local #555 for this example. We'll say Local Union #555 is PipeFitters and HVACR only. A Building Trades RefrigerationFitter Journeyman, an HVACR Service Journeyman and a Mechanical Equipment Service Journeyman should all be at the same scale, benefits and fringes. The "RefrigerationFitter" is under the Local Building Trades agreement, the "HVACR Service Tech" is under the Local HVACR Service agreement and the "MESJ" is under a National agreement of some kind. Am I making sense to any of you?

  7. #7
    Are you using the acronym MES as Mechanical Equipment Service or as in the title Mechanical Equipment Serviceman? MES is a term used in the National agreements and the NSMA. Some Locals also use it as title. My Local is one of the ones messing everything up by using that as a title for the Local Serviceman.

  8. #8
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    Quote Originally Posted by MechanicallyInclined View Post
    Are you using the acronym MES as Mechanical Equipment Service or as in the title Mechanical Equipment Serviceman? MES is a term used in the National agreements and the NSMA. Some Locals also use it as title. My Local is one of the ones messing everything up by using that as a title for the Local Serviceman.

    MES as in the National agreements, locally service techs are BTJ.

    do you know how much do MES get in pension monies per year vested?

  9. #9
    Quote Originally Posted by valdelocc View Post
    MES as in the National agreements, locally service techs are BTJ.
    I don't know your agreement, but Local Service Journeyman shouldn't be classified as Building Trades RefrigerationFitter Journeyman. It's two different things, regardless what your Union card might say! Service Journeymen are usually on-call, drive a company vehicle and are generally unsupervised. Building Trades Journeymen are not on-call, drive their own vehicle to a construction site, work in teams and are supervised by a Foreman. Inquire with your Local, even tho most BAs are full of ish. I had the one in Miami tell me that I had to come off the bench to work for a signatory company, not so in a right-to-work state!

  10. #10
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    we service techs are bundled with plumbers and pipefitters, we are all BTJ.
    Years ago UA international came up with schedule A or MES plan tailored for larger outfits like JCI,Emcor etc. an MES is technically a member of the local union and pays dues to us but their pension plan contributions go to international in Washington DC and I'm trying to decipher how much they'll get per year vested out the international plan, dont believe that a single MES retired yet but somebody must know where the money is going and how much they'll get back, its a simple question and nobody knows the answer.

  11. #11
    So your Local is a combination Local. Combo Locals often refer to Service Journeyman as BTJs, which we're not. Mine's a combo Local as well, so all Journeyman are mirrored in scale wage.
    You're speaking of the Mechanical Equipment Service Serviceman or as some simply call it Mechanical Equipment Serviceman. That isn't a Service Journeyman in no way, shape or form. Serviceman, by the terms in the National agreements and the NSMA, is a designation which is 80% of the Local Service Journeyman. It's a way of not having to pay guys Service Journeyman wages, if they don't work on the big stuff. Servicemen contractually only demand a poor $1.50/hr in pension contributions, this can be to either the National or the Local Pension Funds. Look up the NSMA, all other individual National agreements are based on it.

  12. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by MechanicallyInclined View Post
    So your Local is a combination Local. Combo Locals often refer to Service Journeyman as BTJs, which we're not. Mine's combo Local as well, so all Journeyman are mirrored in scale wage.
    You're speaking of the Mechanical Equipment Service Serviceman or as some simply call it Mechanical Equipment Serviceman. That isn't a Service Journeyman in no way, shape or form. Serviceman, by the terms in the National agreements and the NSMA, is a designation which is 80% of the Local Service Journeyman. It's a way of not having to pay guys Service Journeyman wages, if they don't work on the big stuff. Servicemen contractually only demand a poor $1.50/hr in pension contributions, this can be to either the National or the Local Pension Funds. Look up the NSMA, all other individual National agreements are based on it.

    Here MES are allowed to work in everything but ammonia and centrifugal chillers, their pay scale is somewhere in between 60% to 80% of BTJ, the contribution to UA pension is $3 per hour for all MES.

  13. #13
    Here's the link to the NSMA:
    http://www.mcaa.org/msca/labor/UAMSCA.PDF

    JCI isn't under this agreement, they have their own UA National agreement. In that agreement, which I have a copy of, Servicemen can't work on absorption, centrifugal, screw or ammonia systems, which I referred to as the big stuff. Same is said in the NSMA.
    As for a $3/hr National Pension contribution for Servicemen, it may've gone thru an approved Schedule A. Or maybe the companies are just doubling the contribution.

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