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  1. #40
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    Quote Originally Posted by ga-hvac-tech View Post
    See my post #36 above...
    "Arguing with liberals...it's like playing chess with a pigeon; no matter how good I am at chess, the pigeon is just going to knock over the pieces, crap on the board and strut around like it's victorious." -- Anonymous

  2. #41
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    Quote Originally Posted by jmac00 View Post
    it has been proven (although I can't find the article) that criminals fear only one thing.

    Criminals DO NOT FEAR: Police, Dogs or the average citizen.

    what scares the begezzus out of a criminal is an ARMED citizen
    Well , criminals do not fear incarceration. There are like 19 year old male drivers....invincible, believing their plan (what ever that is) is fool proof and they will never get caught.

    The idea of everyone being armed and therefore law abiding people being safer is just silly. With the rate of jealous husbands, drunk people, angry people in a fender bender, etc, etc, you can easily imagine that tempers will get the best of a lot more people, a lot faster. You might have a hand gun but can you guarantee the guy beside you doesn't panic (as people do all the time....even the cops, but they won't admit it)

    Men...act first....think later.....happens far too often.

  3. #42
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    Every year, people in the United States use guns to defend themselves against
    criminals an estimated 2,500,000 times – more than 6,500 people a day, or once every 13
    seconds.113 Of these instances, 15.6% of the people using firearms defensively stated
    that they "almost certainly" saved their lives by doing so.
    Firearms are used 60 times more often to protect lives than to take lives.


    The number of times per year an American uses a firearm to deter a home invasion
    alone is 498,000.114

    In 83.5% (2,087,500) of these successful gun defenses, the attacker either
    threatened or used force first, proving that guns are very well suited for self-defense

    The rate of defensive
    gun use (DGU) is six times
    that of criminal gun us 115

    Of the 2,500,000 times citizens use guns to defend themselves, 92% merely brandish their gun or fire a warning shot to scare off their attackers.
    Less than 8% of the time does a citizen wound his or her attacker, and in
    less than one in a thousand instances is the attacker
    killed.116

    113 Journal of Criminal Law and Criminology, Fall 1995,
    114 Estimating intruder-related firearm retrievals in U.S. households, 1994. Robin M. Ikeda , Violence and
    Victims, Winter 1997

    115 Crime statistics: Bureau of Justice Statistics - National Crime Victimization Survey (2005). DGU
    statistics: Targeting Guns, Kleck (average of 15 major surveys where DGUs were reported)

    116
    Targeting Guns, Kleck, from the National Self-Defense Survey, 1995


    You should read Dr. John Lotts Book "More Guns-Less Crime" it's real eye-opener
    "Arguing with liberals...it's like playing chess with a pigeon; no matter how good I am at chess, the pigeon is just going to knock over the pieces, crap on the board and strut around like it's victorious." -- Anonymous

  4. #43
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    ooops found this to
    After the implementation of Canada's 1977 gun controls prohibiting handgun
    possession for protection, the “breaking and entering” crime rate rose 25%, surpassing
    the American rate.121
    121 Residential Burglary: A Comparison of the United States, Canada and England and Wales, Pat
    Mayhew , National Institute of Justice., Wash., D.C., 1987
    "Arguing with liberals...it's like playing chess with a pigeon; no matter how good I am at chess, the pigeon is just going to knock over the pieces, crap on the board and strut around like it's victorious." -- Anonymous

  5. #44
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    Then why is it that there are a lot of places you just shouldn't walk in many cities in the US? My wife was at a conference in Denver and she wanted to go for a walk at night, in a good area. The hotel people were horrified and warned her not to go. Denver?

    The same is true of almost city in the US but very few places in Canada and despite 400 million people in Europe (the size of Texas + a bit), there are few places there I would put in the same class (Naples, parts of Glasgow, small parts of London and Paris are ones I can think of).

    So while your stats say something they cannot speak the whole truth. I am still trying to figure out how guns have a positive effect.

  6. #45
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    Quote Originally Posted by SolarMike View Post
    Then why is it that there are a lot of places you just shouldn't walk in many cities in the US? My wife was at a conference in Denver and she wanted to go for a walk at night, in a good area. The hotel people were horrified and warned her not to go. Denver?

    The same is true of almost city in the US but very few places in Canada and despite 400 million people in Europe (the size of Texas + a bit), there are few places there I would put in the same class (Naples, parts of Glasgow, small parts of London and Paris are ones I can think of).

    So while your stats say something they cannot speak the whole truth. I am still trying to figure out how guns have a positive effect.

    really? Lets just talk about Toronto, your telling us that the ENTIRE city of Toronto is completely safe to walk through? Even your Capital has dangerous areas that most folks avoid. EVERY LARGE CITY has it's poor, run down sections.

    However, if you were to forced to walk through an unsavory part of town with known criminal activity, would you rather be armed, or unarmed
    "Arguing with liberals...it's like playing chess with a pigeon; no matter how good I am at chess, the pigeon is just going to knock over the pieces, crap on the board and strut around like it's victorious." -- Anonymous

  7. #46
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    Hey Solar, you said you had some ideas on the issue. Let's hear them.

    I look at all of these numbers and one thing comes to mind. Referencing how UK reports their crimes are we really comparing apples to apples? We, in the US, have news reporters everywhere, most of them liberal. These are the same people that are reporting these crimes. Do you honestly believe the murder rate in Brazil is that low? How many people do drug cartels kill that never get reported?
    Don't worry zombies are looking for brains, you're safe...

  8. #47
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    Fact: Comparing crime rates between America and Britain is fundamentally flawed. In America, a gun crime is recorded as a gun crime. In Britain, a
    crime is only recorded when there is a final disposition (a conviction). All unsolved gun crimes in Britain are not reported as gun crimes, grossly under counting the amount of
    gun crime there.306

    To make matters worse, British law enforcement has been exposed
    for falsifying criminal reports to create falsely lower crime figures, in part to preserve
    tourism.307
    306 Fear in Britain, Gallant, Hills, Kopel, Independence Institute, July 18, 2000.
    307 Crime Figures a Sham, Say Police, Daily Telegraph, April 1, 1996.
    Gun control in Australia is curbing crime
    Fact: Crime has been rising since enacting a sweeping ban on private gun ownership. In the first two years after Australian gun-owners were forced to surrender 640,381 personal
    firearms, government statistics showed a dramatic increase in criminal activity.316 In
    2001-2002, homicides were up another 20%.317
    From the inception of firearm confiscation to March 27, 2000, the numbers are:
    • Firearm-related murders were up 19%
    • Armed robberies were up 69%
    • Home invasions were up 21%

    The sad part is that in the 15 years before the national gun confiscation:
    • Firearm-related homicides dropped nearly 66%
    • Firearm-related deaths fell 50%
    316 Crime and Justice - Crimes Recorded by Police, Australian Bureau of Statistics, 2000.
    317 Report #46: Homicide in Australia, 2001-2002, Australian Institute of Criminology, April 2003.
    "Arguing with liberals...it's like playing chess with a pigeon; no matter how good I am at chess, the pigeon is just going to knock over the pieces, crap on the board and strut around like it's victorious." -- Anonymous

  9. #48
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    Quote Originally Posted by SolarMike View Post
    Well , criminals do not fear incarceration. There are like 19 year old male drivers....invincible, believing their plan (what ever that is) is fool proof and they will never get caught.

    The idea of everyone being armed and therefore law abiding people being safer is just silly. With the rate of jealous husbands, drunk people, angry people in a fender bender, etc, etc, you can easily imagine that tempers will get the best of a lot more people, a lot faster. You might have a hand gun but can you guarantee the guy beside you doesn't panic (as people do all the time....even the cops, but they won't admit it)

    Men...act first....think later.....happens far too often.
    Sorry, but the simple fact of countries WITH guns having lower crime destroys your argument.

    Perhaps it would make more folks grow up and take responsibility for their thoughts and actions... like goofy liberals who think they are above the rules...

    NOW I understand why liberals do not like guns... it would take away their implied advantage over honest working working folks.
    GA-HVAC-Tech

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  10. #49
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    Quote Originally Posted by ControlsInMT View Post
    Hey Solar, you said you had some ideas on the issue. Let's hear them.

    I look at all of these numbers and one thing comes to mind. Referencing how UK reports their crimes are we really comparing apples to apples? We, in the US, have news reporters everywhere, most of them liberal. These are the same people that are reporting these crimes. Do you honestly believe the murder rate in Brazil is that low? How many people do drug cartels kill that never get reported?
    The murder rate and violent crime rate in general in Brazil is quite. Another anecdote: my wife was at a conference in a major coast resort city (cannot remember the name). She looked out of a tent where everyone was learning latin dancing and in the distance she saw a ring of solders surrounding the place to keep it safe. I have Brazilian friends who say it can be very tough there.

    Britain has its share of Rupert murdock owned papers too so there is no shortage of opposite opinions.

  11. #50
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    Quote Originally Posted by jmac00 View Post
    No you can't

    even when presented with FACTS, you ignore them. "figures look made up" PROVE IT

    I did, wheres your proof that any of the facts I posted are NOT TRUE.

    You are the ultimate liberal. facts are meaningless to you, or worse you don't care. You would rather have your government run your life and Lord over you, well thats why your in Canada and we are in the Land of the free
    Sorry, don't have time. As you know from my past posts, I have no problem researching a topic and putting a case together. This one would take too much time and in the end everyone will just ignore it anyway. I have other pressing duties and my health is slowing me down.

    Ultimate liberal? Hah, see how much you actually catch from my posts. Just because I see some merit in the concept, but have stated in the past I do not think the gains are worth the effort, all of the sudden I am enemy #1. And how has the government having my guns registered effected me in any way? How has the government run my life by having an entry in a computer somewhere?

    I think you may be a little full of yourself being from the land of the free. From what I have read about you guys and the government you have I would think I have more freedom here.
    Never argue with a fool, onlookers may not be able to tell the difference. —Mark Twain

  12. #51
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    Quote Originally Posted by ga-hvac-tech View Post
    NOW I understand why liberals do not like guns... it would take away their implied advantage over honest working working folks.
    I like guns. Mind you my Liberal membership might need renewing.
    Never argue with a fool, onlookers may not be able to tell the difference. —Mark Twain

  13. #52
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    Quote Originally Posted by printer2 View Post
    Sorry, don't have time. As you know from my past posts, I have no problem researching a topic and putting a case together. This one would take too much time and in the end everyone will just ignore it anyway. I have other pressing duties and my health is slowing me down.

    Ultimate liberal? Hah, see how much you actually catch from my posts. Just because I see some merit in the concept, but have stated in the past I do not think the gains are worth the effort, all of the sudden I am enemy #1. And how has the government having my guns registered effected me in any way? How has the government run my life by having an entry in a computer somewhere?

    I think you may be a little full of yourself being from the land of the free. From what I have read about you guys and the government you have I would think I have more freedom here.

    BWHAHAHAHAHA
    , Ya right
    "Arguing with liberals...it's like playing chess with a pigeon; no matter how good I am at chess, the pigeon is just going to knock over the pieces, crap on the board and strut around like it's victorious." -- Anonymous

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